Are You Lit? Matthew McConaughey | Rich Roll Podcast

Hello everyone, welcome to the

podcast

. If there's anyone who doesn't need an introduction today, I'm today's guest, Matthew McConaughey. Everyone knows who this guy is. It was an absolute pleasure. This is an amazing conversation. He was so generous, warm and open. I'm so excited for you to listen before we get started, hit that subscribe button, hit that notification bell, and read Matthew's new book. Green lights. It's an amazing read, you won't be disappointed and neither will this conversation, so without further ado, this is me and

matthew

mcconaughey

okay, okay, thank you so much for doing this, you're ready to rock, let's

roll

, so our point of introduction or inflection was our mutual friend dan buettner who kindly introduced us and we were meant to go on this backpacking trip in Utah likes this ultralight backpacking trip that was canceled due to Covid so I was looking forward to meeting you in person , but that will have to wait another day.

Well our good man Dan is a good curator of people like challenging minds you know you know my nickname is gh no what does that mean in general? uh heroic and I don't mean just sometimes I mean four dimensions and 360 degree view, whatever view you want to take, it's usually heroic where did you first meet him? We met him, we ended up, I think in Europe, on a Google weekend, a Google getaway, he was one of the speakers and he was the first speaker, I think, and of that day, that's how he said the day and what.

He had to say: I remember hearing him say that this guy has the best job in the world, yes, he's studying longevity, happiness, people and culture, so I chased him down and made sure to grab his eyeliner and shake his hand. hand. and i met him and talked to him about some things and he continued calling me bradley cooper and then i think he came up and flirted with my wife and called her mrs cooper, that sounds like she was still heroic in general and now she's rehabbing her rehab, right? Did you see his last fall?

I did it, I did it. I'm going to visit him in Santa Barbara in a week or so. I told him there was a pothole in the middle of the road in Minnesota. it just doesn't fit the meter of a generally heroic Dan button accident because of all the things that guy has done biking around Saudi Arabia and whatever it takes to get him taken down like that, but amen, it happens to the best of us , but I caught up I told him and asked him what I should ask Matthew. You know, mainly you can't Google it and he said some people think Matthew is heroic in a lot of areas. my boomerang came back, yeah, oh, that's all him, he's the purely gh, um, just, he calls me a lot of nicknames, one of them, professor, I think because I'm a ut professor, um, no, he's usually heroic, uh, more than me. your question is: how am I generally heroic or how do you respond to that?

Can you accept that compliment? How does that feel to you? Well, I've always liked to try to entertain what the definition of a hero is at all times. life, I mean, you know you have what has always been said while they talk, you know, they are men and women who go out to defend the country or the true heroes and then you say that there are heroes every day who do good. Facts, I don't know if that's heroic. I'll say this about any kind of heroism, whatever your definition is, whatever anyone's definition is. When I got fame and success and started a foundation that we have, just keep it going. living the school foundation map that's working very well I didn't choose to do that now yes that's heroic I don't think it's heroic but what I'm leaning towards is this some people say it's a responsibility once you're successful, it's your responsibility I don't think that's true I think it's a personal choice it's just like uh um you know every day the decisions we make uh uh I think they should be very selfish I don't think we make good decisions for anyone unless it's personal like that. which no, I don't know about heroic, I wouldn't, I would consider myself a hero, um, I've been lucky enough to do it and I had an innate ability and I tried really hard to be at least pretty screwed. well in some things I still have some things in the debit section uh, I will say this my favorite job in the world has been being a father, I don't know, being a good father is a heroic job, it's just being a good father, So I do not know.

I don't know, I don't know what to make of the hero comment coming from the right, maybe it all depends on how you define it, how broad or narrow I guess, but more of a conversation about you, you know how to be a man of character, i guess. man of character, yes we can talk about it all day long you know, and even that is not a responsibility but a choice, you know, the only thing I knew I wanted to be was to be a father in my life and then I have also learned Now that's okay, just because you helped have a child doesn't mean you've done the job of a father, fatherhood is a verb, um, like in life, it's a verb, these character choices we make, uh, choices what do we do. every day is ours, you know, assets compounded for our future or not, um, I am, I've been blessed with a long-term view of life and I've realized early on that investments in ourselves today they can increase return on investment and our future can buy us green lights in our future the decisions we make today are compound assets of our future and can link us to success from the title of the book green lights I know, I know for a fact that we can design lights greens in our lives I also know for a fact that I have been very fortunate to have some in my lap, but character choices are long-term choices that have to do with delayed gratification.

Yeah, I remember something Dan told me a while ago, which was when he was at the beginning of his career and thinking about what he wanted to do and who he wanted to be, he spent time working for George Plimpton at the Paris Review and went to these fancy parties. , you know, on the Upper East Side, with all that dirty shit and George, although he was respected. He wasn't necessarily a man of means, but he had made the decision to live this life of adventure and when they went to these parties, all these people gravitated around George because he was the one who had the stories and that's what inspired Dan. live the kind of incredible life and adventures that he has lived and I see a lot of that in you.

I mean, we're going to talk about the book, but these pivots that you've made, the wanderlust that somehow infuses your life, and these Moments where you know, by dint of a wet dream or some kind of epiphany, that would you have or would you be stuck, you would always know that this is the time that I need to do my walk, so I'm interested in how that kind of plays into the fabric of your life and how you prioritize it, look, I think you know those clues , the angels of truth are around us all the time, it's just that we don't always notice them, you know they are there, but we don't.

I don't notice them and it's understandable, but in a high frequency life a lot of noise reaches us all, so I learned early on to listen to that spider feeling in me that says you have to go away and get away, McConaughey, you have to spend. some time with yourself, open up the highway between your head and your heart because right now it's a bit of one-way gravel, you know the dirt road for you and you know that your heart, your heart and your mind aren't really in sync like as in sync as they should be and then questioning what things I've always questioned since I was 14 years old.

One of the things in writing the book, my journal entries from when I was 14 were about similar or similar topics that still interest me. today at 50. I've had a pretty good threshold for when I have that spider sense to say oh, you need to get out of here, McConaughey, you need to leave where you are so you can get out and have a clear view. view, you need to leave where you are now and figure out what I discover when I'm gone uh memory catches up oh demarcations between events that maybe I was managing and I'm good at managing events uh just being in the In the middle of this, press, you know, let's do this, pile it on me, I'll be a horse, I'll get over it, but I didn't realize what had happened to me, like for example, when I became famous, I didn't realize what it did.

That was until I left Dodge and went on a 22-day hike with myself in Peru, then I thought, oh, that's what happened, oh, that's what that event or circumstance or that encounter with that person was about because everyone was on top of each other at that time I couldn't separate the things that happened too often, um, so I've gone alone many times. I have learned to enjoy solitude, not necessarily enjoying my company in solitude. Usually the first 12 days I don't enjoy my company, I am shaking the demons off my back, feeling regret, lost, confused, trying to figure out things and usually around the 12th or 13th, I'll have a breakthrough, um, and it's usually that breakthrough where it's okay, come on, hey, since you're the only guy I'm stuck with and I can't get rid of what each of us is for ourselves, what are we going to forgive and what are we going to say?

Holding on longer, I imagine those two holding my hand and I wake up the next morning and then those trips are wonderful, then I am present, then I sing a song, then wisdom lands in me, then I listen to those angels and those. butterflies of truth that land and you say bam this is my fault I'm listening to it now how can I personalize this truth and ask myself and answer the question why it comes to me how do I preserve it do I have the patience to preserve it and Then when I leave those trips, the great fun challenge is how to take that truth, the lonely truth, back to the masses, to the stadium of life, and ride that bull, that rodeo of life, and remember, trust that this truth that crossed me and that found. while I was in solitude is true now, then and forever, wherever I am right, that's the hard part, is what it seems to me almost this impulse of self-preservation or self-defense, like it takes a certain level of consciousness as an individual to recognize those moments even if they visit us all and you are someone you know.

The fact that you have been journaling constantly from a young age tells me that you are an introspective person by nature. I'm not sure where that came from, maybe you have an answer to that, but then you go on these adventures that are about self-defense, self-preservation, reinvention, reflection and then the trick, the hard part, is to bring it back and not let go. let it evaporate, but but knowing that you are able to distill whatever wisdom comes to you about the experience itself, but more importantly, what you learn about yourself, and then try to exude it to imbue it and live your life accordingly, of agree, yes and again.

You're right that the initial reaction of going out and going to solitude is a defense mechanism it's a survival mechanism it's a whoa whoa whoa I don't feel rooted here uh mentally spiritually uh so I need it, I don't know what the answer is, but I just know that I have to get out of here where I can hear myself. I think I know I have to get out of here where I can be in a place where I can receive some truth. So yeah, that fun challenge of bringing him back and yeah, not letting them take him away, which eventually happens and he gets tripped up, but even better sometimes bringing him back and playing offense with him, like he's going to go, I'm not just going back, like I can hold on to it.

I want to put it into action uh I want I want you to know that's why I'm such a slow reader if I read you know one of my favorite pieces of writing is Emerson's essay on self-reliance well, I mean, take that that essay that's about 20 pages long. It took me two years to read it because it's good, although the first paragraph I think, "Wow, I have to take it and see if I can apply it to life and see what the reverberation of life is in me if I'm looking through that lens, I that it takes me a couple of months before I can go back and read the next paragraph, which are the fun things that I like to read or the fun things that wisdom will come to me in solitude and that I want to have society again and you're right, It takes your sight away, you look up and say, oh, I'm falling back into some old habits, I forgot, I have to recalibrate, I have to go back to school, I have to sweat, I need to go again I need to go back through my journal. and see what I was doing when I was satisfied when I was successful when I was happy with myself my relationships were good when I had that automatic link between mind and heart and because I'm in a routine again so I need to go back and I found clues in my diaries of when I was happy in terms of what I was doing, oh, who I was going out with, what I was drinking, where I was going, how much I was sleeping, oh me. look now in my life I'm in this rut ​​I'm complacent about some of those things I'm doing some things that don't feed me and that's why I need to go back so some of those journals have been Good little maps for me to go back and analyze when I felt successful and happy instead of simply analyzing failures, which are more our habits.

I think it's harder for you to pull the trigger or pull the string and and and and know how to divide when theway to grab the steering wheel, because I didn't, because yes, you have free will and and and I. No? And it didn't make me think that anything was going to change after this life, but it did make me say hello while I'm in it. Remember that I have freedom of choice and I take more responsibility for my choices. Well, let's delve a little deeper into the conversation about faith, because I think Green Lights really is a spiritual book.

I mean, on the topic of green lights themselves, there's this idea that you can grasp them by virtue of skill intention. endurance resilience discipline hard work all of these things, but the other side of that coin is the idea that we talked earlier about how to design them and it's about frequency, it's about intuition, destiny, as you just said, it's about finding your way to the zone and it's about how you behave in the world to become a magnet for good things instead of someone who chases you. They, yeah, um, look, I say it there in the book.

I'm pretty sure the world can sometimes. I'm pretty sure the world is conspiring to make me happy. And what I mean by that is someone asked me this the other day. What are your trust measures, where do they come from and how and how do you have that with people here in my answer that I never answered before until they asked me if I came into this conversation just knowing you and you? have 100 of my trust until you discredit me until you give me reasons to distrust. I give everyone I have the utmost respect and reverence for people and I believe in the goodness of people and that no one is trying to harm me now that I am here.

It's not stupid, my eyes are open, I could hear your questions and maybe I'll hear you say oh, I think Rich is trying to sneak in here and trying to do something that's not really true, but until then I'm not going to trust 100 100 until that you Prove me otherwise until you prove otherwise. I have learned and believe in this relationship. Responsibility and freedom. The responsibility for freedom and liberty and the responsibility for the decisions we make today that make up the assets in our future. You can prepare for more. Green lights with the decisions we made today, that is, if I don't like cheating and steel, if I choose not to do it now, I think it's a very selfish act that I don't like cheating and someone will go wait a minute, too It is a selfish act like cheating.

Still, because you get what you want right now, yeah, that's really selfish, although I don't think so, because if you do that for the rest of your life, wherever you go, you have to look over your shoulder to make sure there's no nobody there. room you like to steal traps so when you look over your shoulder you're not wasting your time you're wasting their time and you're not present so you're stressed so you really didn't you really were. It is not a selfish act that you bought debits and yellow lights in your future, not the freedom of green lights.

I'm trying to live a life where I don't leave crumbs and don't have to look over my shoulder. I don't owe anyone. money, you know, I don't want to, I haven't been perfect, but for what I was wrong, I hope I went to apologize, I made amends and I probably still have more to do, I don't know that, but I'm trying to make decisions where I'm each preparing for tomorrow morning on a very basic level. What I have to do is press the damn button because it's hard to make coffee when sometimes you haven't had it and when you don't put the coffee in the filter you wake up the next day like why didn't I join?

So why shouldn't I show up here? Well there are choices we make every day to be kind and easy on our future selves and the honey hole of those choices I guess is what I'm chasing, where is the where? Can we make decisions where what we want is really what we need and what we need is really what we want? That seems to be the honey hole of heaven on earth right there where what is good for us selfishly is also what is good for the greatest number. of people that's where it really is that's the ultimate place, I think it's true that I don't have to do it, but I'm still pursuing it, it's not much different from the 12 steps.

I have been in recovery for a long time and much of The steps are like putting a person through a program that allows them to know, amend their past behavior, correct their character defects so that they can emerge and navigate the world by looking at people eyes, telling the truth, without being afraid. What do you know your wife will find in your jeans pockets when she's doing the laundry or do you know that you just like to live congruently where your actions are aligned with your values ​​and you don't have to look over your shoulder? or worrying about when that lie will catch up with you.

Yes, I've heard I've never been to the 12 steps or don't really know them. I've met a few people who follow them and really enjoy them. conversations in which we find a kind of focus and vision synonymous with things um, look man, it's hard to remember a lie, it's a job, man, and it's not fun, trying to make peace and go into every situation, oh , wait a minute. Who is all involved? Is anyone screwed here? What is the situation? God, oh man, it's stressful, yes, and I'm a sucker for stress and people who don't get stressed. I wonder what you're talking about, you're alive, it's toxic. stress you're carrying, yeah, it's not the right kind, life is hard enough with creating extra work for ourselves which isn't constructive if we're just running around trying to play defense to cover up our past mistakes, we're breaking down butt dealing with things then something that's not constructive or moving forward affirmatively, we'll find ourselves with enough uphill battles without having to deal with, you know, sins from our past or things or contracts that we broke in our past, man, try not to accumulate too many of them. and you have more energy to handle the real battles that we have in front of us anyway, yeah, yeah, the other idea that you keep kicking around in the book is the idea of ​​relativity and I'm not sure.

I totally understand where you're coming from with that, but it keeps appearing in bold throughout the book. Yeah, so the tool theory that I came up with is this: when we face the inevitable, we become relative now, when do we consider a situation to be inevitable? That's already a relative question, let's take covid right now, inevitable, it's here, don't deny it, don't sit here every day getting excited because maybe tomorrow it's gone because it won't go away tomorrow, so how do I relate to this ? well, for me, instant, for example, uh um, you know you can persist in a situation, you can turn around or you can raise the white flag and say, I'll fight another day, well, we're in greed, so let's not raise the flag and let's say.

Let's fight another day because we're all in this now. Can I persist in this by living and expecting everything that was previously covered? Yes, I could do that, but I don't see the net gain in that because I think. It's going to be around for a while so I have to pivot so what I mean by pivot becomes relative with this situation the inevitable code with that rental okay I'm forced to be home longer , I'm in quarantine. I don't like that, I don't like that, but that's okay, let me start looking at the advantages here. I'm taking more inventory of myself.

I'm spending more time with my children. I'm cooking more with my family in the kitchen. I have my mom with us so the kids are closer to her grandma than ever and she's 88 so that's good. Maybe I'll spend more time writing right now. I'm starting to try to find the assets I have the green light on. this red light that is written that's how I choose to relate to it, that's a choice we can make with every situation once we consider it inevitable now if we hold on if you if you if you consider the outcome of something you want if you Say, well , it's inevitable, like me, I can't understand it if you say that too soon, we're going to quit, but if you say it too late, we're representing the definition of insanity by trying to hit our heads while trying to do it. a different result by doing the same thing over and over and over and over again, so we have to measure those things for ourselves when we consider a level of situation to be an inevitable outcome for us or by getting it or not getting it and then how Are we getting relative with this?

Sometimes I need to stop being so persistent and resilient and say I have to go back to approaching this the way I'm seeing it. I have to dance in a different step. I have to lose my balance and approach this again. circumstance in my life this question this crossroads um there's that's an art there that we're all trying to figure out I think figuring out is when to consider something inevitable and then once we do that, how do we relate to it um it's that a little confusing no. , I got it, I mean, it reminds me of the serenity prayer, which is very much, you know, God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to recognize the difference. like it comes down to that, but I wonder if this comes, if it's a muscle that you've flexed for so long that it comes naturally to you or if it exists as a daily practice, if gratitude is a reflex or something like that. that you have to cultivate for yourself good question um look, I didn't come, you know, it was going back and looking at the 50 years of my life in the 36 years of diaries that revealed that understanding in the face of the inevitable became relative.

It's something I had written or thought about and opined on in the past and then tried to practice. Look as for gratitude, you'll know I was raised. You know, if you come to breakfast in a bad mood, Mom said. Go back to your room and don't come out until you see the rose in the vase and say the dust on the table they raised me on Oh, you complain about not having shoes, that's right, oh yeah, do you think I have it that bad, Well, let me introduce you to the footless boy, okay, talk about relativity.

We were raised grateful that the sun came out another day and it better be enough for you to be happy today, it better be enough. to stand upright because that wasn't a guarantee, so what are you going to do with it? We were raised to sink to the bottom and be grateful for the things we take for granted every day, so that pushed me in life to maybe see and be grateful for certain things that maybe I should expect, sure, probably yes, at At the same time, you know, I have a pretty good threshold for taking the context of a situation pretty early. in circumstances and going well what is my risk reward here how do I get what I want here and is what I really want what I need well what is the return on investment of money in the long term in the choice I make here am I doing something uh being eccentric for the sake of eccentricity oh yeah, well, there's nothing really constructive about that, that's not worth it, it's a fad, uh, that's not going to last, that's a lasting choice I can make here, that It will be good for me and good for the whole situation.

I could sleep well with that, it's not going to wake me up in the middle of the night saying oh why did you do so well? I'm not going to wake up tomorrow morning and regret it or think it was a one-time flash in the pan trying to make decisions that are going to have a lot of money, ones that are going to last, ones that are going to feed my good wolf instead of my bad wolf, you know what I mean, so I think a lot of that has been instinct and so now I'm trying to put it into words into a theory that I can follow, oh, remember you can apply, that situation is inevitable, when you think of it like that and how you relate to it, so it was a way of just intellectualizing almost academically something that maybe has been an instinct for me that I noticed when looking at my journals and how I got out of situations and turned some red lights into green lights, so it's not a function of every day that I get up and the time This time is when I sit down and journal and actively try to, you know, make a gratitude list or something like that. um, you know I like to say it this way, you know, I've been working on this for about four years, no audition, it's live, you're in the movie, everything is happening, life is the movie, you wake up, it's all , the record button is always It's always on, so when you're inspired, do it, we don't have to prepare you, prepare yourself, that's great, it's live, go now, stop talking about it, I mean, work it out a lot, be live is to prepare yourself.

I am a great preparer for roles. and work and prepare for things, but trying to look is like I mean, I've also had moments in my life where I sat there and prepared, prepared, prepared, prepared, looked up and three years later, it was like You would never have entered the game. You're still preparing, buddy, what are you doing, see, what are you so afraid of failing? Jump into the game of life, you know, yeah, it's more of an instinct that I'm now defining. One of the things you say in the book that really sticks with me, I mean, I highlighted a lot of things, but this is the one that really stood out to me is the idea of ​​being lessimpressed and more involved, yes.

I love that and it's put so concisely and it's profound because it applies to so many things, like being less impressed with yourself, less impressed with other people, not trying to chase other people's ideas about what you should need, trying to find your moral center and the The path to that is to immerse yourself in giving of yourself in the service of others, but to engage in your community, to know, to engage with the world in a deeper way and to commit to yourself in a deeper way, I mean yeah I got a reverence for you

rich

right now oh my gosh I got kind of a friend do you know how long I wanna talk to you man I think you're like that I'm struggling right now dude I'm so happy to be talking to you and it's like the people pleaser in me is what I'm trying to keep at bay so I can be present. and involved in this conversation, well, if you succumb to that and were to go, people, please, you wouldn't be, if you were too impressed with me, you wouldn't be involved in this conversation to the extent that you can be like I had that reference. for you, tuna, that you were above mortality for me.

Actually, I couldn't give you the real me in this conversation because I'm far from it, so if I have a reference, I realized it was shortly after my father. died when this came to me fame money people I was like wow uh my father's passing gave me the gift of going not all mortal things better look at them at eye level at the same time the most vulnerable part of that is all the things you are Condescending to McConaughey, looking down, condescending and putting yourself down is not dignified. I rose to eye level and the world was flat.

I could see further and more clearly and stood up straighter. He was half an inch taller and looked at me and was welcomed. to the rodeo, buddy, time to get on the bull, you know, stop depending on dad to make sure he has your back if you fall, that was part of being, then it happens, you know, and so how do I do that ? How do we do that? With full respect, I have full respect for you, you can have full respect for me, but now we can still engage in the conversation because if a person is on the pedestal above humanity and mortality, you can't engage with them and it's not even It's just for that person, it happens in relationships, you'll see someone in a relationship and I've been in them where a woman thinks I'm Superman and I think she's Wonder Woman, well that relationship won't go too far because we're both holding us up on an unbearable expectation of a pedestal, none of us can live up to it and none of us are really involved with each other humanly because we have so much reverence for the other projections, um, so no It doesn't mean any disrespect and I don't have less respect, actually more respect, but respect is a deadlier understanding of Iraq.

You and I can compromise, but if I have too much reverence for you or anyone else, I can't. really be involved with them and they can't be involved with me mm-hmm so if things change then that's what that lesson presses more involved is um you know, it's a little bit of the you know, eye in the sky when you're every now and then they're in the palm and hand of god or the cradle of when you think you've got it all figured out go to that google map viewpoint and look at this little dot on this spinning planet called earth and all these thousands of years in the ones where the tans of time move and you realize how insignificant you are and we look at it and say, oh geez, none of that matters, which is a very liberating feeling, oh well, take the pressure off, geez. none of that matters but at the same time what happened to me is that I left oh and that's exactly why it all matters oh here we go now we're on the bull now we're riding you know just when I saw how The little that matters to me is that, for Usually, when it occurs to me how much everything matters, there is humility in that right and I think humility is hard to come by for everyone at certain times in life, but you know, for someone who exists. in the world in this weird stratosphere level, uh, how do you like the connection with that kind of humility so you can engage in the world?

I mean, it seems like you always seem to wear that and you never have. I didn't have that and I have to imagine that part of that is because you've made this decision to know how to be in the world in a certain way, whether it's in the trailer park or in the Amazon or in wrestling. Africa with that keeps you grounded and level-headed about knowing who you are and where you're sitting, you know in the grand scheme of it all, yeah, well, also some of those experiences that I've had have been better than fiction for my.

You know what I mean, some of those stories I say, oh boy, if Hollywood wrote this, no one would believe it, you know, so they were more extraordinary to me at the time, you know, humility, that's been a word that I've struggled with. with this my whole life because for a long time I had the wrong definition of humility being humiliated humility we all say we have humility but no one likes to be humiliated oh wait a minute what is the connection of that word how can I be humble? but I still have confidence, how can I be humble but still have identity?

It wasn't until a few years ago and I think this definition emerged. I think it's Jordan Peterson. um, the definition of humility that I buy, is admitting that you have more learning. and in that definition I don't lose confidence or lose identity, but I am very quick to do it. Yes, I have more to learn now. If I can call that humility and go out into the world every day, I know I have more to learn. Move confidently with that humility and be humble, but boy, my first definitions of humility in my mind were almost arrogant, false modesty, oh no, no, no, that, no, I don't know, you know and I remember this.

I'm going to tell you that. This was a memory of this moment in high school, there was a girl, Renis Sherman, and I remember one day I came to school, I was a junior and she was a friend, she was a friend of mine, we never dated, she was just a friend she goes she comes she goes you know what

matthew

mcconaughey

you are a handsome man and I said oh come on no no renee is telling me that and she grabbed my hand sternly and looks at me and she says don't you dare give me that I don't, no, no, no, no, her, because you know what you have to do when someone compliments you like that, that's true, I do what she says, thank you and I remember saying oh oh wow oh, that's okay and I realized, but.

I didn't really learn how to live and understand humility. It was always almost a regressive field. It's like the word vulnerability. I'm still struggling with what that word means and how to still feel empowered in that part of what I have. Think about that that helps me understand that my relationship with the word humility and vulnerability is that, as I know, I want to be aware. I love staying on top of things, but I'm still learning. Being aware is also knowing. what you don't know, I want to know what I don't know, so that's another version of understanding the definition of humility for me, which I feel strengthens me but still makes me humble, well, a close cousin of those ideas, humility . vulnerability is authenticity and you know your arc and your journey is very much one of you knowing trying to get closer to who the real Matthew is at least that's what I took away from the book and I think it's a really powerful kind of illustrative illustrative.

An example of that is the macona sense itself. Can we talk about that with a little confidence because it's such an epic pivot? Do you know what another theme is in your book? I don't know if this is a spoiler, but you admit in the book that you were the one who came up with that word, yeah, which I wouldn't have thought, so that's being vulnerable to admitting that you're the one who created that and then that's the only piece of the book that my wife says to me yeah, did you really need to put that in there?

I'm going to sound so arrogant, I said no, I thought it was cool, I'm like I was admitting it, you know, I admitted it, it was look, I felt like I was aware enough at the time that I had been running some, in a series of some films that had, you know, relative successes and left their mark and was getting some adulation and people in interviews were going. man, you're really in a big race here, really in a big race and it occurred to me that this quarter like you're in this big race, you're in the street running and I was in, I think your race counts or one of those. film festivals and I said that, being a sticker and slogan lover, I thought, "I have to give this as an album.

I have to give this as an album title. Here you know, this sounds, this little movement in the that I'm in and people were like, "I'm in it, so I was like McConaughson. I said well I can't just show up and say yes, I'm calling it because, but in this interview and I thought about it right at the moment the guy went to the interview, I was saying yes and you." I've been on this race whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa have you been I was like yeah, I was talking to a journalist the other day and he actually called it a macconnaissance and he says mcconaughey, yeah, he says oh, that's cool, I love it, my insiders you like that I say, yeah, I want to. say, shoot, he said it sounded like it

roll

ed off the tongue pretty easy, it sounds pretty cool to say I'm with that, well, he wrote that and then he picked it, people started calling it McConaugh science and I just kind of followed it and then in the book I decided to say: you know what, I'm the one who planted that seed, I love it, I think it's funny, but what's so amazing about this?

Everyone knows the story, they know the movies you were making and then the movies. that you ended up doing, but that period of time what I didn't realize was how much intention and attention was put into making that turn that wasn't, first of all, lasted longer than I thought and then also that it was very planned, like that if I can't do things that interest me and that intrigue me as an artist and as a human being, I will choose not to do them on purpose and I will be willing to suffer the consequences of not earning any income and having your wife that you know by your side during that period of time, now you know you had them, it's not like you couldn't put food on the table, but it's still scary, you know, in Hollywood to suddenly say you're not going to do that you're going to become obsolete you're going to go back to work ever and you went through a really long period of time where it wasn't clear if you were ever going to come back no it wasn't and I did I don't know how long that sort of Sabbath drought would last and I shed a lot of tears on my wife's shoulder , one with what I was getting from my career, what I wasn't getting from my career, I was rolling with rom. -coms at that time I was a romcom mcconaughey shirtless on the beach and I looked him in the eyes and I still do and I'm leaving damn I was and those romcoms paid the rent on those houses I had on the beach where I felt guilty.

I remember seeing them on the beach once in Mt. I think they were renting a house with Lance for a period of time. Yes Yes. I remember I was running on the beach and I saw them out there. Yes effectively. So I looked at my life and I remember I just had a newborn stretcher and I just had Levi so the one thing I knew I always wanted to be is a father now come true and my life was full man my life was so vital. I would have had more anger I had more joy I had more happiness I laughed harder I cried harder It was just my life The ceiling in the basement My emotions were full in my life but my job was like another romantic comedy I love doing this, but oh, There's a new script, I think I might do it tomorrow morning.

I think I could wake up and do it and I thought, well, that's not bad, but damn, I want to, I sure would like to do some work that scares me. the right way that makes me go, I'm not sure what I'm going to do with this role but this will be an experience and I wasn't getting those roles so yeah I couldn't play the roles I wanted to. They didn't offer me to do it, so because I couldn't do what I wanted to do, I stopped doing what I was doing and I remember calling my money mentor how to do with my money, you've invested well, okay, good, because I'm point of being absent from work and I don't know when I will get a job again.

Call my agent. I spoke to Camilla about it and she said that she repeated my father's words to me. You know, okay, if we're going to do this, don't do it half-heartedly. -ass, let's do it, so I said no more coming home, well nothing came in, nothing was offered except romantic comedies for the first six months after that and I have to know what a puritan I was. I had that great. little story about getting an 8 million offer for a romantic comedy and reading it and going, it's a good script but no thanks, then they came back and offered me 10 million dollars, I said no thanks, then they offered me 12, 5 million dollars and I said. ellipsis ellipsis no thanks then they came back at 14.5 you know what I said let me read that script again I mean I read it again and you know it was better written than the original that a million dollar offer was more angles I saw more opportunities I saw more ways I could make it work, of course, werethe exact same words as the original script, but that offer was a better written script, but I said no and then that seemed to get the signal. in all of Hollywood, he's not lying, he's not really doing romantic comedies or action comedies right now, so what came for next year, nothing, nothing, I mean, I checked with my agent every two weeks, but basically it was like nothing, your person, no, person, no.

Grateful, nothing awaits you now that we are 20 minutes and 20 months into our sabbatical, I'm in Texas, you haven't seen me in a romantic comedy, you haven't seen me, share this on the beach, everything you expected to see. I pigeonholed myself into being just that and not being considered for other roles. After 20 months of that, suddenly what I think happened is that some producers and directors in Hollywood said, you know, it would be interesting to cast for this role. killer joe newsboy mud magic mike real detective dallas buyers club you know it would be an interesting choice a novel choice mcconaughey but I wouldn't have been a novel choice of those things 20 months earlier so the way I look at it is that it was a moment of unchecking for me again, back to the elimination process, I couldn't do what I wanted to do so I just said I had to delete what I did.

I didn't want to do more and I took the brand off for 20 months, no one knew where I was and I wasn't in your house or on your TV screen in your cinema being what you expected it to be and so on. Suddenly it became a new good idea and um, that was a yes, it was a sacrifice and I didn't know when that damn thing was going to end or if it would be like this and I entertained different career paths, I entertained getting out of the entertainment industry all together I thought that I could be a fourth grade teacher I thought I could be a high school football coach uh wow you really did it you really did that's hard to believe you were really doing that yeah wow I thought I might come back. in law um, I considered that you know how to be a conductor um well, there's a couple of lessons in that, I mean, one is to go back to this idea of ​​magnetizing the green light as ultimately and the second is to say no to get the Yes. , sure, like you had to do, there was this palette cleanser that Hollywood had to endure to get to the point where suddenly you were a good idea when you weren't before and that required you to say no, I mean, I don't know how .

Many people you know have the courage to say no to $15 million to make a movie for a couple of months. In the end, it's worth it and it shows the power of that, but it takes a lot of strength and conviction to commit to something like that and faith. and the belief of foreseeing that at some point it will bear fruit, yes, well, look at the Australian story when I was an exchange student for a year. I couldn't even believe that story. All is true. Have you gotten back in touch? With that family, yeah, every time I do Australian press, they're usually on the screen, oh my God, and you know, that year, before I left that year, the Rotary club that sponsored me wanted me to sign the contract to say I wasn't going. . at home until the full year is over and I said no, why do you want me to sign that?

I'm leaving for a year and they say no, that's what everyone says, but you're going to be homesick, you want to come home and I said no, you know what, I'll shake your hand, but I'm not going to sign that. They agreed to a handshake and I agreed to a handshake. Trust me, you read that year. There are many times when I had a good reason. get out of dodge and go home but I was like no man I'm in this I gotta finish it there's something in this for me there's a green light in this difficult experience I'm going through This madness I'm going through there's a reason for it , so keep going, don't pull the parachute.

Same thing with uh um, you know, this, the sabbatical from not working once I was on this, I thought I wasn't going to go. No, I'm in. I almost gained more confidence as I went. No, this is getting more twisted, but every day you don't understand, it's getting oh, you're in this now McConaughey, this is, this is backwards and backwards. Keep it up, something good will really come our way, so when those jobs came that I wanted to do, I was fierce with those things, I mean, my fangs were long, I chewed them and stuck them in hard, um, so yeah. was saying no, um, and I know there's great caution and moving forward, moving forward with resistance, you know, I mean, look, let's talk about this right now that we're in, I wish the code would go away tomorrow, that there would never be been here, so I want to To begin the next thing, I say that as people, individuals in a society, is there value in it for ourselves, even though we will have more tragedies and even loss of life?

Will there be more, will we have greater value? and understanding of a green economy? light in the future if we are in this longer because we paid the penance longer because we were stripped of our needs longer because we went through this resistance longer and we were tearing our hair out of our heads, so when we come out of she We don't go back to where we were before because we're human, we're complicated, man, we can say we go through a change, we talk about it intellectually, but wow, we go back to old habits like that, even bad habits. we go back to them and unless the consequences are enough or they get upset or the disruption lasts long enough for us to leave, no, my apartment has literally been moved, I'm changing my priorities on what I value in life because of this difficulty.

It has to continue with the things we are, we are kind of muscle memory switches that go back to where we used to be pretty quickly, unless it's a long enough penance to pay, you can't be the phoenix unless you burn yourself out , you have to burn first you have to burn God and it has to be inside like it has to burn you have to look down and you have to find many times we have to have scars not like ooh that was hot and not like oh that left a little mark black like oh no, I have a scar, that's your escape from burning oh well, now I'm really making the change, I mean, we're, we're, we're, uh, uh, what's the word, uh, we're stubborn. so you know what I mean, as people we again intellectualize that, oh, these things change, but very quickly we go back to our old habits, even if they are bad, unless the penance has lasted long enough, yes, there are always opportunities In these, in these setbacks and in this time of forced rest, you know, between the economic challenges and everything that so many people are enduring right now, there is the general discomfort of being still with yourself, that is so difficult, just like this mirror is in front. of us and forces us to consider how we are living our lives because we can't move right now, we have to be in that discomfort and it's debilitating for a lot of people, but if you can open yourself up to it, there's a lot.

There's a lot to learn from that. and you don't have to go to the Amazon. We're stuck at home on zoom, but we have that opportunity. Open your aperture too. We are in a forced winter right now and many of us, including myself, needed to do it. take one ourselves anyway well, now it's taking again we all have permission we're all on it we have our forced winter it's forced time to be introspective time to take inventory whether or not you want to strip away the necessities what do we have how? Can I navigate who I am oh I can't go anywhere okay what's one of our you know part of pulling the parachute okay I need to go out I'm going out to dinner let's go let's go let's get together okay there's some caution and be forced on ourselves and hopefully we're taking enough of ourselves to be able to take advantage of the opportunity in that to evolve, yeah, yeah, how do you feel about this?

You know, the later chapter in recognizing how you become this guru, you meet this person of wisdom that I don't know when it started, maybe it started when you gave that commencement speech, but at some point you went from being Matthew, the actor , to someone who you knew was basically imparting life lessons to the world like how do you think about that or how do you feel about that was that intentional or is it just a byproduct of who you are? I think it started out more as a byproduct and then it's gained some intention along the way, um, you know get back to that, uh, it's live, we're all on the show, the taping, the camera's always rolling, you know, and uh, and say, ask me, are you making legacy decisions for yourself right now?

McConaughey, are you living in a live way? useful for you and others um look I'll say this. I went back to the University of Texas and had an idea for this script to project the class as a professor, but in my mind I'm still talking to students. like I was there the other day, but then I start sharing things with them and they're like, "wow, that's awesome, thanks for telling me that." "Oh, that wasn't obvious" and I'm like "no, we didn't." I know and I started going, wait a minute, you have 28 years of experience acting and being on sets, Matthew, oh boy, that's true, add that up, you have some experience that may be innate in you now, which is novel for a student. you have something to share some experience to share that maybe someone else didn't have um you know share this this book has quite a few tools on how to find our frequency individually and hopefully as a collective. going through a moment right now great distrust we don't know what to believe don't just trust others suddenly you look up you don't trust yourself and that little revolution can come and go well now I don't trust myself now I really don't trust you uh now I don't believe in myself now I don't believe in anything and those are dead ends uh ultimately so how can we rebuild some trust I think?

It is through values. I think the values ​​are bipartisan and non-denominational. I think those are the solid stepping stones that we need to look in the mirror and ask ourselves questions so that we can get better every day and they will be incremental steps. This time, hopefully, into a more evolved state that we can emerge from and help us look back on 2020 as a true red flag year of recreation and recreation and a new beginning. I try to share what I know. I also try to show what I don't know, I share many questions. People, for example, come to me a lot.

They love Fouchy's interview with Dr. Fauci. He did well. I didn't reveal anything new in the sense that I like it. a sheet of bullet points about dos and don'ts and can you say them very clearly because there is no consensus here? I did that, so I was quick with it and I didn't ask questions that hadn't been asked, they just hadn't been asked, as a lot of people hadn't been asked succinctly, so I said, you know? I have a platform where maybe someone else already knows that information, but maybe I have a platform where someone else will hear it, maybe they will hear me in a way that they wouldn't hear someone else or maybe they did.

I didn't hear right, yeah, well, let's have those conversations. The Culture Minister's work that I'm doing now is very much based on that and that's me, you know, saying I'm going to play my favorite character, that's me saying I'm going to play you. your character and I like the things that wake you up at two in the morning and that I have been writing in my journal since I was 14 years old. It's always about culture, how we get along, what our individual responsibilities are, how we get along. to freedom, how are we responsible for freedom and how does freedom have its responsibilities?

What should I expect from you? What should you expect from me? Can we have a social contract here as humans? You know, because right now our social contracts are broken, right? Where are they? my person why are they partially bankrupt maybe I broke my own social contract maybe I let things slide and go out and act like I have a social contract with you I'm just acting like one and not being good wait a minute I'm not going to leave pass that I have to be one I need to be one that voluntary obligation we need to make voluntary promises with ourselves so what we expect from ourselves so we can expect it from others and if we get it reciprocity then many of us do that and then we make changes collectively the other idea is this we have to remember that we will never get there there is a destination I don't know it's like our lives and say america the langston hughes dot america, however, that is what we should pursue, but we will never get there with the social revolution, the cultural revolution that we are going to make, we are not going to arrive at perfect justice, but if we can make an incremental ascension forward, that is all, remain in the race commit to the persecution and to ourselves can we continue to persecute ourselves a little more and now we're going to ruin a long way?

Can the United States continue? We are an aspiration. Our lives are an aspiration. America is an aspiration. a chase of still um and I think that's who we finally are,individuals we should all be, we should all chase ourselves, what more fun, wild and adventurous thing to chase in your life than yourself, well there's unbridled optimism in that. that's contagious and I love that uh and I don't want to take up too much of your time, we can, we can finish this, you know, I can't let you go without digging a little deeper into where we are.

We're in this American experiment right now, we're heading into an election, we're extremely divided communities, families, people who are having a hard time finding common ground, being able to even communicate effectively and there's this layer of, you know, whether it's news. false information or misinformation that confuses people and separates us and I feel like we're fracturing and I'm trying to figure out how to fix it, how I can communicate with my brothers and my sisters, how I can be more empathetic, for example, how can I We look at what unites us, our commonalities, which are much stronger than the details that could divide us on paper or on social media, but I worry about what I'm seeing and where we're headed, so how can we do it? ? we write the ship matthew great question solve this problem for me and us oh wow, yeah right, you know, so I met before, yeah, these are times of great distrust, uh and the rest, in ourselves, our social networks .contracts are broken our personal contracts are broken we have no expectations of ourselves or others right now the private sector even the individual has more power than ever we cannot trust our leadership politics is a broken business huh what do we want people? we want security well, we are all individuals, wait a minute, what is it, where is the collective, uh, it's a we have we have that all of this is being politicized in the way the body counts are being added up for which side of the hall wants to win? those are the only numbers each side is counting, we have an election year, we are going to have a civil war man, we can get to January 2021, which is a symbolic day, but nothing more than a symbolic day, do we have a restoration of 10 years? we have a 20 year restoration, I don't know how long it will last, what can we trust?, empathy, one thing, a little amnesty right now, it's a difficult time for everyone, I don't know how to make a collective change.

I don't know how to make a general systemic change or a law. I don't think people want it to be legislated that way. I think again it comes down to each of us having to look in the mirror and ask ourselves: how can I be a little bit better, what can I do a little bit better? okay to be great I want to be perfect there is no better I can be a little better how can I be a little more fair how can I understand that my brother and my sister are also suffering maybe? in ways more different than me, how can I have a conversation without a condemnation?

How can I be more patient to breathe and listen and let someone who hasn't been heard speak louder than she maybe needs to, but still hear it? How can we make this time not just a flash in the pan? How can we be honest with the decisions we selfishly make for ourselves? They are also the best options for the greatest number of people and then there is no specific recipe for that, but take that into consideration when we make our decisions for ourselves um again responsibility and freedom we are going to have to build our way out of this time let's to have to sweat a lot for a while and I think we have to have that.

In the long run, that feeling is going to continue for a while, how can we make that part of our daily instincts about how we live our lives, how we treat each other? ourselves, how we treat our loved ones, how we treat our loved ones? Employees, how do we treat the people we work with? How do we treat what we are building and what we are? We are only for profit or we also have a purpose. What is our purpose? I'm not interested in politics, I'm interested in some purpose, although politics is a broken business, I don't know who to trust, that's what I mean by the private sector, down to the individual, you now have more power than ever to define your future, because in reality you have no place. no one up there no institutions to rely on for that guidance so get it man some of us go what the hell man gimme a map?

I don't know what to trust, I don't know what the consensus is here, um, some of We're going to do well right now because we can keep our heads above water, we're just trying to get through it. This time it's going to happen, we're going to move on, we're not going to turn the page just yet, although when it's time to turn the page on Covid when it's time to turn the page on the cultural revolution, the only way it's going to work is that the collective, all of us, all colors, everyone you have, code, if you don't, all skin colors do. together somehow I think you know as much as we are a nation of individuals and we love our individualism we are failing at any kind of collective responsibility we have failed with the mask of seeing it as a civic duty instead of a damn gift Won't you tell me what to do?

It's the wrong kind of selfishness. It's not really a selfish move to fight those fights. There is a responsibility we can choose to take for each other and for ourselves and those two are not exclusive. My hunch is that lies and values ​​My hunch is that it lies in responsibility, accountability, risk-taking, a sense of humor, uh, the list goes on and on and on, that we can be a little kinder , a little fairer, a little more empathetic, a little more understanding. a little more lenient also taking responsibility no, no, this will not be a free ride, I'm not in a kumbaya world, no, we have to, it's going to take work and the best thing about America is that when America is working well it's If you are willing to work at something, educate yourself, and pursue something.

More than anywhere else, you should have the opportunity to achieve it, but not without the work, the education, and the hustle to do it, so you know, I would say this. The man begins by trying to create more green lights for himself and others and he sees where those two meet and sees that actually being selfless is actually a very selfish act. Creating more for others is also very selfish for yourself and make sure you are. trying to make sure your selfish decisions for you also light the way for more people too boom beautifully put thank you man that was awesome appreciate your time today I enjoyed it super fun man thank you uh the book is amazing green lights available everywhere October 20 es the correct day, October 20 of this year.

You've been attacking this like it's the premiere of a blockbuster movie. I'm getting close, look, this is the truest permanent extension of me that I've ever been a part of and by any measure, I'm humbled by that and I want to do it. The first time, you know, if I see a movie that I have, I wrote it, I directed it, I edited it. You know what I mean? I did it, yeah, so I'm not acting in someone else's script being directed by someone else, so it's the truest permanent extension of myself that I've ever put out there and that's scary and fun and all that stuff and yeah, I had to put on my chin strap and mouth guard while writing it, but hey, you did an amazing job, I love it.

I read the book in just two sessions. It's super fun and I think it will help a lot. I think it will really help a lot of people. It will also help a lot of people. I hope it's great. Okay, I hope to meet you in person one day, but until then, good luck with everything, yes, at some point, hopefully, we'll take that trip with Dan. Good deal, thanks friend, I appreciate it, good luck. you