Comedian Bassem Youssef on the Israel-Gaza war, the Arab Spring, and why we can’t change the world

Remember when 3,000 people murdered in October was too many now it's 30,000 it doesn't matter now 100,000 doesn't matter 300,000 doesn't matter The West has lectured us for so long about the values ​​of humanity and the Declaration of Human Rights and then we see that it doesn't apply to us , so you feel like maybe our people are too stingy and don't care hello and welcome two ways to

change

the

world

. I'm Christian gir Murphy and this is the podcast where we talk to extraordinary people about big ideas and their lives and the events that have helped shape them. My guest this week is a

comedian

originally from Egypt, but now he's American or Egyptian-American and he was originally a doctor, but during the Arab Spring he transitioned, if that's the right word, and became something of a television interest. in Egypt until his program was no longer acceptable to the new Egyptian authorities and he had to leave the country in a hurry.

Yousef, thank you very much for coming, what an introduction, thank you very much, well, I mean, look, you know you spent a lot of your life trying to

change

the

world

, the world in different ways, no, I spend most of my time trying to get people. off my back as you know, my parents wanted me to go to medicine, so I went to medicine to get them off my back, you know, I get into comedy, people want me to do something, so I do it, so it's always kind of out of a need, so you never wanted to be a doctor.

I find it hard to believe because you went so far, no, yes, I know, but I hated every minute of it. I did it because there was no other option in me because in Egypt you have like the traditional way the traditional way is very I don't have I didn't have the uh the courage to tell my parents I want to pursue my passion because I honestly didn't know what my passion was I didn't. I did If there wasn't, there isn't something I'm so passionate about that I would take a chance on it, so I heard I'm 18, the top of my class had good grades for medical school and they were like what are you doing?

I want to do I said I didn't really have any kind of passion for anything, what did your parents do? my father was a judge my mother was a university professor but of course in Egypt he is an engineer or a doctor so my father my my older brother became an engineer so I had to do it. I have to complete the Mosaic, the social Mosaic and become a doctor, yes, no, I mean, I am also a failed doctor and I got a place in medicine. school and then I got into journalism I was thinking what a disappointment or what disappointments we are welcome fellow disappointments to end up talking about this kind of thing, I mean, you have become very famous here um partly because of a couple of interviews that they did with you.

I've recently done about Israel G, you did one with Pierce Morgan, uh, that got millions and millions of views. How do you feel about that role now? You know the voice of a dispossessed, as I said before in one of my interviews, I've seen this movie before because in Egypt, you know, when I left medicine, I had my own TV show. The program was very successful and suddenly they told me the same things as you. you are the voice of the people voice of the resolution I said guys I'm a

comedian

please you were the John Steak of and I said and here's the problem when people get so frustrated with a certain topic within this topic and they find someone that can resonate with them they put all their hopes and dreams and all their expectations on that person and at the end of the day you are a human being and you have limits and I have limits and at a certain point Just like I did in Egypt, I couldn't go on anymore. , so I backed out because it wasn't safe, it was too much for me.

Here I found myself in a position where I am defending a cause that I have never been a part of. you know, no, I'm not, I'm not Palestinian, you know, I'm, I'm married to H, someone who is half Palestinian and even she's not even active about it, her main concern is the kids, basically, but I found I'm in that position, I mean your wife had family in Gaza, are they still there? Yes, they are still in Ra and are you in contact? I mean, you know they're trying to get out, they're in the process of trying to get out.

Go out for a while and it's okay, they have like six or seven families, uncles and cousins ​​and stuff, and now they all lost their homes, they all got bombed and now they're all crammed into an apartment in a building to share. with 25 other families in that building and that building could be bombed tomorrow so do you feel capable of making comedy out of this situation? My show that I'm touring with now has nothing to do with current events, eh, I try to avoid it, explain it. When I had this kind of fame optics and I'm booking my shows, people come and expect me to talk about what happened yesterday or the day before yesterday and I said no, that's not how it works and I find it.

It's very difficult to make fun of or make comedy out of this, yeah, I mean, it happens when from time to time, like when I go to certain interviews, it's just absurd, you know, how Israel likes the bomb, everyone was like, ah, it I feel. Guys, wow, we didn't mean to continue, it's just very similar to what happened to the Global Central Kitchen. World Cal Kitchen. World Central Kitchen, yes, they killed seven people. It's like, ah, we're sorry, guys. it means the war, the war is terrible and then the second one said it's Hamas and then the third one, ah, it was us and then, ah, the war, the war is the bad guys, I mean, I'm sorry, I know we're sorry. and then they would even have their Twitter account saying this is. the difference between Hamas and Israel because Israel recognizes this mistake and apologizes bravo bravo beautiful and then even one of those who said like look what the ham made us do just like I mean, you don't even need to write jokes about this, it's just like If his atrocities are like you know, like when Donald Trump was around and said one horrible thing after another, you lose count and it doesn't get funny anymore, that's exactly what's happening there, no, I mean, that's the point. , it's not the You know that the world in many ways is beyond satire and yet, yes, but at a certain point it stops being funny, yes, you are able to do something, I mean, you are able to make fun of the people, in a sense, I mean, you know you did it. you made fun of Pierce Morgan in that interview you made fun of Ben Shapiro you will make fun of Israel right now people don't know how to react to that they do it because you don't you don't know whether to laugh because you I don't know if it's okay, it's sad to laugh when they kill to people because it is very sad, the fact that, as you say, like us, we should go up to Israel to warn civilians before bombing them is very sad.

Wow friend, how incredible, how charming. It's, it's, it's, it's very sad, I don't know, it's funny and sad at the same time, don't you think you know, it's like the fact that they lie, I mean the fact that, like when Israel said that Hamas It has a military base. base under the hospital, do you have any evidence? Here is a CGI video. That's what we have and you have to believe it, but if you don't believe it, you're anti-Semitic. o You are anti-Semitic. Do they accuse you? from that of course anti-Semitism, I am anti-Semitic, yes it's funny because in Egypt I was accused of being a secret Jew and a crazy agent and now I come to the United States to be accused of being anti-Semitic and how can I do it? you deal with it, what do you say? you laugh like that oo I'm so scared now it doesn't mean anything this accusation of being anti-Semitic it's it's it's an empty accusation it doesn't mean anything now but it's one of the worst accusations why why why do you know that they accuse you of being racist or anti-do you understand that I too I'm a Semite, right, yeah, so it doesn't make any sense, you understand this, of course, in that and I understand that the fact that you say someone is anti-Semitic doesn't mean anything because they call other Jews anti-Semitic, right, our Jews who are They hate themselves, sorry, they changed the N, yeah, oh, you hate yourself, don't you.

Does it matter, it doesn't matter that much, yeah, do you think the power of that accusation is diminishing? Yes, people don't care anymore, people are making fun of this accusation because basically Israel is saying we will do whatever we want. and since we are Semites and if you talk about something October 7 October 7 and you are anti-Semitic you just see that the narrative has become so tired and exhausting and devoid of any meaning, well, what do you think about the The other side of the coin is when people accuse Israel of a holocaust or a genocide or, you know, and they throw those words back at Israel and say, "Well, look what you're doing when obviously the numbers don't compare, so you know." When you talk about genocide or you know you think about Rwanda or Cambodia or World War II or you know millions of people are dying, do you think that's an appropriate accusation?

We have to wait until millions of Palestinians are killed, then genci, of course. Yeah, yeah, the thing is, it's just not genocide, it's just a light ticket, so what point do they remember about enhanced interrogation? Waterboarding is not torture, it is enhanced interrogation. It's too much killing. What about that? That's why I don't even like to get involved. because it's just words, genocide, not genocide, genocide, genocide, and you and I waste time deciding if it's genocide or not, already 10 people were shot as we speak, yeah, where is the provided answer? What can Israel do? We are discussing these arguments, right, 15 people were murdered.

Well, does Israel have a right to exist? What should you do while we discuss this book? 50 people were killed. Never mind, all this media talk is disgusting. because it just gave Israel more time to do whatever it does on a daily basis, which is increase the killings, so whatever definitions we're discussing, defend any self-defense, war terrorism, it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, everything The system appears to be designed. Israel just does what it wants and in their free time they come and piss you off with these discussions. So what have you discovered then about the power of a TV show like the one you had in Egypt or something?

The Daily Show in America, where you say power, you make fun of politicians and then they take power and win anyway, you know, I mean. The Daily Show in America was this kind of vaunted thing that people think is absolutely incredible. John Stewart is back. It's a lot of fun but it's not going to stop anything from happening, is that right? Mhm, yes, it is an illusion of free speech, it is an illusion, yes, just explain that my program is an illusion, this is all an illusion, we are wasting other people's time. talking about things thinking that we can really make a change well, the world doesn't even change, I mean, it's just, it's there how many United Nations resolutions how many security CS it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, we can really talk and we shout and we can cry and we can jump and we stomp and at the end of the day the people in power do what they want Did you feel like your show was pointless or powerless?

Yes, at first I was hopeful. but at a certain point it just doesn't matter when you started doing that, when you first left the program. I was enjoying what you thought you were going to do. This is what I like to do. This is what I like to make fun of. people in power is a beautiful thing and I think it is the measure of a democratic society. At a certain point, when I could do it, you become disenfranchised and you lose hope, as you know, and then you come to America and you think there's hope because you can talk about whatever you want, but then you talk about things and it doesn't matter. , you vote for who, who is in office and it doesn't matter because who you vote for doesn't really follow your direction or it doesn't really work for your special interest it works for the special interest of the people who give you money for the next election cycle are you going to vote on this?

I don't believe it I don't believe it I have been disenfranchised from the entire Democratic process and I am very sad to say this because what is the reason, what is the point of giving my vote for someone who at the end of the day will work? for special groups that will pay you way more than I will ever pay you and then go on and make and then make legislation that doesn't work for me in my own interest, it just doesn't make any sense. I understand, but if you're faced with a choice between Joe Biden and Donald Trump, you're prepared to say: I'm not going to make the decision.

I don't face any choice. choice that is being made, right? I don't have to take any. Where does that leave you the power to complain? So I don't know if you haven't. I don't know, exercise the choice. This is all new to me. I'm discovering life in the new world. Do you like it? I love it. What do you like about the United States? The United States is a great place to live. It's great. I mean, of course I am. very disenfranchised by their policies, but you know it's a wonderful people, it's a great place to live, it's a good place to raise your kids.

I'm not going to lie I mean I'm not complaining about America as the place but a lot of Americans don't like their countries policies as a lot of Brits don't like their countries policies uh like you know the British government is Well, being disenfranchised by your government's policies, do you feel free there in a way you didn't? I feel freePalestinians. Don't they count as human beings? Being human but they don't count in the same way. No, they don't count. How many Palestinian children have been killed since October 7 in the West Bank? 81 yes, yes 81 Israeli children. They were murdered since October 7, what will the word do?

But is this a revelation to you? No, it's not a revelation. We know it from the beginning, but when you see it, you confront it now because we know we did it. It doesn't matter, we don't know that our Liv is not, it's not that valuable, we understand that we have seen it a long time ago, as you know, when they killed 11 people from Charlie ABDO, which is terrible. Of course, all of us, Charlie and the leaders of the war, 11 people went to Paris, but there are 30,000, if the news comes out tomorrow, 10,000 Palestinians were killed. Do you think the word will make any changes?

No, I mean, I saw the argument you made. It was about the dehumanization of Palestinians and talking about them like animals. Do you think that was even necessary? No, it's not necessary, but it is, it's not, don't you mean? in some parts of the world they are valued less than people in other parts of the world when it comes to death when you are in the western world yes the question is: do you think the Palestinians needed to be dehumanized? or they were just worth less in the West because there, to escalate the violence, you need to remind people how good those people are so you can continue doing it because Israel has been killing them daily, but to escalate the violence from time to time you need a little reminder of how inhuman those people are, so it's like a process that goes simply to help increase the victim tool.

I can see why you don't do comedy about current offense yeah, because this is a dark conversation, yeah, um, and I guess it's an indication of where you are in your mind about this whole thing, so how do you switch between that and the comedy? It's just a job, it's a job, it's my job, it's not just a job it's my job it's my burden of life that's how I get in and the people who pay tickets to come see make me laugh I don't have to suffer for whatever I have to go I can have horrible problems at home with my children with my wife but it doesn't matter because there I am an artist no one cares what happens to you off and off the stage and so if you were for a moment an optimistic person and and and and you could change the world in Anyway, how would you change it?

I don't know, man, it's a very rhetorical question, I don't know, just the thing is, all that big talk about changing the word is useless if you don't do it. addressing power who has the power who has the power to shape the narrative who had the power to force people to do certain things or stop people from doing certain things and the people in power don't really respond or care for none of our suggestions to CH to change the world because at a certain point if that if our ways of changing the world will affect their special interest they will stop you is that what you are going to tell your children I will not wait until they are 21 so tell them that I'm not going to ruin their childhood I'm going to ruin them as they were when they were young when they're old enough when they're old enough to have their lives ruined what do you think I?

I'm mom no B youf thank you very much indeed thank you very much