Dr Hilary Explains the Preventive Chemotherapy The Princess of Wales is Receiving

and our health editor Dr. Hillary, along with broadcaster Trisha Godard, who is

receiving

life-prolonging treatment after her breast cancer returned. Trisha, it's great to see you this morning, how are you? I'm fine, other than the fact that we're in the middle of the night here, yeah, sorry, sorry, but thank you very much and a very good reason to keep you up which of course is last Friday, everyone got side-swiped by the Princess of Wales when she gave that emotional and moving speech sitting on the bench explaining the reasons behind the The fact that she has not made public that she has a cancer diagnosis struck me when I heard her that a thousand people in the United Kingdom would receive that news on the same day we saw the Princess of Wales breaking the news and at one point Of course you were one of them, what did it make you think?

Well, I heard the message. I felt for her because I know what it's like to have to talk about something very personal when you feel cornered and I really think Katherine was cornered for a lot of different reasons, she knew people were taking videos of her and she knew the kids would soon be on vacation. and they would be drawn into that madness, um all the conspiracy theories. people discuss it and what do you have um and you know you get to the point where it's not sustainable to do what is really your right which is to keep your private life private so I felt for her my heart went out to her um that's why.

As much as you know some poor people, I told myself that a poor cow has to be a statistic and I was very sorry to see her join the club, but as you say, there are over three million people in the UK who live with cancer, um, I also feel for her because I don't know if you heard it and I really want to highlight this at least at the end of her message. What she said she, not once did she use the term "fighting cancer." Great for most of us. Who would live with this hatred of how to fight cancer?

Biff, it's stupid, there's a headline that says cancer and Prince Char, it's disgusting, it's triggering, we once had stupid language like that with mental health journalists, we must do better, we must. grows up, you talk about the pressures of being in the public eye and dealing with the diagnosis, obviously Kate has retreated into privacy, you actually had to leave the country, weren't you feeling well at the end? That's what I did, yeah. I've talked about it in the past and I've been through um I've been told that things are better now um but uh the intrusion the intrusion of the press was so horrible that my children are still even now they're adults they're still traumatized by being followed by you?

Do you know people who pretend to deliver flowers? Do you know the news of my diagnosis in 2008? I walked through my door after

receiving

my diagnosis when the phone rang from the news desk of a newspaper and we heard that you are dying now. At that time I told myself that my dad was still alive. He hadn't told anyone and they still threatened to publish it in all the newspapers and that's how it went on and I worked every day um and thank God I had my own. production team and thank God for the wonderful people in Norwich, my team in Norwich, who helped me stay safe at work, but my private life went out the window.

You are right in saying that he has changed, he has changed and I don't believe anyone has. I would seriously suggest that the mainstream media in this country violated Kate's privacy in the same way she violated theirs. Those things have changed. It's social media, that's the problem. Listen, we want to talk to you about how to tell kids when you get this diagnosis. Let's watch a little clip about that relevant part of what Kate said on Friday, so how did you say it to your kids, much younger at the time, Trish? I did on my show, I did just this topic and then they reacted the way I thought they might, based on their personalities at the time, if you remember, Kylie Manogue had gone through breast cancer, so I told them. look, you know, uh, look at kylie manogue, you and i told them: just treat me like mommy, don't treat me like a sick person or anything, treat me like mommy.

I have to say that when they were teenagers, one time one of my daughters was giving me such hell. He burst into tears and said, please come back and treat me like a sick person, stop doing these things, you know, but talk to the kids in age-appropriate ways, uh, together, because the kids will know if you take one aside and you tell them, and they also know if you're holding something back um so you know you also choose their time you don't do it before bed um you know you do it after a meal uh just practical things like that you do it all sitting down we we did it sitting uh, at the table, they all do it sitting together, not standing next to someone or whatever, but as a mom you want to protect your children, uh, I think it's good for them to see the emotion, it really is, but You can say that sometimes you know, mommy. she's feeling a little upset Mommy's feeling a little G you know stuff like that I think I just know, just be honest with them in an age-appropriate way Trisha I wonder what you thought of the social media conspiracy theories all the discussion, the trolling uh Online we're asking this morning if it's correct and appropriate for those who are maybe even equally high profile, you know, kind of a Hollywood star like Blake Lively saying, um, she wanted to say sorry for mocking, I think it was Mother.

Photo of the Day got Owen Jones, a political commentator who has a large following on Twitter, to say that he was embarrassed by what he had said. There are other celebrities, Steven Colar. I think he did a sketch in the States that, you know, felt in bad taste. At that time, frankly, we can't talk about the content, whether she should apologize, do you think she realizes? I mean, I just don't read the comments when I don't like the comments. Don't read them. Actually, sometimes I find what appears in the newspapers more annoying when I read that kind of thing.

Indeed, Sarah Vine of the Daily Mail, a very high profile influential columnist has apologized, but is this just freedom of speech? Trisha, you know you're a great broadcaster, you know how important it is for people to be able to speak freely, so is it just freedom of speech? Sometimes it's going to hurt, whether you can endure it or not, you know what? There is a time when we just say we were wrong, I'm sorry, I think it depends on each person if they want to apologize, if they really feel sorry, they should ask for forgiveness. I actually have more respect for people who are vile and when they find out the truth they are still vile because often I still think the same thing but they are just checking the appearance of the Motions.

I agree with you Susanna. I find what's printed in the newspapers and let's not forget the printing that newspapers print, you know, and online newspapers are often the ones they like. the match from the bonfire, they went into the photograph, you know, the Mother's Day photograph with all those little things circled and, what do you mean, that was Manna for heaven for comedians, etc. , so I think sometimes if the press didn't do such The important thing about this, it wouldn't be seen as fair play, but I agree with you that you can't browse social media that the trolls will always be there.

I've always been an advocate for people with mental illness, what we do. We're not talking about people with mental health issues who use social media instead of seeking help. It will always be there. Well, let's bring our two Journals in suits and boots here in the studio. Do you think the British press and the world press, but let's talk about the UK press was wrong to publish those images with the little circles around all the doctored images, no, no, for the very good reason that those Images were taken by four incredibly respected international photography agents, Reuters, uh, and so you have. to explain why they were taken down and they were taken down because I would never have used the word manipulated for the photograph but the headshot, so you have to explain why no, it was legitimate, um, to point out what was presented as a news story.

The photograph had been edited, it was also legitimate to ask questions, it's all a matter of tone and then if you go into the world of conspiracy theories and you get all the made-up things and also the incredibly venomous personal attacks, well, and now According to Daily Telegraph, we know that behind some of the most venomous attacks are three hostile state actors: China, Russia and Iran. Senior government officials fear they are behind the spread of wild conspiracy theories and rumors online. I mean, Russia is very good at this cyberattack. things, yes, they are very good and today actually, but what are they saying and how does it work?

Are we all part of this D stabilization process? The monarchy is for me a central part of British national life and the monarchy has been going through quite a difficult time with the health of the king and the

princess

and some of the abuse has been so appalling that I think they are destabilized and I think have been propagated by rebel states. The problem is homegrown and we already have enough. people who do this and who were born, raised and live in Britain, yes, these states deserve condemnation from their sponsoring units who feed it, feed it and participate in it, but we, yes, it is quite convenient in some ways to point out with the finger at the foreigner instead of saying "look." there are there are neighbors coworkers people we friends you know people we know who but right at this point today Oliver Down, who is the Deputy Prime Minister, is going to make a statement in the comments talking about how the Chinese state has been deliberately targeting the The electoral commission has access to the accounts with personal and absolute details of 40 million million and that will come today and I suspect it will also address this suggestion that are you telling me that the gchq spy center in chelt is doing this in others?

Unfortunately that's how states operate against each other and we always, always watch, they're spying on us, they're surveilling us, we're spying on them, we have surveillance on the sites that carry these things like X and Tik Tok, what used to be X used to be Twitter and everything else um, I mean, in the mainstream media, your media, these media we are completely restricted by lial laws, sland laws, all kinds of considerations that make us think before we speak, basically, and before we write which doesn't exist on social media but should and surely could be, could apply if I had a pound for how many times I wrote about this, you know Cameron, when David Cameron was Prim, was having seminars in number 10 on how to stop Facebook uh and some of these other sites publish bile and they've never done anything about it, they haven't done anything about it in the past, these people would have been mumbling in their rooms or in the corner of a porb uh and they wouldn't be heard now you can use them whether it's X or Instagram or Facebook or any other Tik Tok you can use them to get a much bigger audience now.

I think those publishers like to present themselves as just forms of platforms, but their publishers have a responsibility, but that's where it clashes with free speech and free speech also includes the ability of people to say things that they don't. you agree and you also find, but you are not allowed to defame someone and it is not allowed to commit a Lial against someone, there are laws that prevent it, that surely those laws could be applied on social networks, yes, but those laws must be applied for the person who is the victim of slander and the LI, well, of course it is like that.

It is often said that it is impossible to locate people on social media. I know him because I did a lot of research on this for a novel I wrote about trolling, which is coming out sorry, I'm not promoting the novel, I'm just saying I've done my research, you can track these people, you can track them, you can find them through their IP addresses and you can identify them. and if they have committed a criminal act by slander or Lial, you can pursue them. I dare say that the five of us here and Trisha later could find a handful of people on social media who we are defamed by and could sue.

If we want, they accuse you of lying by doing things you've never done but you don't do them because it's not worth it. It would cost you a lot of money, a lot of effort. What would you get in the end? That's the palace in some way and I thought about publishing that video, which I thought. very very touching and I and I thought why didn't you do it before, maybe she wasn't ready to do it before, you understand again when you are. seeing that there is a woman who talks to her children first, yes, there was a woman, a young woman, a mother until they finished school, thinking about her children, all of us in that position would do that and you think well, you do it to your own rhythm. one in a way but they would have been better if they had done it before there was a void there was a void of information that was also part of the problem that people fill on social networks with their theories of votes theAnother thing I think is that, you know?

It's one thing for high-profile people to be attacked online. Personally I think we can ignore it. Yes, there are filters I can implement on Twitter and Instagram where I just don't see it. Actually as a mother I am more concerned about what teenagers see online, not from personal experience in my family but we interview many people whose children are affected by things online and I think the priority should be don't let kids see horrible things online don't let kids get bullied online don't let kids get trolled online because I think they're a lot more vulnerable than we are and we're not, then feed the kids that they should being so young they should have smartphones before they were 16 when their ex when it was Twitter had moderators and then Elon Musk comes along, uh, who is a pretty person and Rich and him. remove a lot of those filters and you can see that the abuse has increased, the racism has increased, the intolerance has increased now the racists and the bigots were celebrating that they were back, um Trisha, I just want to ask you because I'm very aware We'll keep you up and me and I would like us not to keep you awake any longer than absolutely necessary.

There was a very significant moment at the end of Princess Kate's speech to the camera, which was You are not alone if you are in the same situation as me and her. You're not alone. What do you think other people can take away from that? Is it comforting to someone who is also in the same situation if you are one of the other three million living with cancer? What is the best advice you would give them, Patricia? How supported did you feel by Princess Kate's openness? I think all this about King Charles and Princess Kate and Sarah Ferguson, let's not forget to talk about cancer, the most important message is that cancer is.

No, no, no, you know, you care if you are king, queen, rich or poor, it affects everyone, access to health, surely yes and to diagnosis, and we know it with sadness, and I know that she gave a message of really powerful and affecting magician. you on one level on another level made me feel sad for all the people waiting and I know I have been contacted by people who have had to wait a long time to get a diagnosis and get tested because of the poor burden on the NHS. And what is it about you, um, that are scared, that are waiting for tests that should be done very quickly and sometimes people feel alone, so I hope the message to them is that there are brilliant charities, there are brilliant organisations. and I come?

Going back to I know there was an information gap, but basically royals or whoever you are, my message is that you are going through this, not anyone else, it's you, you talk about it when you're ready and you tell everyone others to take a flying leap. Trisha, I'd like to ask you something that Susanna and I were discussing and wondering just before the show, because we heard overnight that the cancer charities here in the UK have certainly said that there has been an increase since Friday since Kate appeared on camera, um, people coming up asking for advice and explaining that they think they have cancer, what should they do?

There's been a real Spike over the weekend, but we were wondering what was going on in the minds of people who may have been suspicious and scared. Symptoms they might have had in recent months, maybe even in recent years, but seeing that on Friday made them pick up the phone and seek help. Can you explain what that process might have been in their minds? How would they have done it? She's been motivated to do that, she's afraid, first of all, but the other thing is that she's sitting there, she's talking, you know, because there's a lot of fury around cancer.

I mean, cancer treatment now has really come on in leaps and bounds. Bounds I mean, you know, I didn't say anything about my diagnosis, it's been 20 months and I worked with all my colleagues, none of my colleagues at CNN. I sat next to it, covered the coronation, the funeral, everything flew to England, no one. I had an idea and I didn't realize that when I didn't really want to come out, but I got to the situation that I had, um, without realizing it, um, people told me, you know, he told them that you live with cancer. that you can, if you have support, if you have the right medical care, continue to fight cancer, but a lot of people, and I think Richard, this is a really important point.

I know many people feel like they can't tell their workplace that they have any chronic illness, not just cancer, because they're afraid they'll get fired. You know, I was afraid of getting fired because I had read stories about other high-profile people who talked about their illness and left, and neither did you. sensibly or whatever, but emotionally you're afraid that people will stop seeing you for you and start seeing you as, oh, poor thing, you know, oh, you can't work and suddenly you become less human and just a big walker. diagnosis, so I think so, so I hope that people who saw Katherine get the message that you can prevail, but you need the right support, okay, Trish, but just before we end this, we have Dr.

Hillary Here, one of the details that Kate made. What I shared with everyone on Friday was that the treatment she is receiving now is preventative. Can you explain what exactly it means? That's why we often use

chemotherapy

ad adant um when someone has already had surgery or before surgery, for example, if someone had breast cancer. You may use radiotherapy, radiotherapy, radiation, or

chemotherapy

before surgery to kill any cells that have gone beyond where the solid tumor is located. Likewise with abdominal surgery, it is not at all unusual to remove an organ or part of an organ thinking that it is benign and then, always as a routine, that tissue is sent for examination under the microscope and some cancer cells are found that have nothing to do with it. do with the original symptoms, but as an incidental finding we call them incidentalomas, so if you find something like what you say well, you know it obviously hasn't reached the lymph nodes, otherwise secondary surgery would be done, it's still inside the organ that was removed, but in case a cell or two cells or some cells escaped during the surgery into the bloodstream or lymphatic system, right?

You might think that we use chemotherapy as a prior insurance policy to make sure that those cells have been killed by chemotherapy and now we can, in case it's almost like an insurance policy, we commonly use it. but as I say, it's not at all unusual to take out something that's sick and discover that there are a few cancer cells in there that normally aren't going to kill the patient, which will normally be something eminently treatable with chemotherapy for 3 to six months, different medications depending on the organ you're treating, what cells you're treating, what stage it's in, but it's not at all uncommon and presumably

preventive

chemotherapy is supposed to, I guess what you're explaining is that it's less invasive and does that have fewer side effects than regular chemotherapy? big scale?

Yes, the dose would be an important factor, but generally in a young person, when you're talking about a few cells, you're talking about a less invasive way, you know, with fewer side effects the side effects would possibly still include nausea vomiting diarrhea fatigue um vulnerability to frequent infections but that would be monitored closely blood tests would be taken regularly so that she would be in very good hands um it's almost certainly going to be curative uh and you know, I think she could be she, she can rest easy as she reassures her children that everything will be fine, good to hear, Dr.

Hillary, thank you very much, in fact, Andrew Kevin, thank you and of course our thanks to Trisha Godard. Richard mentioned that there has been a rise in interest and VIs in cancer charities such as Cancer Research and Maggies, and we will give details if you are affected, if you are one of the three million people living with cancer or if you are one of the 1000 people who will be diagnosed with cancer today. We will put all that information on our website. Thanks to both. Thanks J.