Confidence Man with Maggie Haberman // The American Story

that the elections have been stolen from you? Who convinces him that the elections were stolen from him? HABERMAN: So in the early days, the campaign's own data showed that Trump could win back votes in Arizona and a couple of other states. On Friday it became clear that was not the case. Saturday is when the networks called the race for Biden. Um, Trump had already started suggesting that the election was going to be stolen from him months earlier, when there was widespread mail-in voting due to COVID. So I don't think Trump needed convincing. I think this is something Trump has been saying for years.

RUBENSTEIN: Was there any plan on Donald Trump's part not to leave the Oval Office as has been suggested? HABERMAN: He had started telling people two weeks after the election, "I'm just not going away." Now, I don't think that was a plan. That, that, but it was on his mind. You know, "I'm not leaving, we're never leaving. Why would you leave when you won an election?" Um, I don't know what would have happened if it hadn't happened on January 6, 2021. RUBENSTEIN: Well, let's talk about January 6. What was his plan on January 6? Was it to gather people together and go march on the Capitol and protest in a civilized way?

Or is that what you think he wanted? HABERMAN: He says, you know, and his assistants always point out that he said, you know, march peacefully and patriotically, uh, toward his allies. Uh, I don't think he had a great idea of ​​what might happen. I think he was so angry and so irritated, that he just went "for this somehow." And "this" is the certification of Joe Biden's victory in the Electoral College. RUBENSTEIN: So when the Capitol was stormed, congressional leaders called on Donald Trump to call this off. And he didn't answer the calls on purpose or do you think why did he wait a couple of hours?

HABERMAN: He spoke with Kevin McCarthy, who told Trump that people were breaking into McCarthy's office. What we heard at the time and what we reported at the time was that Trump was watching on television and was happy with what he saw. RUBENSTEIN: So when the violence occurred on January 6, Donald Trump finally issued a statement. How long did it take before he actually issued the statement? Did he write that statement or did people force him to give it? HABERMAN: Around 2:20 or 2:24, I've got the time wrong, um, I think. But he essentially tweeted that this is happening because Mike, and I'm paraphrasing, "This is happening because Mike Pence didn't do what he should have done," meaning he rejected Joe Biden's victory.

Um, that was the first statement from him. Then, eventually, his assistants spent some time begging him to say something. He finally issued another statement saying, "You know, be peaceful." It was an emergent process. RUBENSTEIN: So, since he left the Oval Office, has he ever spoken to Joe Biden? HABERMAN: No. No. He left Joe Biden a letter in a traditional letter, and what Biden told people who work with him after he received it. He was, you know, into Trump doodles, family doodles. Um, he said it was more, that he was kinder than he expected him to be.

RUBENSTEIN: Well, thank you for coming here today and giving us information about Donald Trump, our president at one point. So thank you very much. HABERMAN: Thank you. (applause) (music plays through the credits) ♪ ♪