The Director of NNI & President of Infinite Banking Concepts LLC® (Pt 3) David Stearns - (BWL #0149)

set of clients, those are the people I introduce IBC to because I know where their mind is, I know where their assets are, I know how this is going to work for them just to get them to walk in the door and turn away. They are some of the best IBC clients I have. That I am? You know, it's great. Do you know what I said? I think it's a plural approach where you know that hitting people from different angles is appropriate, so it's all over the place, but we'll talk about this as well. You know, James asked me before what type of individual, professionally speaking, are we interviewing to become IBC practitioners for the most part and I would say for the most part most of them or are people like you who want to do IBC personally? or they've done it personally and they watch it for five years, 10 years, 15 years.

They see it, they believe in it, they use it, they use it and now they want to transfer to trans people to transition their career, transition their career from whatever they're doing to becoming an insurance guy that IBC does because They believe in it, they have experienced it. that and covid when it shut down a lot of people's careers and all that we saw we saw a lot of people and it was like we interviewed these people okay let me can I ask you? Do you know why you are doing this interview? Yeah I lost my job, well that's not good you know, I mean I'm sorry to hear that but when they say you know I'm doing IBC and this is who I am, I said who are you working with and what.

What does your portfolio look like? Well, this could be a perfect transition, so most of the people who come, for the most part, I say, maybe 60 are actually practitioners who do it in their lives and they and they believe in it and they want to do it professionally. now. I mean, I think it's appropriate that someone implemented IBC in their own life first before becoming an agent, but I also think there are people who think. Oh, I'll do this part-time and generate some passive cash flow and it's like you're in Fairyland, right? No, that's a problem and for some people who want to do it they say okay, well.

He said: what is your business plan? Well, I'm going to keep my day job and I'm going to implement IBC and I'm going to start doing IBC. I'm going to work as hard as I can to do it whenever I have time. do it or when I have someone to talk to, which is difficult to do, that's the hardest thing for the people I talk to and then when I get my book of business up to a certain level, I will transfer the transition completely from my day job to an intern job I said well, you know, I applaud you for doing that, but it will be difficult, so what I recommend that you do is that you start working with another agent, another experienced intern who has his own book for business, start working with them, okay, and that helps them with the administrative work so that they don't have that burden and then they can, that makes it easier for them to transition when they finally want to do it.

I don't know if that's good or not, but I think it's okay to be there alone, it's hard to do it without working with someone and of course if someone wants to be an IBC practitioner there and they follow you. that school of thought where they are transitioning from one term to the next and therefore they will absolutely need a mentor who is an existing practitioner who will work with them and help them get contracts if they need that as well. I want to turn to There's a little bit and you've talked about this on other podcasts and we talked about it a little bit before we started recording today it's social media and the kind of things that we're seeing online now are going to be on Tick Tock or YouTube or What do you have ?

What is your? Let me start in general. What is your? What is your? What is your general? How do you feel in general about the state of online IBC education? I like to sleep at night it's painful it's painful it's painful okay uh you know I don't have a tick tock account and I don't see it but I have associates that sent me you know Tick Play videos and say you believe in this guy or this girl, whatever . I think Tick Tock is destructive. Okay, obviously. World. Do you know someone who is like you? You know it's free publicity for me, right, if they call it right, someone, some people don't.

I don't even call it the right nomenclature and Tick Tock, they call it something else, they don't call it infinity, they call it infinity or something, but no, it's so many different things, it's free ads, why would I be unhappy with someone who do you advertise? you know my concept, you know my trademark for free, this is good, but what happens is, from my perspective, I'll get phone calls and emails all the time from people who have seen Tic Tac and it essentially goes like this: I know I'm really digging into Infinite Banking and you know I really like, no, you know, you know how you can set me up two minutes at a time in a minute and a half in your deep dive? over and over again yes and and so they don't know what they don't know what it is they have no idea what it is because it seems like you know it's too good to be true you know you know X number of dollars a month and you can, you can, you can, you can drive really nice cars and do and do really nice things and it's and and you don't do it and you own it man the interest goes to you you know you're making money. in the car it's like no, uh, so you know, that's it, I just feel sorry for the people who come in obviously through Tick Tock and are misdirected to someone who doesn't believe in what we're selling and they have they have their own idea of ​​how they want to do IBC and they're selling them the wrong set of products, okay, or they're giving them false information or they're leaving out critical information and then you have policy expiration issues, you know, the second year, yeah.

Okay, and then it's, of course, I guess the industry doesn't like that either, because it's you know, I mean, we create the energy to keep the message conservative and pure, and we're trying to do that. you know, make the public aware of the dangers of policing the

banking

function, like you said, because it's work, it's work, it's work and if you create a policy portfolio that includes more than one policy, then you better have your finger on those policies all the time. and know what's going on in them or you can turn upside down before you know it and everyone says oh obviously it's tax free it's tax free tax free well you know if you don't do it right then you don't you may have a problem, you may cause some problems, so we are Tick Tock is not good for IBC, okay, because you can't learn something in two minutes.

You have to take responsibility for understanding what this is all about and the best way. to do it is to read Nelson's book become your own banker five times listen to your book on audio in your car you know whatever and just try to understand the conceptual nature of privatized

banking

it is worth understanding the conceptual nature of privatized banking understand what You need you need a stable vehicle to do it, you don't need something that is vital, it has to be stable, it has to be predictable, it has to have a non-stop composition, okay, and then you need to have a coach, someone who is a professional who can retain you. direct when you deviate and that could cause problems in the future and I know I'm saying those are coded words.

I think it's pretty direct. Nelson used to use that same language in a seminar. you need a coach, you need a coach. but it's someone who can keep you going in the right direction, you know, by the way, Tick Tock. IBC is not about a bank, okay, it is about a system of policies that are built over many years. and you make sure that there are as many people as you have manageable interest because that helps not only grow your banks to give you flexibility in loan payments, it gives you flexibility in financing and, God forbid, it gives you more ability to collect a death benefit. if that tragic event were to happen, yes, of course, what will happen, it doesn't matter, it's a matter of time, but that's how it is, it's not about a policy, friends, it's about a system, you know what I noticed, there are many these Tick Tock people.

They don't appear in

infinite

banking.org's agent finder, well if you guess what wait a minute, I'm getting ready to be on Tick Tock. Maybe I don't know why because I'll be fine in my altruistic thinking. I am going to direct you to the truth. Okay, it depends on what you say. I suposs you are well. I mean, I'll tell it. YouTube has been a bigger problem for me than yes. I'm glad we're going to YouTube because you know it's in general, you know social media, so we're going straight to the Tick Tock. Well, YouTube has been very active for much longer than Tick Tock, so you know that 15 years ago you couldn't even find anything on YouTube.

Now there are 55,000 experts on it. concept of

infinite

banking or whatever they call it, yes, and here is a contrast that you mentioned earlier, if Nelson could do the book again, he would not have included illustrations, but if you search online on YouTube for all the supposed or related marketing of IBC, I'd be willing to bet that at least half of them try to show some illustration and you know that's how it's done. This is the company to work with. This is the way to do IBC. You know, I discovered the new way of expert, yeah. and here, let me show you in 15 minutes or 20 minutes or whatever, yeah, it's very pervasive and first I hear my clients, other people that I interact with, they see it and I think it can be difficult for people to discern.

What is it, no, what is noise and what is not? You're right, yes it's difficult, it is and from another perspective it doesn't completely deflect your concern, but some of those videos actually use proprietary software from the insurance company, I don't think so. I definitely don't understand how they do that because the life insurance companies cash the check, well there are still issues with compliance and this and that, this and that, that I've heard about, yeah, and I don't understand it. Why do you know why they don't? They are not consistent with cleaning that up across the board, but there are concerns, there are people who lead with policies who lead with illustrations and I advise the general public not to go buy illustrations okay, don't do it, don't do it, okay, You are just wasting your time, no, don't look for an illustration, you work with someone who understands you, you know who you are. understand what you want to achieve and it's not about being okay, you know, the way I lay out design policies, I get a lower commission than that person, so I'm doing it right.

I'm going to lower the commission, eh, you. I've heard that before I guess you're laughing Oh my gosh, no, it's about the customer, it's about the person who owns the policy, they have to understand what they're getting, they've got to know what they're getting, it's not like I want to get the highest first year cash surrender value you can get, what are your aspirations? Well, how do you want to use the policy? Know what? It's not about the biggest number in the first year, yeah, okay, that's it, that's it. I mean it's not about that if if if if if if if if if your situation is that's what you need and that's okay, yeah, okay, but you have to understand that that's what's best for you, yeah, and then. that then you know hints that I'm not going to have a need for capital is big in year three four five, so the duration, the schedule of each person's particular individual circumstances, you know how big a premium should be, how long should you pay the premium how long should you have the contractual right to pay the premium?

What happens if something doesn't go as I expect in the future? What I can do? How will that affect me with the policy I have and you can't? determining that by looking at a life insurance illustration no, that comes, that knowledge comes from experience and then working with an experienced agent and advisor, right, and it's critical, it's critical, you know, I'm 59 years old, do you think I want that they force me to do it? subscription no, now I'm voluntarily doing the right thing, but I'm not forcing myself to do it right because of a particular policy design that was less than optimal, fine, I mean, I know you don't.

I want to look at no, no, no, you're right, I think it's important that we talk about this, but on the other side of that note, if five years later I realized that this particular policy design was not optimal for me, right, okay, what do you do with the policy? You keep it, it depends on the circumstances, no doubt, yes, but okay, okay, please keep it, don't replace it. Okay, the second one, now you know the second one is going to be different, yeah. Okay, so I'm trying to make that point. No, that's a great point because we talked about it at breakfast.

You know, Ryan has the same experience. We talk to people every day. In different circumstances, maybe they have done this and discovered this. podcast or your learning has increased and I wouldn't have done that now, but I did it now. What I do? Replacement is almost the last thing to do. Recommendation, yes, and I'm not saying it shouldn't happen or that it does. It doesn't happen ding ding ding ding ding I don't care who the agent is if the first word out of their mouth is replace yours then that's a red planet that's a red flag okay red flag I don't care you know if the company is demutualized , II mean some companies like, you know some of them you have to replace them because they're going to be a black hole, but if that doesn't mean that each of them is a mutual holding company, you don't need to replace the policy, maybe you can speed it up, okay, you know, leave this.

Add or remove that right or whatever, but don't replace it unless it's very unusual circumstances. I agree. I'm glad you mentioned that. I want to mention this also on the topic of social media because there is never any conversation about you. talking about coaching there is never a conversation about service oh you know, yeah, I think there is this idea online that IBC is something that I buy and once I buy it, the business is resolved, I'm gone, I'm fine, as you know, It's like getting a car or going to the store, this is totally different and I think for me it's a lot of marketing stuff and this could be wrong, but I see guys on social media, girls on social media importing marketing strategies from others. lines of business from other types of product sales, maybe they are doing books or it's coaching or consulting or any individual online entrepreneurship or whatever it may be and importing those marketing strategies into IBC, completely ignoring that The nature of this business is different, like it's a continuous process, I mean. we're really just starting a relationship here no, you're talking about selling a product and moving on to the next, the next person, yeah, product, product, you know, sales, sales, you're right, yeah, and I, I don't know.

You already know this from an agent's perspective, if your core business is IVC production. Okay, how many clients can you handle responsibly? I mean, I'm talking about an independent guy. alone they don't have a fantastic team, they don't have a fantastic team behind them like you do, so it takes a lot of time and effort, there is a lot to train, yes there is and you have to be available. Can. I can't tell you how many times I get calls from clients who have policies with other agents and they can't get them and they want to pay a premium, they say let me pay and a substantial premium, yeah I don't like it and and I'm talking to them.

I know what kind of background investigation they have done. I know they have a highly qualified education. They want to pay a premium and, oh, Mr. So-and-So is out of production or Mr. So-and-so... and then he's decided to do some passive real estate investing on Airbnb, you know, and I'm wondering what I think and then I'll have the question because we mentioned it on the show, like if you were to talk to an agent you ask them what the nature of continuous service is and now I have some people asking me I wonder where you heard that from, but I will tell you that in my world we have a client advisor relationship and whether If you want an Austrian economic perspective or just an external financial perspective on something related to IBC or not, and then certainly everything, including policy management, it is important to have that relationship from which there is never talk in click bait. things online because they don't exist in clickbait one year, two years later, you can't because there's enough time to talk about it in two minutes, yeah, but look, if you bring in the online guru, that and then there it is.

You know, they have a million viewers, they have whatever product line or, you know, they promote and sell to their listeners and then they just bring in IBC as another product to sell well. I mean, they don't even know anything about life insurance, it's a high. Chances are they don't know much about life insurance let alone services, no, if you have a policy, that's fine, and then it's a lot easier to handle that, obviously, and nowadays with the Internet, some of these companies that I use They personally have I have a best-known online portal that requires managing your funds and repaying loans.

Whatever he says, much better than before. I used to call all the time and just like you, I would send a check to a company you know. for X amount of dollars and you have to write a check. This amount goes to Pua. This amount is used to pay the loan. Otherwise, they apply it incorrectly. That's okay, but it can still happen today. I hope the audience knows what I'm talking about because they do it because it's hard to reverse that after the fact, but you're right. You know, I shared with James today about this policy that we're trying to resolve that was issued a long time ago. well it's related to the idea of ​​service because bless them the first line of defense that these life insurance companies are entry level customer service phone reps and we're talking about IBC people who have never heard those letters together on that path and then all the technical elements of life insurance exactly, they have no idea and they have this tree that they follow on their computer trying to get to where they are supposed to be to answer their question and they Can't get service ?

You get the wrong answer or no answer at all and it's like you don't have someone who knows what the hell is going on in that policy to mediate that conversation and fix it, I mean I have the clients that have Paul are the people that are the other agent , they are orphans that I call orphans or refugees, you know they are orphans in the industry. Ryan came up with that term about a year ago, orphan, someone's okay, the agent maybe passes away or leaves. a refugee's business is this, they are fleeing a war torn country, you know something went wrong with the agent and the agent left so the client can't contact them, don't you know they sent a payment ?

It was misallocated or it's past the premium due date and they can't get in touch with anyone to figure out how to pay it, so I understood that we have to do a three-way call because the company has to listen. the voice of the customer to give permission and yes, and I have to triangulate that conversation to resolve this lack of service from the damn Tick Tock person oh yes, I heard you, no, but some companies are in the 21st century and they do it more easy, um. than before and there are even some life insurance employees and officials who understand the concept of infinite banking.

Yeah, they're catching up and I wanted to ask you about that, Dave, what has your experience been recently with the different life insurance companies? that as the conversation got better, it's a struggle what's your impression? has improved um no one has improved there there are you know there are companies that have understand it obviously from the perspective of the central office uh and they have it they will have a coordinator, whether it's a regional person or just someone from the central office who is their contact person. reference, but you know there are still companies that are big players in the insurance industry and they don't want to talk about it, yeah, okay.

Yes, and in my mind I think the big concern is that they don't want to allocate their resources to service. Yeah, obviously, like you said, because they see it's going to be a lot of work to do it as an administrative cost, okay, there's a lot, it's a lot of work and again, you have this whole network of agents and some of these big companies and it's like, man. , there are a lot of people, uh, we need to standardize, we will need to standardize how. they're doing IBC, otherwise we can't, we can't keep an eye on them, yeah right, yeah, absolutely, that makes sense, okay, so it's just a structural issue and it's profitable.

I guess don't do it and they figure it out. uh, for the death benefit, but there are some big companies that I see, there are ads that I saw in a Super Bowl one a couple of years ago, they talked about the benefits of living life, you know, the whole life product, which at least that's it. one step in the right direction closer, yes, yes, but yes, I mean IBC is good, it is fantastic because it empowers the individual, okay, that's number one, we have to talk about the control of the banking function, You're authorized, okay, you have a loaded gun, okay?

You see, you can, I mean, I'll talk about my father's mutual fund later, where it's like looking at it, you're seeing it, oh look, it's going the wrong way, oh look, it's going up, what was going down, it's going up. I would say that you know you can pay a premium, put a policy in your desk drawer and then a year later take it out, pay another premium, but never, ever think about it, but that's not obvious, that's having a lifetime product or any IBC product. is that if you are using it well to finance your lifestyle or whatever, then you have to take it into account because you are controlling it, you have to do it correctly, so that the loaded gun is in the hands of the client and something from these companies They don't want that, well they want to be in control because they want predictable results, they want to keep their drop rates low and I don't know what the industry standard is but you guys do it because I'm not in the industry but something tells me yes.

You do an analysis of expired policies, probably most of them have substantial loans or a precursor in the industry, okay, so those loans might not be auto finance loans. The way Nelson taught them to do it, you might be surprised, the guy has loans to pay his premiums. I don't know, it probably tells me what it is probably and they get to the point where they can't do it anymore because now the policy is backwards and that's why they move away from lapses, okay, that's why these companies might be hesitant. in adopting IBC, although it is something that the lapse rates are totally different from what we are talking about and how a policy is actually used, so some of these companies have been able to understand through the experience of the last few years that the block of infinite banking business that they have is very profitable for them, you know, because we are talking about predictability, the life insurance company, that's what they want, that's what any company wants, predictable income, predictable expenses, the premium Correct is an income for the life insurance company, right, the death benefit is an expense for the life insurance company, the cash value is an expense for the life insurance company, so even with your last ratios when they design a policy, the lapse rate is very important even in design law and therefore if you have a high lapse rate it will affect the profitability of a block of business.

Well, within the industry and I don't speak as an industry expert, you know, however, the business block that is currently in the Infinite Banking Concepts footprint from the life insurance company perspective is a beautiful block of business because it is very predictable if it is very predictable and it is even more predictable if the client is responsible and has a coach, there is no doubt that you may have to be an honest banker, right, you have to pay your loans, no you can go anywhere in the Free World and get a Well, I guess you can go to the federal government and get a free loan.

If you're a crony, other than that, you can't go anywhere in the Free World and get a loan without paying back the loan, so if you're going to value the third party lender's money more than your own money; there's an adjustment that has to happen in your thinking if I go to the outside lender and pay them six seven eight nine percent and I know that it's not all two or three percent. If I value your capital and your money at a higher value, then I would value my own money. There's something wrong with my thinking, so if I'm willing to pay the outside lender five or six seven eight I should.

I would at least be willing to pay that minimum amount to the life insurance company, yes, but the typical American Canadian doesn't think that way because they have been indoctrinated, yes, yes, okay, they don't understand capital theory. I understand that you know how to keep control of your cash flow by keeping it within your sphere of ownership right now and I think you know that this is much more than just life insurance, it's much more than that, well, you mentioned the rule of Nelson, you know, to be honest, banker, we pay off the loans, we're talking about online social media stuff, you know there's another variation on this is the idea that, well, when you do IBC, you know you don't make money off the policy, you want to get that maximum policy loan as soon as possible to go invest somewhere else um and one thing I point out is become your own bankers and all those examples Nelson doesn't start the financing process for years, That has been misinterpreted, people say well, I have to wait four years.

I have to wait seven years to get a policy. I said no, that's not true either, that you may have money available before. You can get a loan as soon as you have cash value. It has cash value as soon as you pay a Pua. It depends on what some companies have to wait a year to get a loan or whatever, but yes, yes, but you don't do it with IBC, it is not part and parcel of IBC to pay a high premium to generate cash value and turn to the right.Go and get a policy loan right away to get money out of the mailbox and I think some people on social media advertise this way and they will say that to do IBC you have to guarantee everything you own, pay a high premium . so you can just rotate these cash flows, um, nowhat you see today, you will see much more tomorrow and the mere fact that you are implementing this concept in your life. it'll help you expand your thinking, I mean, it's pretty powerful and overlooked, it's an excellent point, well, yeah, and then, um, I'm ready to close when they are, but since we're at it and I.

Know? You talk about a captive audience. Can I get my uh? I didn't write a forward. Know? I wrote what that backup is called. Can I get my support back to build your store of wealth at some point? in the future so we may have to remove this depending on what the answer is so there were also a couple more recommendations saying I don't really care about others yeah I know I know I'm like me . I care about mine, yeah, okay, thank you David for coming and doing this. I really enjoyed it, it's good.See ya, hopefully it was helpful and gave me some clarity.

I think people want to hear from me more often. You know, while I was preparing for this, I went and watched and typed your name into YouTube and there's not much out there, no. It's not like that, I mean it's okay for people to listen to it as close to the source as possible. You know, you know the man who runs the show at the end of the night. Nelson's son-in-law has been practicing it himself for much longer than most people. It's a value, it's a really valuable perspective, yeah, big deal, I appreciate it, I enjoyed it, man, take care of yourselves guys, thank you so much and thank you for listening overseas, thank you for joining us on the banking podcast with Life, yeah So.

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