Criminal Blunders | "48 Hours" Full Episodes

It was the afternoon of August 31, 2012 when Yansy null left work and headed home. He began driving his old, battered Subaru down Interstate 5. At some point he encountered a man in a BMW in which he had no way of knowing he was going to die. 10 minutes Yancy wasn't just a guy who lived in North Seattle he had a girlfriend and a dog he liked to climb mountains he was one of us when you prosecute murder cases while we have the random nature of death is what gets you in the head, he was my best friend for 22 years, he was my contact, he was the guy who kept me grounded, people adored him, the last moments of yansy n's life he stopped at a traffic light, the BMW stopped at the side of Yan yansy's Subaru turned and saw this car and this man next to him saw the gun pointed at his head and saw the bullet that broke the window and shattered his face and then he turned and was shot three more times in the head The witnesses didn't really know what had happened.

They heard the gunshots and then saw the BMW enter oncoming traffic, screeching, leaving tire marks, going so fast that when the car hit a hill, it took a breath and then sped away. speed until it was out of sight when I arrived at the crime scene that day. It was getting dark they had yellow crime scene tape around yansy NES Subaru there was blood outside the driver's door the driver's seat was saturated with blood when the police respond to a murder they are looking for a reason was anyone mad at yansy? Did Yansy have any enemies? there could have been some kind of incident on the road some kind of traffic incident now what do people think? that there is a murderer on the loose there was a murderer on the loose anyone could have been the next target The police didn't know they were looking for a murder student someone who would kill just one murder I am Peter Vanand tonight in 48

hours

murder student this case is about the presence of evil in our world was like a bomb had been dropped none of us are safe none of us could have been yansy null Prosecutors Adrien McCoy and Kristen Richardson say the 2012 murder of yansy null, shot to death in his car while stopped at a red light, put the city of Seattle on edge.

The police did everything they could. They took it very seriously. The police are still there. looking for suspect Yancy null was shot and killed a week ago tonight the shooter is on the loose how big the story was this was a big story Allison Grandy is a reporter for Cairo 7, a CBS News affiliate where we have shootings Seattle, we don't necessarily have a lot of shootings in that area of ​​Seattle at that time of day and that type of victim, what were you listening for? Did Yansy have enemies for talking to his friends? Yansy had no enemies, he was a guy who liked life outdoors. that he enjoyed good wine he loved what he did working as a wine manager at QFC hey, what's your name?

Yan, Yansy null right, 42, was a good-hearted, happy-go-lucky guy, oh yeah, oh yeah, and his friends say the idea Yansy breaking out into a road rage battle is ridiculous, he drove like a Grandma, he was very, very careful, his old friend Brad Kenny, he had a Subaru truck, he wasn't known for his speed, he was an angry man, no, he was impulsive, No, Reckless, he was never verbally abusive, God, no, no. Even up close, he was very careful and conscious in the way he interacted with the people investigators suspect Yansy and his killer crossed paths with around 7:00 p.m. on Interstate 5, just north of Seattle, there may have been some kind of confrontation and Yansy stopped at the intersection without thinking about anything.

Do you think he ever knew what hit him? He was never killed instantly. Thank God, he had no idea what happened. The details of this shooting were curious to say the least, five shots were fired here with remarkable accuracy, it was around this time of day and the shooter killed Yansy Null just a few feet away from other motorists. I hear five quick gunshots like some kind of pop pop pop pop friends Kevin Watts and Angelo Rama were driving together when they heard those five pops behind them the next thing they saw was a Speedway car in oncoming traffic that I passed by and I thought it's a little strange that someone didn't do it.

He waited for a red light, upset because the driver had run the red light. The two friends stepped on the gas and gave it to Chase. We couldn't catch up. How fast did that vehicle go from here from 0 to 60 in like 2 3 seconds? Rama and Watts drove off, abandoning the chase and returning to the scene where a Subaru was still on the sidewalk with its engine running. The friends had the feeling that those pops they had heard were probably gunshots. I saw a lot of blood. I saw where. The bullet holes were there and I realized there was just absolutely nothing I could do.

The shooter's bullets had hit Yansy four times in the head. The case was about to consume detectives Frank Clark and Dana Duffy for the next two years. YY had no

criminal

record. there is no history of being a hothead, we really didn't have much to go on after closely inspecting the crime scene, the detectives realized that Yan's window was rolled down and that the shooter had fired those five shots directly through from the passenger side window, that's very strange to me. the shooter would shoot through the passenger side window of his car at another person. Have you ever heard of something like this?

No, it was strange for us too. That was great evidence. Police now knew that the shooter's car had a broken passenger. side window and there was more even though witness Angelo Rama had only glimpsed the fleeing car for a split second something registered my first guess was an M4 it's a BMW car the one I saw was a convertible it was silver it had the top up or down was down and as I passed by I noticed it had really nice silver wheels armed with its detailed description, the police advised the public to be on the lookout for that BMW model with that broken passenger side window, as for the driver I looked at . the person driving the car because I'm really good with faces Kevin Watts helped a police artist create this remarkably detailed sketch of the shooter.

Within a week, the sketch was made public along with grainy photos of the car. From a nearby security camera we learned that the police in Seattle were looking for a silver BMW and were stopping them all over the city. Yes, the police were desperate to prevent the killer from striking again without knowing if or when he would do so. 2 weeks passed and then a suspect appeared that surprised everyone when they see something like this from someone who has everything under control. He's not crazy, he's just evil. The police are still searching for him. He was driving a silver vehicle that was between 20 and 30 years old.

Did the witnesses tell anyone with information? In the two weeks following Yansyn's brutal execution, cops received hundreds of tips about the dark-haired suspect in a silver sports car. It seemed like everyone in the city of Seattle was driving a BMW Z4 or Z3 at the time. Then, on September 14, a woman calls. In an anonymous tip for the first time, this mystery man has a name and she provides Den Bowman's name and his address, which is less than 10 blocks from the filming location, when we found a photo of him that matched the description of our sketch. His hairstyle matches, yes, and his age description matches, and yet 29-year-old D Bowman seems like the most unlikely potential suspect.

He is a dazzling engineer with an inventive imagination. The golf ball hits the lever of this vise which drives the drill. He spins the Goldberg twitch wire that he created, it swings and hits this water bottle, the bottom of the water bottle is a magnetic plunger, people we've talked to have described him as brilliant, a genius, others have described him titled as a genius, which then fires this flamethrower B Bowman was only 12 years old when he entered university when he was 20 Bowman opened his own business, a boutique engineering company called vague industries that specialized in robotics and then in 2007 , Bowman met Jennifer Palm, a successful dentist at an educational school. seminar they got married a year later I thought they were what I considered a very sophisticated power couple Justin Mata was a friend of The Bowman what were they like as a couple loving each other I think they understood each other but that's how it was Detectives Duffy and Clark had to discover D Bowman and quickly learned that he had owned a BMW.

We wanted to know if he still has that BMW, if he's still at his house and we immediately came up with the plan to go. to set up surveillance on his residence, surveillance, surveillance, a tense week passed with no sign of the BMW coming or going, but then the garage door opens enough for detectives to spot a silver sports car based on that information. We were able to obtain a search warrant before dawn on September 21, 2012, when D and Jennifer were leaving for work. The police swooped in to arrest D. Bowman Den was handcuffed and transported to our office.

We inform you that this is a police facility. everything is recording fine, just to inform them that Bowman has to wait 2

hours

for the detectives to arrive to question him while he kills time. Bowman doesn't seem worried, he enjoys some snacks and a cup of coffee. An exasperated Bowman complains about his precious time. he's wasting himself do you want KN? Yes sir, yes, uh, so I'm a little upset about how long this is taking. Do I need to like it? Sorry, it has to take as long as it takes, okay? He was quite confused about the whole thing, it was a little strange.

Bowman also did not realize that in another room his wife Jennifer had agreed to answer Detectives Clark and Duffy's questions. Have you heard of any murders like the one that happened a few blocks from your house in the last few weeks? I'm not sure you're not sure it's a yes or no question I'm not sure we should call it an not sure interview I'm not sure No I'm sure I'm not sure because your responses were overwhelming, I'm not sure, so your honesty at this time is paramount. I understand and I'm not sure what I can tell you.

Jennifer was unaware that detectives had already inspected Den's BMW and discovered from these marks that the passenger side window had been replaced. She remembers that investigators were sure the killer had shot through that glass. The first thing we did was open the passenger door and you could see shards of glass in the door well. There was also a fresh smell inside the garage. of paint That's because the BMW's silver wheels had been painted black. What's with the smell of paint we smelled there? I'm not sure I know anything about what goes on in your house for almost 4 hours, bleeding all over the damn streets of Seattle.

Well, investigators beat Jennifer up for answers and I'm tired of you sitting there playing Dum while the interview was going on. Investigators entered the Bowman home, which was surprisingly empty. We knew Jennifer was the main breadwinner in that house and we knew it from serving some. According to our search warrants, she probably made $250,000 a year, but when we got to the house she barely had any bedroom furniture, her mattress was thrown on the floor as they went from room to room, investigators discovered a small arsenal of weapons and ammunition, everything except the alleged murder. gun a 9mm Glock When the detectives finally got to Bowman they expected him to answer some questions, but Bowman was smart enough to close the interview if he wants to talk to a lawyer or wants to talk to us first, well, I guess he would.

I would like to speak with a lawyer. Bowman might have finished the detectives but they were far from done with him. They are going to accuse you of a crime of what murder of what of whom murder of a human being. Okay, it was something to see. at least 45 friends of murder victim yansy packed AR reign court this morning to see this man, you look at this man walk in and you see this unassuming person and you say why would you do this? D Bowman has been in custody for 4 months for the murder of Yansy Null and at this hearing Bowman learns that his bail is set at a staggering sum of 10 million dollars, a sum he cannot afford and has shown no signs of. of guilt or even fear.

Brad Kenny is desperate for answers. It fills you with so much anger Well, Bowman seems stoic in court. Prosecutors say the alleged killer has a quirky side that emerges in hundreds of recorded jailhouse phone calls with his wife Jennifer. They had nicknames Den was Bunny and Mrs. Bowman Jennifer was Snuggles Bunny and Snuggles. Bunny and snuggle when they talk to each other they talk and talk about baby bunny bunny how are you I'm fine how's my snuggle cakeI just wrote to you in the email yes, it was very strange, very strange, I miss so many things right now I know I don't have hugs, you don't have a plum curled up next to you, everyone warned us, don't listen to the jail calls, don't listen to the jail calls, you'll want to throw up, I'm just going to say love love Meanwhile, back among adult detectives Frank Clark and Dana Duffy who were methodically building their murder case against Bowman, they discovered that for years the genius expert in technology had been downloading these books, articles and videos to his computer on the topic of death. and the murder is not that he only had a little, he had tons and then there was Bowman's obsession with this man, Bond, James Bond, and on Bowman's computer videos it showed that it was D Bowman driving a car at high speed around an obstacle.

Of course, and here he is shooting in shooting demonstrations in which he demonstrated that he was an expert shooter with both hands. I don't think Den Bowman woke up that morning thinking that today is the day I'm going to shoot someone. This situation arose in some way. but once he did it, all of his self-training and research started to work. We're going to talk about shooting through glass and one of Bowman's videos made by a firearms expert really surprised the police. I have reached a situation where I feel threatened by someone. to the passenger side was a play on Yan's murder, of course, I recognize that I lower, grab, parallel cross, extend, touch, pressIf you want to know how to shoot someone in traffic from your luxury sports car, this was a tremendously useful video .

He didn't even have to roll down the window. Prosecutors came to believe that Bowman wanted to kill someone just for the thrill of it. Because? Would he commit this murder in broad daylight, where there are witnesses around who could see his car, maybe see him, what's the fun in it if there is no challenge, if there are no witnesses, if there is no need to pull away to speed up and fly through the streets? neighborhood streets? and hiding his car in his garage, that was fun for him shortly after the murder, police say Bowman went to his computer where he had his vast library of books related to murders, including arrest, try yourself, how to cover up a murder , how to dispose of a gun how to dispose of gunshot residue and police say Bowman now had an accomplice Jennifer Bowman aka snuggle do you understand how serious this is right now?

Jennifer Jennifer seemed very, very nervous to me, tell us the truth, bad eye contact. I could see that she was shaking tell me the truth right now I have told you the truth Jennifer never asked for a lawyer and handed over her purse where the police found receipts that helped in the investigation Do any of you believe that Jennifer had prior knowledge of this attack ? I don't think she had any prior knowledge, but I think at some point D told her what happened. She had to know something because the next day she went to Portland with him.

Why did you go to Portland? It was just a little date trip. road trip a trip that led to this auto glass store where police say Bowman began to cover up his crime his wife wife at his side she was very distant didn't say much repairman Jeff Shields just looked like he needed a window right away Bowman He told Shields that a thief had broken the window of the BMW while he and Jennifer were eating in Portland. What time of day did the window break? We found it in the afternoon, about what time it was just after lunch, but detectives say the restaurant receipt from Jennifer's purse told a different story.

They were never there for lunch. They went there at dinner time. 3 weeks later, the Bowmans visited a tire store in North Seattle. Manager Doug Hasket says Bowman used the name Peter while his wife avoided eye contact. a blonde and she just looked at the ground, she didn't really talk to anyone. Bowman bought four cheaper tires to replace the expensive BMW tires, why would she buy new tires? Because during our investigation, the media published that there were tire tracks left. at the scene why he got new tires. I'm not sure I was in the place where the others burned out.

I'm not sure what would happen if we gave you a polygraph test today, you'd fail like a sack of potatoes. I mean, I can tell your lion just by looking at you, police say they later found the set of expensive, practically new BMW tires inside Bowman's shop at Vague Industries. The murder weapon was never recovered, but prosecutors felt they had enough evidence to try D Bowman in the first degree. murder, please stand up and soon he would take the stand and tell a story that he had kept secret for a long time if he didn't do something right then he was going to die Frank, what do we have here?

Peter, we're at the Seattle evidence warehouse. Police Department two vehicles side by side once again as they were that summer afternoon in August 2012 these are Den Bowman's BMW Z four roadsters and yansy n's super rof what brought them together the outcome is unclear of their meeting is not what goes through your mind when you look inside this car sadness Devastation for yansy this family lost a loving member the murder is very ugly it is never pretty and now, on November 19, 2014, 2 years after yansy null was savagely shot to death, his alleged killer enters the courtroom to face the charge of first degree murder, please stand up, the court is in session at the time of the trial he looked like he was 13, right?

Do you want to talk to us first, well I guess I'd like to talk to a lawyer and in his place is what appears to be an impeccable college student, this guy doesn't look like a murderer and that's not at all unusual for defendants to do. They change their appearance to appeal to the jury. Bowman's mother, originally from Vietnam, and his father, a Boeing engineer, are in court every day to support his only child, but his wife Jennifer, his wife, doesn't show up. come nowhere. We are ready to start opening. In his statements, prosecutor Adrien McCoy tells the jury that the motive for the murder was not greed or jealousy, this was the fulfillment of a quest, but something much more nefarious: a quest to find out what it would be like to kill someone.

McCoy tries to take the jury inside Bowman's mind. By showing these training videos recovered from his computer, we are going to talk about shooting through glass from videos to thousands of pages of research into the murder of another person. Prosecutors paint a portrait of a premeditated murder. It was the equivalent of the Library of Congress. death, have you ever seen something like this before in your career, not even close why were all those things on his computer, he accumulated information, he had a lot of things on his computer that are totally strange, having possession of them means nothing, the Mr.

Bowman was actually trying to create a library of basically everything that Bowman's lawyer, prominent defense attorney John Henry Brown, whose former clients include serial killer Ted Bundy, says there is no evidence that Bowman read or saw any of these materials; there were thousands, if not hundreds, of thousands of pages about engineering techniques, but there were also all these strange things that prosecutors used to make up his motive while the defense presents their case. Brown takes a big risk, you swear, our first ophal puts D Bowman on the stand. I felt like it was just this crazy bad dream and like I was being run like I was running from a monster and Brown knows he's risking everything for Bowman's ability to sway jurors and convince them that he was a victim of the fury in the road if I didn't do something at that moment.

He was going to die Bowman explains that it all started when he accidentally cut Yansy null on the interstate, there was a kind of torrent of swear words. I think the line that caught my attention was um, you better learn to deal with that fantasy. car boy or are you going to get up Bowman says that Yansy followed him closely from the interstate to this light where they both stopped and that's when I received r yeah, that Wham Bowman says it was a bottle of wine thrown by Yansy that he hit him on the head, he is an absolute liar, that is sacrilege to the yans, I would never throw or waste wine on someone like that.

I remember seeing his eyes very bulging and how he was while he was screaming I would describe it as violent hate what would you do I had only seen it in the movies did you think it was possibly G yes yes he was scared fearing for his life Bowman says he pulled out his 9mm Glock , he aimed at yansy and shot you shot him intentionally yes, it was your The intention to kill him is not road rage, by definition it is not premeditation and Bowman says he shot Yans in self defense. I remember opening my eyes and seeing that he had the gun in his hand and I just dropped it and hit the gas, even though Bowman claims.

He was the victim, he didn't call the police, he panicked. Bowman says he collected evidence from his car, including the wine bottle and the gun, and threw it all in the trash, discarding evidence that would support his own story. This is a guy who has a genius level. IQ, well, but yes, but many geniuses I know don't have much common sense. You threw away the evidence you could show the police to prove you weren't a

criminal

. I didn't think they would believe me. But prosecutor Christen Richardson doesn't believe a word of Bowman's story. Don't you think most husbands would go home to their wives and say, "My God, they almost killed me?" I figured the more I talked, the worse it was going to be.

Go for it, you're an expert, what was your goal? There was no harm involved in this, well, you did a pretty good job, didn't you? Because you hit him four times on the head, including the temple, that surprised me. For 3 days, Richardson criticizes Bowman, he lied to his parents, he lied to his wife, right, it's a question, but he never loses his composure. Mr. Bowman, he has no problem answering yes or no to Mr. Brown. Is there something wrong with the way I speak? ask you questions no, that seemed like a strange question to me, well, well, that's the first time no, I think you've given it to me, so I guess the point has already been made.

I have nothing else, thank you. You can retire when D Bowman retires. The question is. Did he convince the jury that he killed Yansy? null to save his life. I think Jim deeply believed that the jury would see self-defense as justifiable homicide or just emotion, is he guilty of first degree murder? Yes, I will never forget Yansy every time. Every time he walks this trail, Brad Kenny thinks about his friend Yansy N. I really miss him, it will never end and I will always miss him. I mean, it's good to be here, but it's really hard, get up after 3 weeks and 31 witnesses.

D Bowman's murder trial is coming to an end, he hasn't shown an ounce of remorse, he's just completely stoic. I think we are ready for the idiots of December 9, 2014, more than 2 years after the murder of yansy n and, coincidentally, the 32nd birthday of the Den Bowman jurors. starting deliberations it's the worst part of the job waiting for a verdict but it's your nature to always doubt yourself one person who doesn't doubt himself is Den Bowman as he confides in his wife Jennifer in recorded jailhouse phone calls we should punish the jury If they take longer than tomorrow Jennifer has not appeared a single day at Bowman's trial but she remains in constant contact and has no doubt of his innocence this is obvious they need to acquit as they could consider anything else you have to be completely irrational to Yes believe something else, have a seat please, on the third day, the jury returns.

I understand that the jury has reached the verdict. I'll read the verdict form. We, the jury, find defendant Thomas Ben Bowman guilty of the crime of murder in the first degree, as charged by the jury. he didn't buy Den Bowman's, he killed n, but he says the murder required premeditation. It's a total surprise for Bowman, but a sweet relief for Yan's girlfriend and her followers. The verdict is read. What was that moment like for Den? Well, he was so emotionally upset that he said: Me. I can't believe it I can't believe it I can't believe it 3 weeks later, a very different looking D Bowman returns to court to sentence Mr.

Bowman made some bad decisions, the once arrogant genius Genius is gone as reality is The verdict of Guilt sinks in and his parents step forward to beg the judge for mercy. I know this is my fault. Defense Attorney Brown must finish reading his statement. Our son's actions are our fault. My husband and I provided and allowed him to learn how to use a gun. -protection Brown, an experienced trial attorney, can't help but show emotion when Den's mother asks the judge to send her to prison instead of her only son. I ask that you allow me to substitute any punishment by placing myself in the role of Den.

It was heartbreaking. He looks at his mother at the sentencing so that she can offer herself in her place to apply the punishment that isCaitlyn's bedroom, in an area she had told them about when they were still dating. She was talking about going to Fry Street and meeting new people. Bryant went to the Fry Street tavern that night. around 7:00 p.m. An hour later, Jackie Vandergriff came in, asked about a job, and ended up chatting with the waiter and Charles Bryant. About 45 minutes later, Jackie posted a message on her Twitter. I'm glad I decided to get off Tinder and walk to a bar.

Jackie's. friend Jackie Tan Jackie was a very social person every time she went out she made friends with everyone and she wasn't even flirty it was nothing you know she was talking to the waiter talking to other people around 9:00 Jackie he went away. With Bryant and the bartender, she and Bryant went to another nearby bar and started talking to a group of women. At 9:45 it was raining and everyone was going out. Jackie left with Charles Bryant. I feel like she felt comfortable enough with him that night. because she had been dating him for so long that she was like, "hey, well, whatever he's going to drop me off, it's not that far away and I'll be fine once in his car." Bryant stopped at a convenience store, this was the last time.

Jackie Vander Griff was seen alive the day after she was found dead. There was a new post on her Twitter. I never knew I could feel like this. It was really strange. The police suspected it was a message from her killer and knew they had to act quickly. In identifying the man Jackie had been with, they had some luck when they tracked down the women Jackie met that night. One of her friends who was with her had received a business card from this person because he was a fitness instructor now that the Grapevine police had Charles.

They found out Bryant's name about that restraining order, so that made him a good suspect in my eyes. Grapevine police called Captain Pul, who was in the middle of a road race. The first thing he told me was that Charles Bryant was the prime suspect for him and Jackie. murder and immediately sat on a park bench in the middle of the race, which surprised me. Bryant emerged as a strong suspect, but Grapevine police had no physical evidence connecting him to Jackie's death, so for now Bryant was free and Pulk was worried. As for what I could do next, I called Caitlyn and just asked her where are you?

I asked him if this has to do with the murder that happened in Grapevine and he said, "I can't tell you that, Caitlyn, but are you?" you're safe right now and what did you say? I said, I think so, she could have been wrong in the days after Jackie was murdered. Charles Bryan sent Katlin several emails, including this photo, writing on it the first kiss under this tree. Once upon a time that photo was taken. at Grapevine Lake, I could have taken that photo that same day Jackie was killed, it was September 2016 and Caitlyn Mathys Charles Bryant's ex-girlfriend was very concerned that she might have been involved in the brutal murder at Grapevine Lake just a few days before .

He was waiting for more news. go out because at that point he hadn't even been arrested yet, were you worried that he was going to come after you? I thought that was exactly what I was going to do. The emails and photo Bryant had recently sent to Caitlyn were proof that he was still thinking about her in the days after Jackie's death, but they were also proof of something else: Charles was prohibited from contacting her in any way. manner and then, if he did so, he would have been violating that order. Captain Poke thought they could use those violations to help the vine police, we didn't have enough to do. an arrest yet, so I told the detective we can sign a warrant on some evidence we just received and at least you know, get him off the street, your name is Charles, your name is Dean Charles, okay, Charles Bryant was arrested on September 18 for violating Caitlyn's law.

Graef Find Restraining Order Detectives hoped to soon find more evidence connecting him to Jackie's death. He was brought to the Gravine Police Department for an interview and is immediately beginning to distance himself from having almost any interaction with Jackie. Recognize who she is. bar and at the same time we began serving a search warrant for her residence, what can you tell me about her? That's all. I guess it had been 4 days since Jackie's body was found, enough time to get rid of any possible evidence, but Captain Luna at Grapevine Police says they found a lot of things at Bryant's house, including a large style knife. military.

You know, her purse was found there too. Briant had no way to answer for any of it, including two more items that police found while he was in custody. Video of him. buying a shovel the night Jackie disappeared and a missing cat pool in her backyard that matched the one where Jackie's body was found. We have a video of you with this girl. In case I'm at the bar, you're walking through Walmart at 4:00. in the morning buying a shovel, she was found dead in a pool coming from her backyard, she even got to the point at the end of her interview with our detective where she said well, I must have done it.

I don't remember doing anything. He points out to me that it's like I should have done it as an open and shut case that isn't even closed, although there was overwhelming evidence that Bryant had disposed of Jackie's body, there was still no evidence confirming how Jackie had died or that Bryant He had killed her and that's it. when they approached me and asked if I could spend some time with him and interview him and see what I could get because you have experience dealing with this type of personality, this is my calling, Jim. Holland is the lead member of an elite team of the Texas Rangers, a select division of the Texas State Police.

He specializes in interviewing some of the country's most prolific killers and analyzing their thoughts. Hey, how do you do it. That's right, and Char Bryant seemed to fit the bill. Jackie's. The body had been dismembered before being set on fire, how do you begin to understand a mind that would do that? A lot of these people really want to tell you, they want to tell someone at first. Bryant stood by his claim that he did not remember. one thing, yeah, it's crazy CU, I don't really remember, the idea that he doesn't remember doing it, oh no, it's absolute nonsense, so you knew Charles Bryant remembered exactly what had happened, oh yeah, absolutely , and your job was just to get that out. "About him, right, you know you're not a violent guy, you haven't really been in trouble.

Holland says his strategy was to try to befriend Bryant and get him to talk, you know, obviously it worked, I mean, you." . stud, right, you don't want him to look at you like an officer of the law, you want him to think of you as a friend, a compadre, a drinking buddy, you know, in a way you go back to what two kids would talk about in high school. school locker room, you know about the girl they kissed on Friday night, you don't have a problem with girls, it just blows my mind and Holland suggested possible scenarios to see if Bryant would take control from there, okay then something happens, bam, there's a snap and we have to figure out what that is and maybe you know she got angry, maybe she's giving you all the signs and then she interrupts you.

I mean, there could be all kinds of different things going on here, right? I mean girls, right? You know girls, you know while we are in the interview there I am observing him. I'm um, I guess in a way a human lie detector. I'm um, I'm reading him and I'm throwing things at him that I know the answer to and I'm looking for answers from him, whether they're true or false under the guise of helping Bryant remember what happened. Holland suggested they do a memory exercise. What we are going to do are these mental exercises that they mean. let's go back in time Bryant, who first claimed he didn't know who Jackie was, then seemed to remember her, said he could see her walking into the bar, she was looking for a job, that was hers and offering her a ride.

It makes sense that she was raining. I'll probably go home. There's a ton of stuff in this I can tell you over pizza while Holland was trying to convince Bryant to confess that he investigated a possible motive, but what does everyone want to know? Yes because. Who is the only one who can tell us that? You know, Holland finally moved on to Chase and asked if what happened with Jackie was really about Caitlyn. Was there a time when you imagined her as that girlfriend who hurt you or did something like that? comes into play the level of nonsense that came out of her mouth at different points about that was just amazing do you think Charles Bryant looks around the bar and sees Jacqueline Vandergriff oh she looks like Caitlyn?

I wouldn't be surprised if he really rocked it. At first you know he saw her from behind and he thought man, you know my ex is here, I think in his mind that whole night I think that's what he imagined after the murder, right after the murder, he took Jacky's phone and he used it to add me. Facebook When Texas Ranger Jim Holland was brought in to question Charles Bryant, the nature of the crime made him wonder if Bryant's brain was wired like that of the serial killers he had encountered, how the mind is different. a serial killer like a common criminal, you know?

In general, people like this tend to be sociopaths or have psychopathic mindsets and it's just a different game. A psychopath would be someone who is basically born with a scar on their brain and a sociopathic mentality is something that society has brought about. Something happened to them that changed her Psyche: something perhaps had happened in her childhood. Christy Dixon glimpsed Charles Bryant's psyche firsthand. She met him on a dating app the year before Jackie Vander Griff died. He seemed quite quiet and reserved, almost as if he was shy, the second or third time. We were dating um I noticed he was getting attached pretty quickly and I just wasn't there it was very casual to me after she broke up he continued to pursue her Bryant even told her he loved her Chrisy says he never they had done it.

I even shared a kiss, it was too much, too soon, too fast. I work with abused children and that for me kind of stood out. Christe says that's when she asked Brian about his childhood. He told her that he had been sexually abused. A claim that 48 hours could. I did not independently verify this. I remember thinking that makes sense. I'm not a psychologist or anything, but his behavior seemed to me like maybe an abused child or someone who just needs that extra love that most people probably aren't looking for yet, Christe. I thought he was harmless and I stayed in touch I thought he was just a good guy and I felt sorry for him I'm not an angry guy I'm not aggressive like a stranger Holland continued his interrogation he wanted to see if Bryant would answer the key question how Jackie Vander Griff died his autopsy didn't provide many answers there's a lot we didn't know we didn't know where it happened we didn't know exactly how it was broken and that was my goal Holland wondered if the crime had a sexual element but initially Bryant denied that anything sexual had happened.

I remember having sex, you don't, nor that the people who had sex after three more hours of interrogation Bryant said they did have sex, kinky sex according to Bryant, Jackie wanted to be. choked with an oversized zip tie that just happened to be in her car, she didn't fight you in any way when you put it into the consensual sexual aspect it was one of those things that no, I felt strongly that he was lying and Bryant also stated that neither he Neither Jackie had intentionally tightened the zip tie, so you think he just tightened it on his own, basically, that's like he had a problem with something, so what happened?

Try to remember that she doesn't respond. Are you thinking this is a complete and total lie? Yes, it is totally made up. Is he a murderer? Yes, absolutely, when you deal with these people, it's so rare that you sit down with them and they tell you from A to Z, this is what happened and they're always going to leave out things that make them look really bad in other words. There's an excuse I'm not a bad person I didn't mean for this to happen It was an accident Although Bryant was evasive about how Jackie died while Holland guided him through the memory exercise Bryant went into gruesome detail about how he disposed of her body.

K, what do you see in the cool garbage bags right now? Tell me exactly what you see happening after that comes true and what happens next. In the fire, the fire, why did you burn the body, even if he couldn't admit the murder? Bryant seemed to vacillate between denial and acceptance, at one point admitting that the evidence showed he had to have done it. I can't fight it, it's obviously me. After an intense 6-hour interrogation and with evidence piling up, Charles Bryant was finally charged with the murder of Jackie Vander Griff. Christy Dixon couldn'tbelieve the news that night.

I was actually afraid to go to sleep. I had nightmares. He had never threatened me before, but just the fact that someone he felt like he knew had potentially murdered someone terrified me by Caitlyn Mathis, his worst fears were confirmed and when he tried to learn more about the woman Bryant killed, he made a Shocking discovery on Facebook. I looked up Jackie Vandergriff and I. I realized, Oh my God, I'm already friends with her. Caitlyn says the digital friendship began after Jackie died. You received a friend request from Jackie Vander. Yes, Caitlyn believes the Facebook friend request could only have come from one person, Charles Bryant.

That really sounds diabolical. It was Brian pleaded not guilty to Jackie's murder his defense was the same story he told Ranger Holland these two young men met they consumed a lot of alcohol our position is that they had sex perverted sex maybe and she died The defense attorney appointed by the court of Brian, Glennis McGinty says that Jackie Vander Griff's death was a tragic accident, are you telling me that there is no evidence that Charles Bryant killed Jackie Vander, there is no direct evidence? Prosecutors Lucas Allen and Anna Hernandez believed the evidence they had would be enough, but they also knew that most jurors want to motivate and were not sure they could tell the jury why they thought Jackie was the target.

You must ask yourself what makes this person do something like this. In their minds, there is no doubt that Jackie Vandagriff's murder is connected. to Caitlyn Matthysse's bullying yeah, I think we think she definitely could have been victim number one and Caitlyn was victim number two to help prove this. Prosecutors hoped the judge would allow Caitlyn to testify against her ex-boyfriend turned stalker. open hearing I felt bad, what do you think was the most revealing part of Charles Bryant's interview? Check out the evidence in the case against Bryant on Facebook within 48 hours. Jackie was the most special person I know.

I will never meet someone like her. Again in April 2018, a year and a half after Jackie Vander Griff's untimely death, Charles Bryant was on trial for her murder, her friend Jackie Tan couldn't bring herself to be there. I wanted to go, but I'll be honest, I couldn't. Look at it, Charles Bryant would have to answer for a long list of items the prosecution had compiled, including that giant zip tie the shov bought the night Jackie died and that big knife the police believe he used to cut up her body, all founded your house this is something you pray every night so it doesn't happen to your child when they go to school.

Investigators also found a stun gun in her car with Jackie's DNA on it, but it appears Jackie was spared at least one attack by prosecutors Anna Hernandez and Lucas Allen. They say the medical examiner was able to perform tests on Jackie's remains and found no evidence of sexual assault. There was no evidence to support that they had any type of sexual encounter. Prosecutors say this undermines Bryant's story that it was kinky sex gone wrong. His lawyer Glennis McGinty. How could they have had sex if there is no evidence, there is no evidence to the point that no sperm was found on her?

That doesn't mean they didn't have some kind of consensual sexual encounter. She likes that prosecutors chose not to conduct that questioning. tape for the jury, which meant that Bryant would have to take the stand if he wanted the jurors to hear his side of the events that he chose not to hear, shouldn't he explain to the jury why he is not to blame for her death and then that comes flying? against our constitutional rights, but the defense knows it has an uphill battle to convince the jury that Brian is not guilty of murder while admitting that he disposed of Jackie's body, if he says it was just an accident, does he?

Why didn't you ask for help? he drunkenly asks, he panicked and his mind didn't process all of that to make a rational decision that you or I would have made, calling the police, but Bryant went further than just dismissing Jackie's body much further and the prosecutors they wanted the jury to hear their theory. A big part of that story was harassment, but before the jury could hear from Caitlyn, the judge would have to decide whether or not to allow this evidence. Her boyfriend, the local television cameras were there when, without the jury foreman , Caitlyn took the stand and confronted her ex.

She disgusted me just by seeing her face. Did she look at you? Did they meet her eyes? At one point we had to do it when they made me describe to Corte what she was wearing and she just had a smile on her face. There is nothing that can prepare you for that. No, the moment I walked out those doors I started playing. In the end, the judge ruled against Caitlyn being able to tell her story. for the jury it was definitely a real blow to us that was the right decision because he had not been convicted of anything with Caitlyn when the jury came out to deliberate the defense was hopeful I don't think they could prove that he murdered her I don't think they will prove that, but would the jury agree that they were gone for just over 2 hours and even without hearing Caitlyn's story?

We, the jury, find the defendant Charles de Bryant Jr. guilty of the crime of murder. Charles Bryant was found guilty. of the murder and dismemberment of Jackie Vander Griff to his way of thinking, justice was served, yes, I knew she was there and I thanked him because prosecutors had no evidence that Bryant committed another crime at the same time as Jackie's murder , such as rape or kidnapping, was not eligible. For the death penalty he was sentenced to life in prison, as terrible as it is, but I wanted the death penalty under Texas law. Brian could be eligible for parole after 30 years.

Caitlyn says that she feels like he's still looking over her shoulder and that she always will be. I'm afraid that when she comes out she will come looking for me and do something to me or someone I love. That's my biggest fear since this happened. Caitlyn and her mother have been thinking about Jackie and her family this entire time. I wanted to reach out to them but I didn't know how they were feeling almost 2 years after Jackie died they finally met their grandmother bless her heart she immediately walked up to us and Caitlyn and hugged her and said I've been so worried about you these last two years wow Karen, why is this the part that gets you?

She took her little girl and the pain I saw in her eyes. She could feel her pain and yet Grandma was telling Caitlyn that she was worried about Caitlyn, yes, you sound very special people. Caitlyn says she struggled with the fact that she survived and Jackie didn't. It could have been you so easily and some days I wish it was. It's just the guilt that eats me up sometimes. I would have easily taken her place if given the chance Jackie Vander's family has awarded a health and wellness internship at Texas Woman's University in her name a young mother murdered there was only one suspect in this case who else would want this sweet young woman was murdered decades later the main suspect was arrested but a witness changes everything I kept the secret for 30 years 48 hours Saturday on 109 Central on CBS for anyone who knows Carmen there is just a magic about her she was going through this transition ending her marriage there was no doubt that we were destined to spend the rest of our lives together.

We hadn't heard from her that day. I left a couple of messages. Hey, honey, how are you? I'm really worried. I'm very worried. I'm getting those couple of messages. Please call me just for this. You know you're fine. I panicked, I just knew something wasn't right and I finally called the police, there was a big fight, a big fight had broken out in that room, furniture was overturned, potted plants were knocked over, uh, there was blood all over it. everywhere, the walls of the ceiling. The carpet was stained with blood everywhere. I think it was pretty clear that a murder had occurred.

I knew since I had children that the worst thing that could happen to me would be to lose a child and in this case her. He was simply ripped from our lives. Someone had to have a reason for this to happen. I only know one person who had something to get Tom, my ex-son-in-law, an English teacher, but he couldn't do that. I didn't have the guts. I told Mr. Murray that his ex-wife Carmen had died and that we needed to talk to him about it. In me you not only have a likely suspect but a convenient one.

Why didn't you arrest him then and there we couldn't prove that he did it if this scenario falls apart you're fine back to normal War we didn't have much physical evidence we never found bloody clothes we never found a murder weapon we were going to have a difficult road ahead i started thinking about all the things i did wrong i didn't spend enough time with her i didn't call her enough the fact that someone took her life was important to me that there would be some justice this crime will be solved i will spend every damn penny I have in mind to murder you don't know many people in your life like my daughter so I worry about everyone and almost everything when they talk about Carmen, the oldest of their four daughters, that's K.

Danny and Judy Ross never know They are speechless, it's happy, it's fun to be around, it warms the room, it's sunlight. Judy even put together a list of words that come to mind when she thinks of kmen brilliant empathetic thoughtful spiritual patient political loving peaceful charming silly playful Brave

full

of life daughter of our youth and Carmen's 1985 wedding to her beloved Tom Murray was one one of the best days Dany and Judy ever had beautiful absolutely beautiful they both wrote their wedding vows I stood there and cried through the whole thing was your husband the only one who cried that day no, there were others, that was an absolutely happy day Carmen met to Tom at Ohio State University, but it wasn't a typical college romance, she was a Junior, he was her English teacher.

I hesitated because I didn't know why a professor would be interested in one of his students, if he is married and how do you know that. Mhm, these are questions I've heard parents ask in the past. Well, sure. Absolutely sure, absolutely Tom Murray was only 27 years old, he was a first teacher and once she met him, Judy was impressed. It was very easy to talk to with very good manners. You know everything. Did you absolutely like it? Did you absolutely love him? Carmen's three little sisters, Samantha Heather. and April, who never had a brother, were thrilled to finally have a brother-in-law, it was family, he was, we went out, had dinner on Thanksgiving and Christmas, we laughed and told stories, right after they got married, they all came over Sundays. after church and we had dinner together on Sunday he attended church with us he didn't drink excessively he didn't smoke he exercised this is something the two of us created together he was polite all the time with everyone two out of three The children were snuggled up each comfortably in his bed.

Heather had fallen asleep on the stairs again and April had to be gagged, tied up and carried to her room and I said, Tom, you're too good to be true in 1988, after Carmen graduated from college. right. The couple moved to Manhattan, Kansas, where Tom accepted a job teaching Linguistics at Kansas State University. His colleague Lyman Baker says Murray made an immediate impression. He was a very nice guy. He had a very sharp mind. people's impression that they really appreciated having a man like that to work with and even though his Linguistics specialty can be a little tedious, Tom Murray managed to make it almost exciting, he was a great teacher, there seemed to be something very gentle and at the same time time, very endearing and affectionate, he never came with notes or anything, he would just sit at the desk like us and give his lesson and I thought it was quite nice, admirable because he knew everything about the subject, but while Tom Murray was on FastTrack academic, Struggling to find her place in the world, Carmen left the law after a few years and instead hoped to change people's lives in less confrontational ways.

She became a mediator. She always said that she was a person in recovery. lawyer and she wanted to help people so she decided to mediate because she thought she could help them find a solution without having to go through all that, but Tom and Carmen were looking for a solution to their own problem that they couldn't. They decided if they were going to have a child when they first got married, they were going to have children. Tom wanted many, then they were married for 13 years and now Tom does not want to have children and she now changed careers and now wants to have children in 1998 despite the disagreement Carmen became pregnant and that December she gave birth to a daughter Kiara he got angry I think with Carmen being pregnant and never treated her the same after that I think he punished her Carmen stopped working she loved being a mother but felt like she was raising Kiara alone and Tom's indifference towards the LED baby car to question other parts of his life, he felt like he was living a life that just didn't fit very well with how he felt.felt about things and how she thought Angela Hayes was Carmen's best friend.

She sounds cliché, but she really wanted to help people and she felt like she couldn't do it the way her life was going. Carmen was about to make a momentous decision when Kiara was still a little girl. Carmen changed careers again. and became a healer, she was in a learning program where she physically treated people in the local area and a lot of people made fun of it because they didn't understand it, maybe even her husband Carmen was practicing a spiritual approach to medicine that aims to teach the body to heal himself in September 2002 he went to a consulting conference in Witchita and there he met Larry Lima.

She came home and said, have you ever looked into someone's eyes and felt like you knew you were a soulmate? So, the conventional thinking is that this is how you're supposed to feel about your husband. It's true and I think she did until maybe that day. How did she change when she met Larry Lima? She smiled again and had the glow again. Her eyes looked almost too happy, like why are you so happy? I mean, Larry Lima was a social worker living in San Diego shortly after they met, the couple started an affair, are you upset about the relationship she was in?

She bothered me, it hurt me. Me because she was acting in a way that many people in the world act who do not respect her spouse and simply live for her own gratification, but after Years of living what Carmen considered an unfulfilled life for her . Her friends thought the change was good for her, she was extremely happy and not only had he never seen her so happy, but he had never seen anyone so happy, she felt that her life was developing as she had always wanted it to be. life and that's how it was. shortly before Carmen decided she wanted to divorce Tom Murray, she tried to get him to go to a lawyer, she tried to make it work and finally he said it wasn't going to work, but the problem was just beginning because Carmen had not only decided to leave Tom she decided to take daughter with her How does a peace-loving mediator type react to a nasty custody battle?

He described to us that his mother bear's claws are going to have to come out, this is like the morning light and a very dark night, Larry Lima still remembers the first time Carmen Ross caught his attention, we met at a workshop in Witchita Kansas and she had this plate and, uh, I walked by and she, you know, very nicely asked me if I wanted a piece of watermelon and she grabbed a watermelon seed and ate it and walked away, she just raised her eyebrows and she later said that she knew that was the time Larry lives in San Diego and in the fall of 2002 Carmen flew to see him as often as she may have confided in Larry that her marriage to Tom Murray was ending.

Something had died inside. She had worked very hard and had been unhappy for a long time in her marriage. Yes, in June 2003, after Muray reluctantly agreed to divorce Carmen. She began making plans to move to California, but although Tom Murray did not want children at first, he was now unwilling to let his daughter Kiara go. We were hoping to reach some kind of agreement, you know, which would be for the best. for Kiara to come and go and clearly it wasn't going to be feasible if she wanted him in her life absolutely in her life absolutely me too and I know how important it is for a child to be with both parents as much as possible so Carmen left Manhattan and moved here to Lawrence Kansas, about 90 minutes from Tom.

Larry Lio now plans to move here and join her. Carmen and Tom temporarily shared custody of Kiara, but were working with a mediator to negotiate a permanent agreement. Carmen was determined to fix things she didn't want to hurt him even though she was leaving him she still wanted to be his friend she truly believed that at some point they would be friends again but while Carmen was trying to bridge their differences Tom was busy burning bridges he was clearly angry and he certainly sent emails and phone calls that bothered her. Were you surprised that he was putting up such a fight over the custody issue?

Oh no, no, no CU, that's all he has left, but so does he. he wanted to win he is a winner but this time Carmen was determined to win on November 11, 2003 she came to the mediation session and stood her ground she told Tom that she wanted K to live with her and then I would move there and how was she Emotionally at that moment I think that in the midst of feeling anxious and a little scared there was also a feeling of relief because she had done it, she had done it, yes, but she was clearly satin and afraid of how everything was going to turn out.

The next night when Larry called from San Diego, Carmen was feeling better, we talked for hours on Wednesday night and I thought she was in a pretty good place, I mean we were going to get through this since it turned out that was the last conversation they had. They didn't hear from her the next morning. I knew something was wrong on Friday afternoon. Larry frantically called the Douglas County Sheriff's Department. Detective Doug Woods went to Carman's house to investigate and when he got there, it was almost too much even for him. Blood on the floor. Blood on the walls.

Blood on the ceiling. Furniture had been overturned, potted plants and things broken against the fireplace. There was a great degree of brutality. I think that happened in this. house and in the middle of the room Carmen Ross lay dead, beaten and stabbed at the age of 40. I remember feeling like this just isn't true. Carmen's house was now a crime scene that promised a lot of physical evidence as a crime. - scene investigators searched the house for clues. Detective Woods drove to Manhattan to tell Tom Murray that his ex-wife was dead. Mr. Murray came to the door and opened the door.

I told Mr. Murray that his ex-wife Carmen had died and that we needed to talk. to him about it, what did he say? Mr. Murray asked me if we had to do it right now, he said do we have to do this now? and you said I said it would be better if we could do it right now, so Murray agreed to go. with Woods to a nearby police station, did you have to convince him to talk? No sir, to the extent that I am helping you solve the case. Death tickles me to participate. He was free to go, but I won't keep him. here against your will it's not okay you're here of your own free will and you're agreeing to stay you don't have to keep calling you haven't been mean to me and you're not holding me against me in fact It turned out that the teacher couldn't stop talking well let me ask you this.

He sat with Detective Woods and others from 8:30 that night until 6:00 the next morning without an attorney when the interrogation began. Everything you had told Professor Murray. It's that his ex wife had died if sir you wanted to know what had happened you never asked me how she died if I were you you would be looking at me I think I should like that in my mind then tell me what a great guy, you are the reason why I shouldn't point the finger at you finger not even a little bit right now oh, you don't know me um I'm kind of the original Boy Scout.

I mean, I've always been the straightest arrow in the quiver. I could explain everything we would bring him. I think he thought he was smarter than us. He had bought a fresh pineapple and was cutting it into pieces and cutting it in my hand. Murray's right hand had small cuts and both wrists. They were bruised, I mean, it all happened in the last two or three days and Murray vehemently denied killing Carmen. He never wanted Carmen to die. He wanted her reasonable. You have some kind of strategy in mind when you talk to him, basically locking him into his story. then we can begin to refute some of the things you say, Mr.

Murray. However, he would change his story periodically. You're going to look at this with a raised eyebrow. I went out and drove around a little bit, but I didn't drive to Lawrence. I'm not telling you that it used to be a game of cat and mouse. Will you be here looking over my shoulder to leave you alone? That lasted all night. There is no perfect crime. They're going to catch you as bad. A guy always gets caught, but if Murray was the bad guy, he wouldn't get caught tonight, so at this point you have no convincing evidence that you're not going to do it, you're not going to do it.

Tom will make us sit here and we will tell you. about our case, okay, I don't want you to tell me about the case, but I'm concluding that because if you had compelling evidence, wouldn't you go ahead and arrest me at 6:00 a.m.? m.? Tom Murray went home. I was upset with Myself because I didn't press the right button or tell him to ask the right questions or go in the right direction to get him to confess. Murray talked so much that she was now his number one suspect, but the police had nothing on him. I really do not know. why did I get this except many conversations waited for evidence from the crime scene and finally found nothing we never found bloody clothes we never found a murder weapon it just didn't exist Tom Murray continued to teach and raise Kiara about the In the months that followed, Danny Ross feared that the murder would never be solved, although she became increasingly suspicious of the son-in-law she once loved.

How is that accepted? I don't have an answer for that because if he had thought he actually did it. killed my daughter, I would have seriously hurt him at the time, almost a year after the murder of Carmen Ross in November 2003. We would have run the gamut of this case if we weren't going to find more evidence, the police still hadn't arrested no one at that time. In October 2004, detectives Doug Woods, Pat Pollock and Lyall Hagenbush decided they would have to take a chance on a circumstantial case. They arrested their number one suspect, Professor Tom Murray.

I thought we had a good case, not a very good one, not a very good one, because we didn't have a With a lot of physical evidence, it was very difficult for Carmen's sisters, Samantha Heather and April, to believe the accusations that you don't love someone you love. , who you gave Christmas gifts to, who you hugged and said you loved, you don't want it to be them. person who could have done that things were about to get more difficult for the Rosses just three months before Murray's trial began, the district attorney and Lawrence were removed, leaving this case in the hands of Angela Wilson and assistant of the district attorney.

I've never prosecuted a murder before. I have handled several rape cases in attempted murder cases, but this is by far the most complicated. Kansas has an unusual law that allows victims to pay a special prosecutor to help the district attorney's office so Ross The family hired Tom Bath, a prominent defense attorney, to be part of the prosecution team. I am an assistant attorney, which means it is really up to them to decide what role I have in this case, if any, they have allowed me to be a

full

member of the team. Murray has hired two of the best lawyers in the state, Pedro Irigaray and Bob.

I think our best card is evidence or lack thereof. Tomorrow, Danny, how are you? In February 2005, the Rosses arrived in Lawrence determined to win two things, a guilty verdict in this state. of Kansas v. Thomas E. Murray 2004 and custody of Carmen and Tom's daughter, Kara, who has been living with them since Tom's arrest on November 13, 2003. Thomas Murray, a precise and articulate college professor, killed beats his ex-wife in their living room as Angela Wilson begins the most important trial of her career is a little nervous a few months before Carmen's death moved into her own apartment in Manhattan that afternoon at 12:15 excuse me at 12:45 and it would be almost 24 hours or More than 24 hours before anyone knew she was dead, thank you, your honorable defense attorney Bob.

I'm eager to exploit the weaknesses in Angela Wilson's case. All they had was a hunch and a hunch is all they have today. It is an emotional day for everyone. a photograph of Carmen when she was alive she was the right person even for the normally stoic Tom Murray after investigating for more than a year the best evidence against Murray remains the first piece of his 10-hour videotaped interview with police. I'm going to move on and get out these people from Douas County they're going to move on the investigators asked muray about the day of Carmen's murder and on Thursday morning you drove to Lawrence no and I drove home and took my midterms Murray was seen at 8:30 a.m. when he left his daughter with the babysitters and again around noon when he got her back no one saw him in between and detectives believe that's when he drove 90 miles to Lawrence to kill men in my mind I can't go back.

Within the time I have available, but Detective Lyall Hagenbush says Murray could. Hagen Bush knows it because he did it. We were able to show that Tom Murray could drive from Manhattan to Lawrence and have plenty of time to kill Carmen Ross and return to the Manhattan detectives. I don't think it would have taken Murray long to kill Carmen. They believe he hit her first and then stabbed Carmen with a knife she got in her kitchen. I did not do it,I mean, I'll sit here and say this until... I'm blue in the face, you can try to believe me or not, all I can do is tell you the truth.

There are times when Murray seems genuinely upset and times when he doesn't. You are a very skilled interviewer. Pat, you have been trained very well. to Doug I want to say that they are good at what they do, they knew it during the time that when the defense finally has the opportunity to speak, says Pedro irigaray, although it lasted almost 10 hours, Tom Murray's statement does not prove anything, have they found something conclusive? evidence that Mr. Murray was at Carmen Ross's home on November 13. I am not aware of any; In fact, the state's own forensic experts that prosecutors hope will link Murray to the crime actually helped the defense team make its case for him.

There were 54 or 55 samples analyzed from Miss Ross's house and in none of them was Mr. Murray's DNA found correct correct there is no DNA and there is only one fingerprint that matches Tom Murray the only fingerprint that was found of Thomas Murray was in a brown dropper bottle yes and no traces of him were found anywhere else that's right, it's true, isn't it? So the defense says the evidence suggests there was more than one person at the crime scene. The police found what looked like two bloody shoe prints, neither of those two shoe prints matched their knowledge that they belong to Mr.

Murray that is correct there are no more questions in the face of the lack of forensic evidence the prosecution argues that Murray is the only person with a motive to kill Carmen they believe exploded after a mediation session just 2 days before the murder that it was obvious to her that they were going to have to get into a custody battle and prosecutors say Tom Murray had another reason, the oldest in the book, jealousy, because Carmen's fiancé, Larry Lima, was about to move to Lawrence. Were you passionately in love with her? When were you planning to do it? moving to Lawrence the first part of December you are familiar with that exhibit can you point out to the jury where he would have entered the house while the state works methodically through four weeks of testimony seemed disheveled seemed tired the trial is long if you are able to determine the number of stab wounds here in this area of ​​the neck that would be 13 and sometimes it is difficult, this is a tear of the tissue caused by the tissue being crushed between a hard object and the bone underneath, it is a sensation of numbness because as I I sat there and looked at all the photographs that make me think thoughts that I don't think a human being should think.

Prosecutors say Mr. Murray carefully planned Carmen's murder and cleaned up afterward, and they are about to present some startling evidence that explains how an English teacher could know so much about murder. These are the computers that took Mr. Murray's money. search term was how to murder someone and not get caught after weeks of testimony Professor Thomas Murray's lawyers say things are going their way The physical evidence they have presented to him has generally shown exactly what we thought it would be and that is that Tom Murray was not at the scene of this crime, which is exactly what Danny Ross is worried about if the worst case scenario does in fact occur and he is acquitted. then the jury will put him back with my granddaughter.

Yes, three generations of Rosses from five different states have moved to Lawrence Kansas. Give me the remote control during the trial. The detectives couldn't find any evidence during the process, but the routine is becoming a It's very difficult to sit there patiently and let them do their job and I worry if he will get the justice he really deserves. There are good reasons for the Rosses to be nervous, and I think that's the line where prosecutors started off strongly. It's all well and good to play Tom Murray's revealing police interview, but now Assistant District Attorney Angela Wilson is having a hard time attempting her first murder.

What was the amount of blood involved in that case? Objection, you are H. This is not relevant in a case of this magnitude. The questions about websites have been overwhelming at times, but things are starting to look up for the prosecutor's office and the Rosses. The jury is about to hear the most powerful forensic evidence yet and it has nothing to do with blood or DNA. Have you ever accessed the Internet? I looked for websites that had to do with crime scenes or polygraphs. Oh, I got on the CSI website. From time to time I have fantasies about trying to become a freelance writer.

The researchers could not have imagined what they discover. When Murray's computers were confiscated, it turns out that The Professor wasn't just researching Linguistics, although there's a word for the kind of searches he was doing online: suspicious, maybe even damning. Robert Dean Brown Dean Brown is a computer forensics expert. It is this. He dug into the recesses of Murray's computers at 11:25 a.m. search yahoo dating murder For Hire just a few seconds later, has another search been performed? Yes, ma'am, there is a quest on how to hire an assassin. Found something a little over an hour later and there was a search on how to do it? a bomb is starting to sound as a prosecutor's dream shows Yahoo looking for how to murder someone and not get caught Investigators were delighted with the secrets that Murray's computers revealed, especially when they learned that the searches were carried out just when the custody battle was having between Tom and the car.

It was getting nasty when someone searches multiple times for this kind of topic and then someone ends up dead, it's kind of a clue, to me, you half expect to upload this guy to his own hard drive, sure, yeah, can you do that? There is evidence there, but the defense has an explanation. The next page shows that a visit to the site on November 10 is something called twiz tv.com CSI script Mr. Murray was interested in the possibility of writing an episode for a CSI type show is his best explanation for these Internet searches that are just an unfortunate coincidence, what would you like us to invent something?

A trial lawyer works with what he has to work with computers delivers more bad news for Professor Murray Emails showing that his anger with Carmen was growing and even angrier at her for starting an intimate relationship with another man and even angrier To her for continuing that relationship for all the months that she and I were supposed to work hard to fix things, but I can't just sit back and have my daughter taken away from me. I feel more and more like an animal being cornered in a cornered state is resting the prosecution is resting Tom Murray's defense will first highlight three main points a custody lawyer told Murray he had no reason to fear Carmen would take Kiara if one of the parents wanted to leave the state of Kansas That's fine, but they don't take the child with them.

The defense argues that although Murray expressed his anger in emails, he was still committed to working with Carmen and that is, according to mediator Nancy Hughes herself, they worked well together, it was quite clear that they were trying to support each other in taking care of their daughter and Finally the defense argues that not only is there no evidence that Professor Murray was even at the crime scene, but there is a mysterious blood stain on Carmen's sink that suggests someone else was at Carmen's house. expert Robert Trestle, could you describe to the jury what that stain represents to you?

What we call a bloodstain transfer pattern. Do you have any thoughts on what may have caused that particular stain on that sink pedestal? My impression is that this is a tenant's shoe. print if it's a shoe print, the defense says it's not Murray's. Can we get copies of his notes, please? But Angela Wilson accelerated and hit back by attacking the experts. You do not have any certifications in the area of ​​blood spot analysis. your certifications, I'm sorry sir, but that is a question that only requires a yes or no answer, so if you could answer my question, the one I am asking you, you do not have any certifications in the area of ​​bloodstain pattern analysis .

You, no, no, I felt like I could see Angela gain a little more confidence as the trial went on. I think she did an excellent job. Look at the knife, look at the edge, and he saved some drama for her final argument. This is a person who was determined to murder 13 times, he stuck that knife in his neck, ladies and gentlemen, Tom Murray never takes the stand, the defense places its hopes on reasonable doubt and they argue that there is a lot, let's go back to the crime scene, there is no none of his blood there none of his fingerprints none of his fingerprints no one sees his car there no one and no scientific evidence can put Tom Murray in that house on the 13th for the Ross family this is now one of the most difficult parts of the trial What is waiting for the jury who decided he died?

I recognize that the jury could find him not guilty and if they find him not guilty then my heart will break again because we will have to hand over our granddaughter to him. They don't hurt me anymore. I'm just very angry. Because of what this man did to my daughter, it's been almost a year and a half since Danny Ross' daughter Carmen was murdered. He has now taken her from us so that I will never have the opportunity to hold her again. There is no doubt in the Rosses. He worries about who killed Carmen, but the fate of her accused killer, her ex-husband Tom Murray, now depends on the jury.

He is putting the case in the hands of 12 people who don't know everything we know and can make the decision. That is very difficult. I looked at him as I was sitting there and looked at him and said, "I love you." There is no room for maneuver for juries. They either have to convict Maria of first degree murder or set him free. Everything is at stake. table as we spoke there Murray's lawyers repeatedly argued that, but Murray's life is not the only one at stake, Ross and Murray shared custody of if he is acquitted, the Rosses would have to give him Kiara, the daughter he had with Carmen, It's the worst case scenario.

The Rosses hope they never face my daughter was murdered and we can't bring her back, but having my granddaughter raised in a proper environment is what my daughter would have wanted and that is the most important thing for our family. swear that the testimony you're about to give took five weeks to present all the evidence and the jury is taking their time to analyze it all. I believe he is guilty and I believe he will be found guilty after 3 days of deliberations. ICT is St. Patrick's Day and the teacher seems relaxed reading a book about the Polish language even as he waits for the jury to return.

Verdict of the State of Kansas v. Thomas E. Murray. The jury finds defendant Thomas E. Murray guilty of murder. in the first degree Murray is one of the few people in the courtroom who restrains himself. Carmen's family is overwhelmed. You got the result you wanted. How does Justice feel? Thank God for so long, everything has focused on this process coming to an end. Let's end today by imagining this day and that we have Kiara, she is safe now I can really cry for Carmen. It's also an emotional victory for prosecutors, especially Angela Wilson, who started this trial as a rookie against experienced defense attorneys and won big.

I think this is the first time I saw a prosecutor cry for her when it was well, yeah, there was so much emotion around this case and her family, and I think it's been really good to be included in her family group. . I joked from the beginning that I was an honorary Ross girl. Carmen's family and her fiancé say they have the verdict they want and know it's time to move on. I am convinced that this is a homicide related to domestic violence. Larry remembers Carmen volunteering as domestic help. Victims of violence at the Family Justice Center in San Diego Every victim that comes here says, "Okay, Garmin, do you know how we can make this person's life a little less traumatic?

It's going to be a little harder for them." Ross who once considered Murray a son and a brother, this guy was absolutely part of your life and it is a very confusing and conflicting feeling because I have no doubt that it was his hands that hurt her, but I don't know what happened to the yours. head to realize that someone you love took someone you love, how am I supposed to explain that to my children if I don't understand it and to his daughter there will be no explanations from Tom Murray, who remained. defiant at his sentencing I remain baffled that the jury believed the prosecution's fairy tale about my involvement in the death of Carmen Ross he insisted he was innocent and refused to apologize I have never raised my hand in anger against anyone, and much less against the woman I created with. a child and in a rare display of emotion dear Kiara saved her last words for her daughter since I can't be with you.

I am very glad that you can live with people. I love you so much Kara, who now has nine lives. with the Rosses at home in Indiana I asked her I said are you worried about who is going to take care of you? and she looked at me like that and saidno, I'm glad I have my family to take care of me and she has a whole family that adores her and would do anything for her and we will take care of her together we will take care of her let's go