Meet the Press NOW — April 8

If it's Monday, House Speaker Johnson prepares to face a divided Republican caucus and a growing to-do list in Washington, with Ukraine funding aid to Israel, an impeachment effort and Johnson's own work at stake, plus tens of millions of Americans in 15 states bearing witness. To a historic total solar eclipse when the Sun, Moon and Earth align completely, plunging parts of the nation into darkness, we are on the path of totality as the rare event enters its final stretch and President Biden announces sweeping student loan forgiveness plan that could cancel thousands of dollars of debt for tens of millions of Americans as the president seeks to gain a much-needed political boost in the race for the White House. two-e recess, but waiting for them on Capitol Hill is a long list of things to do, including approving critical foreign aid for Israel and Ukraine, approving funds to rebuild the key bridge in Baltimore, which President Biden has promised to the federal government will pay, as well as approve. the reauthorization of a controversial surveillance program all coming from the Republican-controlled House says it will deliver its articles of impeachment against Homeland Security Secretary Alejandra Moror to the Senate this week once again all eyes will be on the president of House Mike Johnson as he tries to navigate a path forward on all of these issues with a narrowing majority and a looming threat to Al him as President Johnson has pledged to bring some sort of Ukraine aid bill to the full House over the Democrats, although they have urged him to present the version approved by the Senate. came up for a vote and Ukrainian President Zalinsky once again urged Congress to approve aid to Ukraine over the weekend.

He said that if Congress does not act, Ukraine will lose the war. Now Johnson finds himself on a collision course with some Republicans in his own caucus, including Georgia Congresswoman Marjorie. Taylor Green insists that if President Johnson brings Ukraine Aid to a vote, he will move forward with his motion to remove Johnson as president; That vote, which would only need a simple majority to pass, could throw the chamber back into chaos, lawmakers on both sides of the aisle are signaling that the votes simply aren't there to do that. I don't think he's taking any risks. I think what you know what people have been referring to is the chaos caucus, those individuals who seek attention for themselves and try to stop all important work in Congress is now considered merely disruptive if Marjorie Taylor Green or anyone else makes a motion to vacate the presidency and if President Johnson gives us a vote on Ukraine, I and many other Democrats will not support that motion no we will not remove President Johnson um from that you can work with him um in a way that the Democrats couldn't work with Kevin McCarthy, so yeah, I think President Johnson would survive that motion by joining me now it's sahill kapor on Capitol Hill and Monica Alba, she's in the White House, so like we said, Congress faces a super long, very, very long to-do list, how does House Speaker Johnson plan to navigate all of this?

Well, it's a lot to navigate for a speaker just over 5 years old. months in office against a shrinking majority that is about to be reduced to two defections, maximum two defections that Johnson will be able to avoid in a few weeks, to approve anything without Democratic support and he is doing it, of course, with this threat to his job note he says that Marjorie Taylor Green has not officially activated this motion to quash it, unlike when Matt Gates did it with Kevin McCarthy, he filed it and immediately activated it. Margerie Taylor Green has written this on a piece of paper and is simply hanging this over her head without explicitly triggering it, if she does so it would require a vote within two legislative days and that would be somewhat of a challenge for Johnson to keep his job.

There's a whole litany of political issues that Johnson faces, starting with, as you pointed out, Aid Ukraine and Israel has a lot of dynamics within his caucus and some shifting dynamics within the Democratic caucus to navigate there, there's the rebuilding of the Baltimore bridge, where some of its conservative members demand conditions on Section 702 of the fisa and warrantless surveillance. powers that expire at the end of this month, the FAA reauthorization expires next month, they've been betting on that over and over fighting for a deal and a new data privacy bill that was just released yesterday by a top Republican speaker in the House and a top Democratic speaker. in the Senate and then there are a couple of things that the Senate is working on or at least has on its agenda, including what to do with Tik Tock that the House passed, as well as this expansion of the child tax credit that the House also passed in which he languishes. the Senate right now and the rail safety legislation that Chuck Schumer, the majority leader, said he wants to do while the Senate is about to receive the articles of impeachment for uh mayorcas for DHS Secretary Alejandra mayorcas and It is not clear that he will go very far. in the Senate it's not even clear that there's going to be a trial and saho, I mean it was a long list that you just broke down there and you did it very well but of course I also have to ask you about foreign aid, how much has been The politics of this changed given the fact that we now have this Israeli attack that killed seven Central Kitchen Aid workers in Gaza.

It's been shifting to the Democratic side for some time now, delightfully, for several months, as Israel's actions in Gaza have provoked. a very intense reaction, especially from progressives, especially from the young voters that the Democrats count on and many of them have been hearing from them, who have been, you know, they have been heckling them at events, they have been protesting against them, uh outside, you know it's their homes and their offices and things like that, so the Democrats' policy has been moving away from unconditional aid to the Netanyahu government, which will undoubtedly complicate the vote count in the chamber since several months ago, when Mike Johnson, you know, last put in aid to Israel. and when there was stronger support and then Johnson faces continued opposition to any new funding for Ukraine within certain Maga forces in his Coalition, these are not people you want to upset, especially in an election year, eh, and of course, Margorie Taylor Green. has described Aid to Ukraine as a kind of red line for her, something that could prompt her to force that vote on a motion to overturn it, as she has been a bit clever about this, sometimes saying that perhaps it can be combined with security US border, sometimes says that if he combines Ukraine's border security with our own border security, then she, you know, would try to depose him.

She hasn't been very clear about it, but what is clear is that she is adamantly opposed to Ukraine Aid, and there are many other Republicans who feel that, in the same way, it is something that Johnson must navigate as he tries to build this fragile coalition and Monica as we talk about Ukraine and with sahill, of course, President Biden is now coming under so much

press

ure from his own party for his continued support for Israel, it's the president's position. is changing at all given the

press

ure that's coming now from some of his closest allies in Congress and how worried he really is that there might even be a political backlash from Republicans if he gives in to some of those demands from Democrats and does something like put conditions on military aid.

Regarding Ukraine, I think we're on the cusp of a possible shift in American policy here and that's because that's what the president told Prime Minister Netanyahu in that phone call last week: If you don't take some steps to immediately rectify some of the humanitarian situation on the ground in Gaza and work harder to protect those humanitarian workers, then I will have to reassess and, obviously, the involvement there and the message, according to the officials that I have spoken, it was something we could do. What we do is condition some of that military aid, so that's not something we've heard from the president at this point.

He told the Prime Minister that he wanted this to happen in a few hours and in the next few days, so we are within that period to try to determine whether Israel is doing enough in terms of the commitments that it tried to say it was going to implement, so I think we're still in a place where it's too early to say whether the president is actually going to do that. He did not want to condition military aid and for 6 months he has not wanted to do it even though there are moderate Democrats who are pressuring him to do it, but the president has been the one who has really decided this foreign policy and has said that he believes he knows best way to influence Israel and that is by being a staunch supporter and backing it 100% when it comes to the weapons and military aid that it requests and that the United States is sending there.

Yamish. I also want to ask you about Ukraine, Ukrainian President Vadir Linsky, it's called US aid a vitally needed quote, of course it's still deadlocked in Congress right now, can we expect President Biden to try to push to Congress to act on this issue? So how did he actually plan to do that, given that, of course, he doesn't have the power to force Congress to do anything? He will continue to ask that this supplement be approved, that is something that the president of course has been talking about, but remember that in recent weeks some additional funding from the Department of Defense was discovered that was used through the presidential withdrawal.

The author went to Ukraine to buy some critical ammunition and artillery items that were really running low and, frankly, running low. That at least was some kind of measure to stop the gap, now there is a question about whether that could happen again or if it really was the last one, but the president has also committed and promised that he will not allow Ukraine to lose this war against Russia. in his words, because they did not have our support. So are there potentially other options or other ways to explore some type of financing? That's also an open question, but the White House can certainly be expected to continue pressuring lawmakers to do what the president believes is the right thing to do.

The Amish will certainly have a busy week in Washington. Many thanks to Sahill and Monica for their reports. Let me bring in Lt. Gen. Ben Hodes, former commander of U.S. Army Europe, so thank you very much. for being here thank you yish now Ukraine Aid has stalled in its fight I should say Ukraine has stalled in its fight against Russia I wonder how much of the aid that is stalled in Congress how much could really make a difference here when If you think about boots on the ground and what Ukraine is trying to achieve well, would have two or three significant effects.

Number one, obviously, the kinetic effect that gives the Ukrainians the ammunition they need to stop these big Russian ground attacks and also protect the Ukrainians. thousands of innocent Ukrainians who are being attacked every night by Russian missiles and rockets crashing into apartment buildings like the one you are showing, but it would also have a significant effect on Russia. Russia is counting on the United States to turn its back on Ukraine. They are waiting for a Trump election in November for real support for Ukraine to dry up, that's what the Russians are counting on and so if the president said we want Ukraine to win and if Congress passed this aid package that It would take a lot of steam out of Russia's only hope.

We have also seen NATO take steps to ensure that Ukraine continues to receive military aid even if former President Donald Trump were to return to the White House. What if I said that? our allies and our vision and their vision of our commitment to them given the fact that NATO is now basically saying we are going to take this step in the event that American policy changes. This is embarrassing yish, this tells you that our allies are losing trust in the United States and when they lose trust in us we lose influence over them yes of course our European allies should do more, they can all do much more but There are several countries that are given a much larger proportion of their GDP than ours, so I think we don't want to lose the influence that we have in Europe because all of our best and most trusted allies come from Europe, as well as from Canada and Australia, so this war in Ukraine is about a lot more than just Ukraine, well, I have to ask you what you thinkit would be needed for Ukraine to win here.

I know you've talked about what aid could do for them, what that would be like if they win, yeah, three things. Oh, and thanks for calling for Ukraine's number one victory to mean Russia's expulsion back to Ukraine's internationally recognized sovereign borders in 1991, which include, of course, Crimea. That could have happened last year if we had committed to helping them win, but that's the number. Number two is the supply of long-range precision weapons like Aack or the German Toist, which can make Crimea unsustainable for Russian forces and can also neutralize Russia's only advantage, which is its mass, because with precision weapons long range precision you can destroy the headquarters, logistics and artillery.

The third thing they need of course is the protection of their civilian population from Russian attacks, these illegal criminal attacks on civilian targets that happen every night, they need more air and missile defense to protect them and finally clarity from the States United to the president of the United States to say that it is in our strategic interest for Ukraine to defeat Russia and that we are going to do everything we can to make sure that happens, not this frankly empty phrase that we are with Ukraine as long as it is necessary, no one You think thatAnyway, I want to turn now also, of course, to the other big war that's going on abroad and that is, of course, what's going on between Israel and Hamas.

President Biden has told Israeli Prime Minister Ben Nan Yahu that he would place conditions on US military aid if Israel did not do more to protect civilians and humanitarian workers in Gaza. Do you think Israel is really taking that threat seriously? What would withholding military assistance for Israel's fight in this war do? Well, this is a very difficult situation for the Israelis. but also for the president, but it is an even more difficult situation for thousands, hundreds of thousands of Palestinians who were trapped in this terrible conflict. Look, Hamas is a terrorist organization and everyone should burn in hell forever, except for the thousands of Palestinians who live there.

They are trapped here being used as shields by Hamas, but they are being killed by Israeli operations and the burden is on the Israelis to protect innocent people despite what a terrorist organization is doing. I can't say yet how much influence we've had with uh. Israel and its politics. I'm sure there is some of that, but I can't say it yet, but I think it will take more steps on our part to tell the Israelis that they can no longer use American weapons or ammunition. inside Gaza, for example, or anywhere that extends or enables Israel's grand ideology, which means illegal settlements in the West Bank, doing anything that extends beyond Israel's borders, something truly amazing happened today.

Benjamin Netanyahu said a date has been set for Israel's withdrawal. Invasion of Rafa and you also said that Israel's victory requires an invasion of Rafa, but over a million people, of course, have taken refuge there, so I wonder what impact you think the invasion of Rafa could have? Rafa, if you think about the fact. that there are so many people there, especially if Israel takes that step without having a serious plan to protect civilians, that could affect their GA and their relationship with the US. I think this would be a catastrophe if Israel launches an attack on Rafa , a place with thousands and thousands of innocent people, if the Israelis continue with the same kind of tactics that they have been using, and furthermore, I think it would be almost impossible for the administration to continue to support Israel in any meaningful way, because I mean This would be the Prime Minister of Israel telling the American administration that we are going to do what we have to do, that is after Vice President Harris said that it would be a disaster for Israel to attack Rafa, for example.

I think that's the problem. The point is that the goal that Prime Minister Netanyahu has set for destroying Hamas is a completely unfeasible goal. You cannot destroy a terrorist organization. For 20 years we tried to destroy the Taliban, Al Qaeda and Afghanistan, and we never did it because you have to address the source that makes an organization like Hamas come into the picture and what keeps it going and just killing your way is not going to do it. achieve, there will have to be a political objective that is sustainable and, of course, that means a two-state solution.

I also want to ask you if he said he knew it would be impossible for the United States to continue supporting Israel if they fell out with Rafa, why do you think President Biden couldn't convince Benjamin Netanyahu not to act? go ahead with this military invasion I think they are not the Israeli government, this particular government is not convinced that the United States will ever use the maximum influence that we have. I think they're so used to Republican administrations always supporting them. um that they trust that we would never use the influence that we have and I think that um if this continues on the path that it is um and again I want to make it very clear what happened on October 7th, horrible for everyone involved in that.

The Hamas side should burn in hell forever, but that is not an unacceptable reason for Israel to use the aid we provide and kill thousands of innocent Palestinians. We will have to find a way to reach a two-state solution. This war is not about religion, it is about land, well, thank you very much, Lt. Gen. Ben Hodes, thank you, thank you for the privilege ahead, could the sun set on Johnson's presidency? I'll be speaking to a House Democrat about leadership issues and hello darkness, my An old friend will get a live report from the road to Total's final destination in the United States.

Don't go anywhere you're looking. He

meet

s the press. Now, welcome back, as we mentioned last minute, House lawmakers will have a lot to do when they return. a C capit Hill tomorrow that includes a bill to send additional aid to Ukraine that also includes aid for Israel and our allies in the Indo-Pacific, but House Speaker Mike Johnson also faces a revolt within his own party and to a slim majority and it is not clear how the speaker will proceed. I am joined now by Congressman Adriano, a Democrat from New York and a member of the Appropriations and Budget committees of the House of Representatives.

He is also vice president of the Hispanic Congress. Thank you very much Congressman for being here, thank you, thank you for. By having me like this, House Speaker Johnson will

meet

with members all week about aid to Ukraine. I wonder how he thinks outside pressure from Republicans might affect his willingness to introduce a bill containing aid for Ukraine in particular. I hope he doesn't get to you. I hope he keeps his word that he will be the voice of reason. We want to help Ukraine. The Ukraine conflict is not just about the United States, it is really about the European Union and its economy is about NATO.

It's about the economies of the United States. In many ways, because if there is a collapse or a crisis of the European economy, this will also affect the American economy, but ultimately it is about the human rights of the Ukrainians so that they can exist, their sovereignty is at stake and I think that "We should stand up and help them and of course the speaker plays a vital role in ensuring that help gets there. Right now they are rationing the bullets. Those soldiers are taking bullets to stay alive. We need to step up and help them.

And, of course, me." I am hopeful that the extreme magga Republican wing of the Republican party does not prevail. I also want to ask Congress about Israel. The recent strike that killed seven World Central Kitchen Aid workers has really highlighted the divisions among Democrats in their own party over the US military. aid to Israel What is your position on this issue and, in particular, do you think conditions should be imposed on Israel to obtain more aid? Look, I am a strong supporter of Israel and I will continue to be a supporter of Israel. I start this debate.

In saying that the hostages are still there, many of them are American citizens, we want them back, but we also have to fight for peace and this latest incident where we saw the murder of seven volunteers and I know José Andrés, he is. someone who appeared, appeared in Puerto Rico during Maria, appears every time there is a Calamity, a crisis, a human rights crisis, a crisis that impacts the quality of life of people anywhere in the world, so it does not distinguish a continent. the other and for this to happen is horrible. Do you think there should be conditions?

Do you think there should be conditions? there should be a code of conduct for any country we provide aid to now if you talked about, for example, the Iron Dome. which is something that is a system that is used to preserve the lives of Israelis in Israel. We saw how it works to benefit them, but there should be a code of conduct to protect human lives around the world, including Gaza. saying a code of conic, but specifically, would you vote to put conditions on aid to Israel? I would continue to support US President Joe Biden and his efforts to achieve peace in the Middle East and I will continue to insist on his efforts to ensure that Netanyahu and his government understand that it is important to respect human stability, yeah, um, and also in the last days here, in the last five days, we have seen Israel. allow additional aid to Gaza and we have seen Israel withdraw some troops from southern Gaza.

Do you think that's a direct result of President Biden's firmer tone with Benjamin Netanyahu? I think so and I think it's a start to a good conversation, but there should be There's another component to that as well and that's the hostages and recently we saw a serious mobilization in Israel, uh, Israeli citizens in the streets saying that they want those hostages back. home and that they must be front and center in any negotiation. uh that's taking place right now, the other component, I think, is that it's clear that Hamas is a horrible terrorist organization and we have to the world has to take a stance on this issue because I think we can't continue to move forward on peace, whether in the Middle East or other parts of the world, we saw what happened even in Russia with organizations like Hamas under, yes, the Biden administration.

I want to address another issue here, of course, the Biden administration announced an extension of work permits for certain categories of immigrants that you advocated last year for work permits for some groups of immigrants, are you satisfied with the administration's progress on this issue and wish the White House would move a little faster here? Well, I think very often we get into a debate about immigration that is very sophisticated and complicated right, but a work permit is a simple concept right, we're not even talking here about a p a path to citizenship a protected status temporary for that matter or anything else some of the other components of the immigration debate a simple simple concept a work permit so that someone can leave their house in peace, know that they will return home and support their families, it will not be a poor in the government and will help the economy.

In fact, the Congressional Budget Office just revealed that immigration dynamics will help the economy by $1 trillion over the next 10 years, so immigration is still largely synonymous with a good economy and I think that we should look that way and start. with a simple concept, a work permit, yes, I also want to ask you because there are a lot of things that Congress is going on and dealing with. If President Johnson addressed a possible repeal motion, would he vote to keep him in office? a democrat I will vote for Hakeem Jeff for president. I think he is someone President Johnson should have a conversation with.

He seems to be a leader who brings everyone together, even with people who perhaps have traditional differences on one issue or the other. others somehow he is able to bring them together so I will cast my vote for hakeim Jeff I hear you, I hear you Congressman thank you very much for joining us thank you very much and for coming Dancing in the darkness of the total solar eclipse We are live in Maine where the People have gathered to take one last look at the rare event you are watching. Meet the press, welcome back. Today's total solar eclipse in the United States is now in sight, but not before millions of Americans had the chance. opportunity to engage with science and culture in a profound way from Texas to Maine, people got out of school and work and put on their special glasses for the lucky ones in their entirety.

This was a chance to witness a rare perfect alignment of the Sun, Moon and Earth that brought Fleet into darkness during the day spread from parts of Mexico, 15 US states and theeastern Canada and the rest of us were able to witness the partial eclipse. If you missed today's excitement, you have some time to plan for the next total solar eclipse. for the continental US it will take place in parts of North Dakota and Montana in 2044; there will be a coast-to-coast eclipse next year. NBC News Senior National Correspondent Kate Snow is in Holton Maine, which was one of the last places in the US to experience this eclipse in its entirety, so Kate, I'm really jealous of where you are now because it's amazing, so tell me a little bit about what the weather was like today for the big announcement and the big event today.

I can't see the sky behind me right now because I'm in the square here in Holton in the center of the University, but Blue Sky, absolute sun, not a single cloud in the sky and that meant we had an almost perfect view, I would say. a perfect view of the solar eclipse and particularly its totality when it got totally dark here and we were looking at the sky, it was completely inspiring, but let me play you some sound moments before that, since the crowd here is 6,000 people. People live here and thousands more came in and listened to them count 6 5 4 3 2 1 Can we take off our glasses?

Yes, take off your glasses. Oh my God, wow, there's Venus, there's Jupiter, there's Mars, where are you looking at Venus the star? yes, below, these are planets, you can see planets in the sky, these are planets, it's the total solar, oh, it's beautiful, it's impressive, you realize, yes, it's yamish, it's hard to put into words what it feels like um, it's inspiring. It's this moment where everyone comes together, I think, and we're witnessing exactly the same thing and we feel like I felt so small anyway as part of this bigger picture. And just to let you know about Holton, I mentioned that it's a small town of 6,000 people. here they live here permanently, they have never had an event like this, they spent years planning just for today to make sure they would be ready and they are warm and welcoming people and they wanted to host people and that is exactly what happened a lot of people I spoke to today We are going to go to Texas and when they saw the weather forecast they decided to come to Little Holton Maine mmm.

It was amazing to hear people exclaim "wow" and see your face, I should say you looked like that. It's surprising for you in particular, so I want to ask, of course, how today's eclipse compares to the one in August 2017. Well, you know. I was in 2017. I was in Oregon, in the middle of the desert, in the high desert, with my whole Amish family. I had like 20 members of my family, my parents, my brother, my sister, all of our kids, so it was a very different experience for me personally. I wasn't covering it as a reporter, but the amazement I felt, the feelings you saw on my face that was the same and I have to tell you that I am almost tempted to go to the next eclipse in a couple of years, there is one that will pass through Spain , maybe you and I could book tickets together and we could go to Spain for the next one, right, that would be fun, definitely pitch that idea as soon as it comes out here, Kate, so thank you very much, okay and still ahead May former President Donald Trump make good on his promise to formally take a position on abortion. rights to his comments The Fallout and why what he didn't say is getting the most attention you're watching Meet the Press now welcome back, we have some new developments in the multiple legal cases facing former President Trump with just a week left until his First Criminal trial is about to begin Donald Trump's lawyers have filed a last-minute appeal to delay the hush money trial case.

Trump is challenging the partial gag order against him and argues that holding the trial in Manhattan would be unfair due to possible jury bias against him and Earlier today, Judge Aen Cannon scheduled a new hearing for Trump's co-defendants in the classified documents case, but we are still waiting to see when the trial will actually begin. Judge J Canon is expected to change the current start date of May 20 and today is also the deadline. for the Jack Smith Council's special report to the Supreme Court on Trump's presidential immunity case or arguments for that case are expected to begin later this month.

Join me now to learn more. Ken Delanian, NBC News justice and intelligence correspondent. Ken, thanks for being here, of course. That long list of cases is there, but we'll start with Jack Smith's brief to the Supreme Court that is due today. Do we expect something new from him that is difficult to know? We certainly hope that he makes the same argument that he made when he originally asked the Supreme Court to hear this case on a fast track in February. Remember that Smith then said that citing the president's alleged criminal plot to overturn an election and thwart the peaceful transfer of power to his successor should be the last place to recognize a novel. form of absolute immunity from the Federal Criminal Law.

I'll be watching to see if the Special Counsel addresses a potential concern for some conservative justices on the high court, which is the sweeping nature of the D.C. appeals court's ruling that presidents enjoy no immunity for official acts they perform while in office. In office, some scholars believe the court can decide that there are, in fact, things a president does that should not be questioned by a prosecutor; So, of course, Jack Smith would argue that Trump's alleged plans to overturn the election were not presidential acts, but the Supreme Court could, in theory, order the trial judge to rule on that issue which could then be appealed, which would be another recipe for delay.

You talk about the appeals process. How much time does Trump's team have to present his response before we have? to oral arguments at the end of the month, are due April 15, which is both tax day and the day the New York state criminal trial against Mr. Trump begins. We also have some news on the special counsel's report on President Biden. The Justice Department said it will not release audio of his interview with Robert H. So what else do we know about that decision? Yes, the Justice Department in a letter to the committee today said that the committee had not demonstrated the need for the audio recording of the interview, given that the transcript has already been made public, the Justice Department said it was concerned that the The committee's interests may not be to receive information in the service of legitimate oversight or investigative functions, but rather to serve political purposes that should have no role in the processing of police files.

I should point out, though Amish, that news organizations, including NBC News, are seeking access to that audio because we believe it is public record and we believe the justice department has no right to withhold it. We think audio could add context. to the transcript and to the question of whether Special Counsel Rob her accurately characterized President Biden's memory lapses and mental capacity during that interview yish Ken, thank you very much for juggling all of these legal cases first we, as always, can bet that we will now address the issue of abortion as Former President Trump has sought to avoid taking a firm position on the key 2024 issue despite weeks of hinting at his support for a 15 or even 16we federal abortion ban in a video posted on social media this morning.

Donald Trump made no mention of a national ban at all. Instead, he repeated familiar talking points. Many people have asked me where I stand on abortion and abortion rights, especially since I was proudly the person responsible for ending something that all jurists on both sides wanted and, in fact, demanded be ended. The view is that we now have abortion where everyone wanted it from a legal standpoint, the states will determine it by vote or legislation or maybe both, like Ronald Reagan. I am strongly in favor of exceptions for rape, incest and life of the mother. You must follow your heart. this issue, but remember that you must also win elections to restore our culture and, indeed, to save our country now, despite Donald Trump's claims, polls show that the majority of Americans disapprove of the decision to make and abortion access is widely popular among the American public at 70%. of Americans say it should be legal in all or most cases in latest marquet poll NBC News correspondent Dasha Burns joins me on set for more, so Dasha, thanks for being on here, we saw Donald Trump post this four-minute V video laying out his stance. on abortion, do we have a clearer idea of ​​his exact position?

You've had a lot of different stances here, but what did we learn from this video today? Yes and no in terms of that clarity question, I mean, before this video. He had been testing for 15 or 16 weeks. He was talking in interviews saying you know a lot of people say people are finding consensus at 15 or 16 weeks. There were some reports from the New York Times about uh, that it was something that he was discussing privately, uh, but that. That's not what this video is talking about, there was a lot of speculation, we knew this was coming, a lot of people thought maybe he would come out with something nationally, but here he is sticking to the state's rights direction, yet he didn't.

Answer the question I'm sure you'll be asked about whether or not you would sign a federal abortion ban if it came across your desk. That question is not left to bed. And there are so many issues around abortion and reproductive rights. that a lot of people still have questions, there are a lot of questions as you said, especially because former President Trump is a resident of Florida and that state will have a six-week abortion ban that goes into effect on May 1, and so will he. He will have to take a stand on the abortion ban that is happening in the state in which he lives.

I don't know if he'll take a position, but he'll certainly be asked on top of that in Florida, which is one of the states that's putting the question before the people: The Supreme Court just approved a constitutional amendment question for a vote in November to that people can cast their votes to decide whether or not to enshrine abortion rights in the state constitution, former President Trump. of course, a Florida resident, so how will he vote on that? I also wonder if Democrats have really tried to tap into the theme that the Republican Party is not coming together on one message, one unified message on abortion, does Trump's announcement today connect to that?

All of that will affect how Democrats will be able to pursue Republicans on this issue. Well, you are already seeing the consequences of this, where there are people on the left, President Biden, who says: look, he is saying that he is. proud to have overturned Row versus Wade, he is on the wrong side of this issue, at the same time you have people on his right, Lindsey Graham, this Susan uh B Anthony, the pro-life organization, the anti-abortion organization, who say they are disappointed with this. position of the former president, but I think he is somewhat disconnected from that noise at this moment.

This is due to the reports I have made. This is a topic that has been at the top of your mind. A key part of that message in that video, he said: keep going. your heart, but it is important to win and he knows that this has been a lost issue for Republicans who in the 2022 midterm elections, even some of the candidates that he himself endorsed, were very frustrated with the positions they took on abortion, so for him it's less about um. the rationale and the philosophy and more about the message, the rhetoric and whether or not this could be the Achilles cure for the Republican Party and there's this thing you said where you're ignoring some people who are in favor of this restriction of abortion, is it why?

He thinks that maybe he doesn't need them in this general election or that they really don't have anywhere to go anyway. I mean, I think what you just said at the end, I mean, even in some of those statements, including Susan Banthony in At the end they said, you know we're not going to support President Biden, we're going to do everything we can to make sure he doesn't win this election so they can talk now and say you know we wanted him to take a different position, but in the end they don't have many places to go, yeah, well, there are still a lot of questions left to answer.

Thank you so much Josha for being here and the next President Biden trying to steal some sunshine this Monday. Ask our panel if the new student loan debt relief plan will provide great hope in November. You're watching Meet the Press now. What was your title really? Welcome back this afternoon. President Biden announced a sweeping new student loan forgiveness plan. Less than a year after the Supreme Court rejected his first attempt to cancel the president called the relief appointment that changed the lives of tens of millions of married people,Tens of millions of people's debt was literally about to be written off, but then some of my Republican friends and elected officials and special interests sued us and the Supreme Court blocked us, but that didn't do any good, that didn't stop us.

No, I'm serious, we continue to look for Alternatives P to reduce student debt payments that are not contestable and in total my Administration has taken the most significant ones. move to provide student debt relief never seen before in this country's history, the White House hopes this more limited plan, with a different law as justification, survives legal challenges and Democrats hope debt forgiveness of student loans will also help them, particularly with young voters in November in general. Three of our key focus groups, voters in Pennsylvania, North Carolina and Michigan, said the president's efforts on student loans resonated well with me.

It all comes down to this whole student loan thing. Who can name at least one thing that President Biden has accomplished while in office, something that President Biden himself would say is an accomplishment Todd, uh, student loan relief Andrea, yeah, student loan forgiveness Mary, loan forgiveness student loans, anyone there, anything you want about President Biden's student loan forgiveness. I was going to say the same thing as Michelle, student forgiveness. Wait a second so if President Biden achieves student loan forgiveness you can vote for him okay so it's literally that kind of thought process yeah because as of right now it's nothing he's not doing nothing for me personally as far as I feel I want to do it.

Give him my vote again, amazing, so joining me now on our panel is Benji Starin, Su's Washington bureau chief for former Maryland Democratic Congresswoman Donna Edward, also an NBC News political analyst and Republican strategist Matt Gorman, He recently worked on Senator Tim Scott's presidential campaign saeni I want to start with you. I mean, I can't emphasize enough how much I heard, even from Republicans and Democrats, that student loan debt forgiveness was what they saw as a win for President Biden, but, of course, this new plan, it could getting caught up in legal challenges again, so I wonder how much the president wants to just be caught trying and how much of this maybe they're actually trying to do something right, it's a combination of both that he needs to prove that he's done.

Real, substantial profits on this so people believe you know they're doing it. I mean, one thing we've seen in addition to those focus groups is that for every one of them you have someone on Twitter or Tik Tok driving their white ass crazy. complaining about what Biden has done for us with student loans and they say we're trying, we've done all these things, but part of the reason they host these events is that a lot of what they've done are things people don't know. realize there's an option, they don't realize it exists, a lot of this is about making things automatic and just advertising it more and also not connecting it to Biden, which is like now you're paying 5% of my income instead of 10% of my income on loan payments, but I have no idea that's because the White House made a decision, so they really have to communicate the change at every opportunity, that's what they're really looking here and Congressman Edward just has this idea that if all of this backfires and people see him try and fail, I wonder if that could hurt the president.

In the long run, that could hurt Democrats if they see him doing something that ultimately gets blocked in court. Well, look, I think it's important for the president to try and look that he's already canceled or forgiven about $146 billion in student loans. However, the challenge for student loans for the president is that it hasn't benefited enough people, so that this announcement that you just made is going to benefit something like over 30 million people, so a broad swath of people who are going to benefit from these various programs and I think it's going to help them spread the message that you're doing something.

I want to stay with you for a moment, Congressman, because there is also the issue that while you were making this announcement there were protesters and they were gathering in Gaza and the civilian casualties there. I wonder what you think about that, the fact that I'm trying to say I'm doing this with student loan forgiveness, but there are a lot of young voters and also African American voters that I've interviewed that say yes, but you have to take a decision. better stance on Gaza I can't really support you, well, young people like most Americans are not single issue voters, so I think when it comes to that between Gaza, I think the president and the administration have to do more to hold Israel accountable for civilian casualties.

I think that's what these young people demand. African American youth. People of color demand. But I think the combination of doing something about student loans takes a positive step. around abortion rights and then, you know, trying to understand what to do around Israel and Gaza. I think it can make a real difference for some of these voters. I don't think it's a secret either. We saw news over the weekend. I argue that Biden is losing ground among younger voters, specifically younger minority voters, as well. I'm sure they're seeing the same thing probably before in their internal surveys, so I don't think this timing is a coincidence on that front either, nor when you're talking about timing. although now I was speaking during the solar eclipse, of course, I'm sure you know that maybe the two aren't related, but you know there is such a moment, what do you think of that?

Well, as a scammer, you have to try to get it. a little early, I mean, look, I don't think it was a coincidence that Trump released his abortion statement early enough in the morning, but in enough time that there would be time to cover it before the eclipse if I always wanted to get rid of she. some negative information. He would have posted what time he went, he arrived in the DC area around 3:30. He would have posted it right at 3,310 or so. The president's news actually came out earlier in the day and received tons of coverage even though his statement came later in the day, I think the timing is right, well Benji, what do you think of this idea of ​​this abortion?

Donald Trump's announcement came out today, especially since he's been facing pressure because abortion has been seen as an issue that could be a burden for him, well, you see the difficulty of trying to please everyone on this issue, which Trump He keeps saying what he's doing, keeps promising some big compromise that everyone agrees on and that everyone will love. today's reactions and why you might want to bury it under, say, an eclipse. I mean, obviously, there's Biden and the Democrats, they're not going to stop criticizing the fact that, as they keep bringing up one ad after another, even a new one today.

It's Donald Trump's appointments to the Court that took down Roie Wade and put us in this situation in the first place, but on the other hand, we're seeing some of the most vocal criticism from the right that we've ever seen of Donald Trump. I mean Mike Pence, who is no longer voting for him for quite personal reasons, issued an absolutely scathing statement saying this is a slap in the face to pro-life voters, some of the major anti-abortion groups were unusually critical of Trump for this, he just Picked up from all sides on this, I sure want to give you some sound, Matt, about where Donald Trump has been on the abortion issue, listen.

I am very pro-choice. I hate the concept of abortion. I hate it. I hate everything. means I cringe when I hear people debate the issue but you still only believe in choice only very briefly I'm pro-life do you believe in do you believe in punishment for abortion? yes or no it is a principle the answer is that there has to be some form of punishment for the woman, yes it has to be some form that we are going to agree on for a number of weeks or months or however you want to define it at the federal level, it could be state or could be.

Federal, frankly I don't care, frankly I don't care about the federal or state level, so I wonder if you look at everything he said, but more recently, of course, he was the president who put conservative justices on the Supreme Court who eventually overthrow roie Wade, what do you think of this change of position? Can he really change yet given what happened at the Supreme Court under his watch? I feel like I'm back in 2015 2016 when I was working for Jeb Bush and trying to pitch stories about his positions on abortion no one really cared back then, um, but I will say this: there is no politician who reads polls as part of their speech apart from Donald Trump, so I think others he knows the polls, I think more acutely than anyone else. politically, what I will say is this, you know, Benji's right, he's gotten some criticism from the right for this, but look, this was one of the few issues that Tim Scott during his campaign attacked Trump for being nice. of moderate on abortion that we saw and so listen to this a little bit too.

I think it will all come down to this campaign. There are actually two issues where one side feels like they are winning and the other side feels like they are being attacked. about that you don't want to talk about abortion, certainly against the Republicans through the Democrats and immigration on the other side as well and who can win that argument is going to say a lot and congressman I want to ask you, do you think the Biden administration is capable of connecting to Donald Trump the way he wants with this abortion issue. There was a Fox News poll that said only 1% of people considered overthrowing Roie Wade to be his greatest accomplishment. 2%, although he said it was his greatest achievement. failure, so there are real problems there, what do you think about that?

Well, except if you look at what's happened on state ballots in an election since um dos was overturned, uh row was overturned, you really see that the electorate really cares about that and they identify that as Donald Trump's responsibility and, frankly, the administration doesn't have to do much, they just use Donald Trump's own words to define where he has been and where he is on abortion. On the one hand, he cannot take credit for overturning the roie. Wade and then on the other hand he positions himself as a moderate on some of these issues and I think the electorate will see that yes, one irony of this is that for a long time, especially early in that cycle, you're talking. about in 2016, Trump's big weak point was with the right on abortion, he was trying, especially when Roie Wade was a pile of dirt, he was trying to convince him that he was one of them, so he trained and still I did it today to do it constantly.

He brags about how he's against Roie Wade and now how proud he is to have gotten rid of him and the Democrats have been storing all that footage. You're going to have hundreds of millions of dollars to make sure every voter at least sees the clips. of Trump himself taking credit and Matt, there is also, of course, the issue of IVF. Trump mentioned it very quickly in this video, but do you think that's some kind of responsibility for Republicans in addressing this? Well, look, I mean, when you talk about having to respond. for these at the state level, these are some of the issues that are trickling down and whether you're a congressional candidate, a Senate candidate, you're going to have to start talking about these things, you know they're going to flow downhill, so to speak, like this that these are the kinds of things that, if I'm back at the nrcc running Communications, you have to talk about when they ask you about IVF and about your abortion, you have to start calculating these answers.

Trump may say it may be a state issue, but eventually someone will have the answer, but Donna, I've talked to so many women in Alabama, particularly Republicans, who have lasting trauma from their doctors telling them I'm sorry, wait. , we have to wait for the legislator to allow you to start your family. Do you think how to do it? Do you think that will have a good impact on the elections? I think what voters can see is that it really trickles down and every time Donald Trump goes to take credit or, um, disabuse himself of the idea of ​​abortion rights, voters really step up and just say this doesn't make sense to me so I think it will reverberate from the top of the ticket to the end yeah well thank you so much Benji Donna Matt thank you for being here and we will be.

Come back tomorrow with more Meet the Press Now the news continues with Hy Jackson right now thanks for watching, stay up to date on the latest news and top stories on the NBC News app or follow us on social media