Trump's brain getting worse QUICKLY, says psychologist

Speaker 1: Today we're going to talk with Harry Siegel, a clinical

psychologist

and a senior lecturer in the psychology department at Cornell University, as well as the Cornell Department of Psychiatry while he was a medical student. It's great to have you. You know, just to start with something to let the audience know that you're going to give us some of your impressions of President Joe Biden and former President Donald Trump. You're not approaching this from a partisan perspective or looking at the politics of individuals. We will talk about your observations of them specifically regarding speech patterns and other things observable through the media.

So can you talk a little bit about what we can glean from watching videos of people and what would be beyond our ability to grasp? Speaker 4: Absolutely. I think before we even start with that very good question, we should take a step back for a moment and think about American culture. We are a culture that is afraid of death. Now, maybe all human beings are, but our culture really worships youth and ideas of immortality or people who live a long time. The other problem American culture has is that we are fascinated by mental illness, but we don't understand it.

Very good, actually. What we have had in our culture is denying mental illness or holding on to diagnoses and holding on to them very tightly. So, for example, there are people who are on the autism spectrum. But today, if a child loves math and doesn't have great social skills, he is almost automatically labeled as being on the spectrum. You know, there are people with real attention problems. It's hard to pay attention. It's actually something we have to work on. But now, when someone has a hard time concentrating on something, they automatically go A.D.D.. Right.

Without really understanding what that means. And now, when we think about Donald Trump and Joe Biden, we're actually looking at two of the things that are, in some ways, the most vulnerable for Americans to think about objectively. Age and mental illness. And it's captured in this coming campaign. And yes, I may have my own political opinions, but that's not what I'm here to talk about today. It's more about observing behavior. Speaker 1: So let's start with the behaviors on the Trump side. We regularly see what some have described, including Dr. John Gartner's phonemic paraphrases of Donald Trump, simply not being able to say certain words or correctly understand parts of words. and apparently

getting

stuck.

There's more focus on the change in Trump's speech patterns, his gait over time, and a host of other different things. Being wrong about historical elements such as, for example, that Obama is currently the president or that Biden defeated Obama or that Nikki Haley instead of Nancy Pelosi was in charge of Capitol security on January 6. I could go on. We have this category. We also have on the side of Joe Biden's comment that he looks frail and walks in a particular way that indicates fragility. However, we define that he sometimes seems to stay quiet or mumble, and that sometimes he seems confused about what he is trying to say.

I think that sums up 90% of the claims being made about the two individuals. Do you see? Speaker 4: Well, that's a good summary. Let's start with Trump, if we can, because. The complicated thing about Trump is cognitive decline, and you've noticed some really great examples right now. They are intermittent hmhm. I have noticed that you seem to do better if you are interviewed with an easy interviewer during the day. Hmm, a lot of these slip-ups we're seeing happen during his nightly rallies. Yes. And this is something that has been observed in many people who suffer from early stages of dementia.

And that's called sunset. Therefore, if you have an elderly relative in a nursing home, it is always better to go visit them in the afternoon, not at night. In fact, even better late in the morning. So it may be that Trump is having an increasingly difficult time at night. The other thing is that because he is intermittent, it's not hard to see him for 2 or 3 minutes talking what seems normal. And I think he does speak. Normally, in the sense that I'm not talking about people's concerns, like mixing Nancy Pelosi with Nikki Haley. But what I've seen, and I think Dr.

Gardner alluded to this as well, is that the complexity of his language has changed. So when he speaks what appears to be coherent, it's almost as if he's putting together phrases that he repeats over and over again. Now, he's always had a tendency to do this, but if you go back, as I have to, and look at the 2016 interviews, he was clearly sharper. He was more complex than he is now. So, you know, the decline in language complexity and these intermittent slips, which I really fear because they always lead to more. So maybe we don't see it every time he speaks, but if he were elected a year from now, how would he be functioning?

Speaker 1: Yes. And in fact, it seems to me that the frequency, even in the last six months, has changed, where sometimes it would take a few weeks for you to make a mistake about who the president is once or twice, and then sometimes now He will do it 3 or 4 times in a rally weekend. And there is a feeling that it is happening more frequently. Speaker 4: Yes. It's really scary. And look, from a political point of view, his decision not to participate in the debates was very smart politically because he seemed to be above the race. But I think we can assume, right, that he was afraid to debate.

It's a joke? Two hours on stage at night with someone like Chris Christie following him. So, you know, we have some tests ahead of us. There will be a speech at the convention that will be in the evening. Yes. I don't know how he will get out of debating Biden, but I guess he will try. So. Will we then see the increase in these problems? I hope so. I hope people like you and other types of Trump watchers. But we know this media environment. It's very difficult to communicate with people who support him, given where they get their news from.

Speaker 1: Now let's talk a little bit about Joe Biden and what he observed there. Speaker 4: Yes. I. And I, going into the interview, if I were concerned about Joe Biden's cognitive abilities, I would be saying it with as much alarm as I am about Trump. I was very impressed with his State of the Union address and his performance there. First of all, it's night. Secondly, it was long. And lastly, it was amazing. It was fast. His, his, his, harassing Republicans and trapping Marjorie Taylor Greene was truly impressive. And you can't really do that if you have significant cognitive impairment.

And I was very disturbed that morning because, marginally, Marjorie Taylor Greene predicted that she would say something like. I don't know what cocktail they'll put in it. And do you know how the teleprompter will read? He was, I think, very, very intelligent. Speaker 1: Let me talk a little bit about that, because in fact, the next day, even that night, Sean Hannity and other right-wing media outlets were really alluding to stimulants, right? I mean, that's what we're talking about here, some kind of stimulant. Me, I have a passing knowledge of caffeine, right? I mean, I'm not an expert on this, but there are certainly, you know, I know people who have used amphetamines to help with their studies.

Is there any substance that would allow you during the time that Biden gave this speech to cover what could be that kind of decline that is being alleged? Could such a fuss even give him what he had that night? Speaker 4: Now, David, I'm not a psychiatrist. I am a

psychologist

, so I do not prescribe medications. But, of course, I work with patients and I work closely with psychiatrists. Yes. I am not aware of amphetamines being used in patients with dementia. And in fact, a real amphetamine could have disastrous effects on an elderly person. The only thing I can think of is something like Ritalin, which is a psychostimulant that increases attention.

But. But Biden has no attention problems. Speaker 1: I mean, what about taking caffeine pills just to have more energy? I could, I mean, what I want to do is be thorough about the accusation. Speaker 4: I see, I just don't think there's any basis for that. And what would be wrong with a cup of coffee? Before giving an important speech. I, I think, you know, it's like Greene saying she was having some cocktails. You know, it's gotten to the point where people can just make things up and then somehow it repeats itself. Listen, this is a guy who spent all night traveling to Ukraine in a war.

This is someone who went to the cabinet, to the defense cabinet of Israel, and debated with him for two hours. You think? Don't you think word would have spread by now that he was confused, nervous, or unable to form sentences? Hearing something like that from someone? And yet. There are people in Trump's world who are part of his team who are very disturbed by his way of thinking. And David, one thing I just want to remind everyone, one of Trump's great talents, I don't know how he does it. You know, there are interpersonal qualities that we cannot measure as psychologists or humanists.

But he has this ability. And maybe this is related to the genius of marketing, which seems to be his only real genius: he can repeat things over and over again until people stop paying attention. I think we've forgotten how disturbed he was before people started noticing this cognitive decline. I mean, this is someone who in 2016 was saying that he knew more than the generals, that he was an expert on the Bible. You know, when I first saw that, he made me think of Muhammad Ali, who would say I'm the greatest. And in a way he was.

But he made me think that with Trump he was a little like P.T. Barnum, you know, I'm the best. And then I started to realize. He believed it. He believes the lies he tells. So we're talking about a very narcissistic person with crazy psychotic delusions about himself. Adding to that the pathological lying, which is off the scale. I mean, I'm surprised people don't talk about it anymore. But with Trump, it just wears us down until it becomes almost normal. But it really isn't. So I think this cognitive decline is another layer of danger on top of what is already a very erratic and mentally challenged person who should not be anywhere near the White House.

Speaker 1: Can you talk a little bit about some of the physical observations? And if they're simply outside your area of ​​expertise, that's okay. But again, with Joe Biden, the idea of ​​frailty, wearing sneakers to avoid falling, etc., when it comes to Trump, it has been observed that his gait has changed significantly. While he now has a wider stance, his right leg sometimes drags. His waist leans forward when he stands in a way that almost seems to defy gravity. It's very strange when you see it from the side. Is there anything there that is substantial to you?

Speaker 4: Not so. I'm not really a neurologist. But as someone in their 60s, and I know I have friends in their 70s, the body starts to wear down in your 60s. I like to say that I tell my students that being 60 years old is like driving a six-year-old car. You know, you have to do maintenance, and it doesn't go up the hill as fast as it used to. And I think with Biden, someone who is known to exercise daily and he seems a little frail and there's something about him that's not as agile as he was physically or even in the pronunciation of words.

Now he, you know, has stuttered since he was a child. And that's where a lot of that comes from. But I didn't see any diminution in the sharpness of, say, the State of the Union. But but no, I, I, I see the fragility when he walks and that has been happening to Trump for a while. Good. There's that strange thing going down the stairs. We saw it. I think Trump's grandiosity has led him to take great care of himself. And even though he can find doctors who lie about his physical condition. You know, you can't help but see.

So I don't know if he has sciatic nerve problems. Is that why he has that strange hip gait that he has? It doesn't sound like I had a stroke, but again, that's not my experience, but, you see, what I started with was this notion that Americans can't think about mental health in complex ways, and we don't want to think about the aging and death of Americans. Biden looks much older than Trump. But for me. It seems that Trump is faltering in a very dangerous way. Speaker 1: Well, it's interesting that you mention that, because I think if you zoom out a little bit, even if they're just a few years apart, Trump speaks with more confidence, probably as a result of personality characteristics.

You're talking about dying your hair and tanning your face. I mean, it's like he seems like a clown, but also, compared to Biden, sometimes he seems like he projects more strength and a little more vigor. I think if Trump allowed his hair to turn gray and his face didn't die, there might be a different perspective on it to some extent. Speaker 4: Yes, I think you're absolutely right. And you know that hair color and tan, whatever it is, those are signs, right? They indicate that Americans think he is younger. Good? You know, I don't know about you, but I always like it when Biden wears his aviator sunglasses.

He is a. Speaker 1: Similar effect. Speaker 4: It's a similar effect. Exactly. Yes. But it is also more, nowYou know, Biden is a more honest person. He is very clear about who she is. Speaker 1: Out of curiosity, I'd like to see Biden with dyed hair and a fake tan, just to see how much more vigor he projects now, I think. I think you're pointing out a lot of the circumstances that make this look the way it does. And I know there will be people in the audience who may agree or disagree, but I really appreciate your perspective on this.

We've been speaking with Harry Siegel, a clinical psychologist and senior professor of psychology and psychiatry. And I really appreciate your time and your ideas today. Thank you. Speaker 4: It's a pleasure to be with you, David. Thank you so much.