Wie wir unseren Eigen-Sinn entwickeln – Prof. Gerald Hüther im Podcast MAGIC BRAIN KICKS (#132)

Welcome to the Magic Brain Kicks

podcast

My name is Dr. Maria Hoffacker and I am pleased to welcome you back to the

podcast

today for innovative ideas, food for thought for belonging, and above all, lots of knowledge about the

brain

and today. I am especially glad about this, because I was able to convince the German

brain

researcher for this podcast. I warmly welcome Professor Dr. Gerald Hütter, I am already in Göttingen. Yes, sir, the brain researcher he was. The first to say he looked at brain development and the complexities of the brain and what we have.

Since everything has so much potential, perhaps we can hold it in our heads and develop it, the Academy for Potential Development was founded and an incredible number of books were published. written, so you can't say more about it, they agreed to discuss with me a little the topic of how to awaken Pippi Longstocking in me and how to deal with o

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bunches of socks because I thought it was a great idea. that you could develop some of Pippi Longstocking's qualities again. We have all seen in some way that times are not exactly good, so we have to be honest.

Maybe you could say that you are living in interesting times, but maybe that would be it. It's a euphemism. We have an incredible amount of challenges, especially young people, who also show with humility on the street and

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e are also many needs of people who don't even know which direction they are going and how we are going. we can do it together and that is only possible together and with the depth of robots and now all the climate conferences show it and the question is what human skills or how can each individual develop the skills that he really needs to be able to face together these future problems. with others and partly we are on the right path and partly we have to do it.

Honestly, I say I also come from a sustainability background, old quotes as an environmentalist and I've been doing environmental management for a long time and sometimes it's really frustrating, right? I have to be honest and say that you are also in the pedagogical field, so I also do a lot in pedagogy and somehow I think, my God, everyone should understand that, but somehow they don't, so maybe we want to give A few more pushes today and I know it would be great, so I'm very happy and my question is a little bit about the qualities, what are the human abilities that you think they have, the researchers say, now is really the time for us. finally develop them, so we probably have them, but what basic skills do you think are for current times?

Now, to really first see where we should focus on this is, of course, a very difficult question from the beginning. but if we stick to the problems we are experiencing now, you can see that there are only a few people left. There are those who can break with the general thought patterns that dominate this society and yes, there are some who break out in a certain way and when the others say everything like that, they say no, it is different and some have very strange ideas, but one society in which there is no one left who will turn left when everyone runs right and will stop when everyone starts running, that is also a society that is in great danger of getting lost together and that is how our human brain is made that, unlike what we've always been taught, life can be modified throughout life, which means it's not as fixed as people thought about genetic programs, but that we just have to, if you think about it so brutally, we have to discover it along the way like I did.

As life progresses, animals have fixed programs and instincts that know how they should behave. In our case, these instincts have largely disappeared and what we use as a guide are the ideas that we have and that we have developed over generations and yes. So we are actually seekers trying to find some kind of guidance. , which then pours into certain ideas, that's the way it has to be, that's what matters and we've always had to look at the leaders who have honored it for us, so that you as an individual can feel that way in your pursuit.

Life can change irrevocably. and apparently it also happens that an entire society or an entire culture can be lost temporarily and without remedy and then life and coexistence become more and more difficult and then crises arise that happen more quickly and become bigger and bigger. Problems in coexistence and then there are moments of high volume coming when everyone somewhere knows that things cannot continue as before, so we negotiate with ideas and now we have to try to find a different way and then you already suspect that not It's like that. It's that easy because you are a little attached to these ideas.

In some ways, they were often passed down through many generations and were there for a long time for you to live with. This is how we achieve this prosperity with these ideas and our position. in the world and now we realize that this goes on and on and yes, that is the big challenge that we face and if you then ask me what would be the decisive thing that would have to come next, yes, that is what we can still do. I have to do Let's talk a little more about this because it is not so good to say it in one sentence, but what we all notice is that we try to solve all the problems with the help of our naked mind and now we realize more and more clearly that with the help of our naked mind we can also solve many problems, we can create something like that and that means the naked mind that seems so important to us and that we even try to teach our children from very early on, what shall we call it?

Should they be able to develop all of these cognitive skills in kindergarten, too? I think later in life it will have importance in this naked mind, but it shouldn't be that way, it's pretty much just a tool and of course you have to have inner guidance for it too. What do you want to use this understanding for and to have failures in this area is terrible and that is why we have to do it again, learn to connect our naked minds with our own. I call it liveliness, so we would have to become sensitive again to what we really need and in this way we could probably not so much think about things but feel what is essentially important in life when I look at the current moment with all the confusion and avalanche of information in which we are trapped, but at the same time I see that there are more and more people who, faced with this situation, begin to doubt what they previously took for granted.

Then the ideas start to waver, that's good because the old ideas don't work anymore. Further, but it is also dangerous because now doors are opening to even crazier ideas. That's where we are right now and we still don't know exactly where we're going. They really are total seekers and of course they also try to find. Railings where things could go or somehow also look for each other Well, that's what I think a lot of groups or especially startups here in Berlin are trying to find other ways to work together and. bringing our minds together creatively and emotionally a lot and breaking new ground - these are definitely skills that maybe have been delayed a little bit because they said something like that.

Cognitive moving used to be like that, even if they weren't emotional. I know, where all these things were completely sealed and now it's more about fighting together in the true sense of the word to find other solutions, but I think it's also difficult because they also had that, these old researchers are very domineering. First comes eating, then comes morality, I also think about it and somehow it is still there, and that is a primary human thing. The question is, do we really have to grow beyond ourselves to overcome them? Let's say, old instincts that in some way are also there or how will you see why this is possible through collaboration or or these that go another way.

People who see have mentioned, well, what is now clear is that one of the fatal ideas that has brought us to this current situation is that we have been convinced that we are and that we have arranged each other so that We also feel quite comfortable. Let us tell you that people are individual beings in which each one has to fight on their own. way with their special abilities and then we have this competition and this pressure to perform and we also think that it is true that this is the case and that is why it is or has been until now.

Everyone tries to assert their ideas in front of others. which often extends to families, so there are also partnership disputes where two people argue, who are actually very related to each other and what I am arguing about is not the two people but theirs. Ideas and one person will have the toothpaste tube closed, the other will want to leave it open and then there is theater and that extends to the level of how we really accompany our children in life, so what should education really be? Should that be an education with contradictory ideas in which not only individual people? but also entire groups want to unite and fight together for their respective ideas.

Now we still have the Internet and the opportunity for very specific ideas, where normally you can hardly find other like-minded people in your city, you look for them with help. of the Internet and then you have the feeling that there are many people who also have the same convictions as you and share these ideas and then the others who have different ideas are beaten and that is a very unfortunate situation that has arisen and now we have to find the way for people to date again, which you already suspect is not entirely correct and that is why we founded this academy for the development of potential because it is also from a neurobiological perspective.

Where I come from, it is clear that there is more inherent to us as humans than we have actually taken to the streets so far, which means that there are still many possibilities within us that have not yet been developed, but we will not be able to develop them on our own. So each man for himself, everything we both know, for example, and what we can do and where we think, that's something very special if you look closer. Somehow we learned everything from each other, so without him. many books I would have read, I wouldn't have known anything if there hadn't been someone there who helped me learn the language, I couldn't even speak and if there hadn't been some adults who could walk on two legs, I could also walk on four, so that's all.

Our brain can develop these wonderful skills in relationships and in encounters with other people and the terrible thing from my point of view is that these communities in which you could do that are not the way it has to be for it to work. Now, to put it very carefully, but if you grow up in a community or end up in a community where everyone only pursues their own interests, where everyone makes their own interests. others the object of their intentions, goals and instructions and evaluations and then also measurements, then that is a community in which no one can really develop and development is something that is usually normal everywhere in nature, so it is can say that everything that is alive can develop like this and if you don't believe it, you just have to look and look at nature and see that everything is driving development, every daisy and anything you find, and that's why we can't help other people to develop, but development will take place when they are no longer trapped in any pattern or idea that prevents them from developing and something that really prevents us from developing is that in our communities we turn each other into objects and thus violate our basic rights . needs, if you will, we all have this wonderful basic need for the world that we have in them.

In the first nine months, it is also deeply ingrained as an experience until you could say that there is a connection in every cell, like one. connection and as you can see, this is what brain researchers call the attachment center, but it's also arranged in the brain this way, so to speak. Every child searches for that lost self to find connection again after birth and if that. does not feel completely unhappy then there is a mother who takes the name of the child and calms him down and gives him the feeling that he is safe and connected in this world and then there is a second basic need which is the one that we also bring from the womb because there Inside there is a piece that grows every day.

So we have already acquired many skills; It is not that we are born as a blank slate, but that we, for example, who were born here in Germany to a German mother, had already learned about this German language before us. were born, not the words, but the melody of the language, and in addition there are studies that show that children born to German mothers who always spoke German during pregnancy, these children have a special affinity for German and prefer Germany to any other language, So they already have this will to continue in this language, yes, and then you have these two desires,You could say yes, so we actually run with them throughout our lives.

We want to reach a state where we establish some kind of relationship. in which we immediately feel so connected and free. We want to be designers, free and autonomous, but we also want this connection and that is what we are with our current society. We could not endure these antipotents once here for each individual, often. but of course also when it's in a community and someone breaks out like this because I like this or I thought it was really cute, like you said, Pippi Longstocking's abilities are the ones that now could also be a bit of a surprise, or Pippi Lang could also do completely different things at school.

That's what we noticed at the Talk entrepreneur festival there, what's it like? Would you say you can develop it, so to speak, because on the one hand. Of course, it would be connected but, on the other hand, it would also go more in the direction of autonomy and also exponential growth at the end of the century. So someday we will really have to go in directions that are not foreseen by normality. I think we first have to understand why such ideas and patterns develop, because then we get stuck in a cage and then we cannot develop.

Pippi Longstocking is just a good example of this: nothing depends on you. , exactly, has been released, it seems that somehow something different is happening and what we have all experienced is that in one way or another we call it what we then do to ourselves. I had to adapt to adult expectations. That is, if mom had the idea that I would always clean well, then I had no other chance but to become someone who was always beautiful so I could really enjoy mom's love and give it to her. So there are many different parental preferences or ideas about what the child should be and how the child should be and then as a child you experience being treated like an object, that is, you are made the object of the parents' expectations and that violates both basic needs.

At the same time, that means connection, if in the conditions that I really want to be loved just as I am and not just when I am as they imagine, then I know that that is not a connection, that is simply what they mean to me and when they always I want to design everything like Pippi Longstocking and then someone keeps coming and telling me it didn't have to be like this, man, it had to be done like this and then you have to go to school all day or you have to learn this and not what we just like then I have to do it I have also violated this second need for autonomy and for that I need solutions that lead to a state in the brain where what you expect does not match what you experience, perhaps you could also say that what is really needed is not found and that creates a lot of inconsistency, confusion, we all suffered from it then when we were children and we can hardly remember it because then we find a solution very quickly and that means that I do what mom and dad want or that means that I simply suppress my need for my own creative options and then it works even if I've suppressed it well enough and don't want anything else, then I can do whatever everyone else tells me. and we are exactly at the point where we want to be, if this happens to a lot of people, then we have a society of people who are waiting for someone to tell them what to do and what not to do. entrepreneurs but rather dependent And of course it is difficult with people like that because they allow themselves to be seduced, then someone promises them something and then they run after it and since they cannot satisfy their basic needs, they do not feel good and then they always need something that suits them.

It helps you feel a little better and then you have to go shopping or distract yourself or you have to try to turn others into objects according to your own ideas. This in German is called adapting others to your own ideas. cart and then you get the idea, no matter how big the spectrum may be, there are also some who simply because they are always so hurt that others are not happy with them, then you are too stupid for mathematics, you often hear that then find a solution that means yes, that's right, I'm too stupid for me then you have the normal need for you to be a young woman and actually or a girl and like every human being and you're not too stupid for mathematics and In fact, you probably really enjoyed doing math.

That doesn't happen anymore because you've already set yourself up, so to speak, that you're too stupid for that and then when the teacher comes and tells you that you've written another bad grade, assume that I'm too stupid for that too. Mathematics then no longer hurts and what you can see in this example is that what we anchor in our brain are not the problems we have but the solution and these solutions are always found by the person. Well, not intentionally, but there was no other way, so if my father hits me and then I become the object of his violence, I have to look for a solution and what other solution should I find other than Orienting myself towards the father with his behavior is a success in the world and unfortunately that is this father who hits and there is a good chance that I will be able to support my children again later.

So the way he works is that he is not inherited. and it is not something that you simply do, it is something that you have a problem and your parents give you the solution and then you assume it and try it and in the family system or in the world in which you end up, everyone who makes an effort is rewarded. Yes, but that is the goal of life, that you always have to make an effort, it is not that at the beginning of life as a child you learn everything and try how to do it. playfully and effortlessly the most important learning experiences and that's how it really works by trying how it works and then realizing how it doesn't work, so if I bother my mom too much with my creative impulse, then she shows me the flu and she's of course this goes too far and then I know that I've tried something in a playful way it works and what doesn't work and then I know that it's okay until then it works and then it can't go any further and that's how I learn how to move in life and how to find my path in life and unfortunately now we have this different situation where we are constantly adapting to the expectations of adults and we find these solutions and these solutions are fine at first. but then they become more and more of an obstacle.

I always like to accept that complications develop in the brain as one becomes entangled, so the fact that one learns to suppress one's needs, one's life needs, is a complex fact. that I take the ideas and behavior of others who seem to be very successful with that is a mediation, then I run further with the same complications and now I am where I want to be in these In a complicated state, no one can develop further, such complicated people only they entangle others and that is why it is not really about developing potential, but about the question of how to get out of these complications and in German we have a nice name for that which sometimes fascinates me.

What kind of language do we have? When I free myself from my entanglements, it means I am developing. That is development is not when a personality developer imposes his ideas on what a developed personality is like on me, but when he. helps me free myself from my entanglements and now we are with Pippi Longstocking For me Pippi Longstocking is an excellent example of how a young woman has been able to not get completely entangled and now it is also interesting that Pippi. Longstocking doesn't have any entanglements. The mother does and the father is just an idea that there's a sailor somewhere or something, which means that the author of this story, Astrid Lindgren, knew how big the danger was of you getting entangled. with your mother and father, she still has one of those other children described that Pipi always plays with and they have mom and dad and they are very good and involved, they do what mom and dad told them to do and how can you not do it like that because she doesn't have one, now he forces her to do this.

To follow the pattern and adopt this idea that the parents have and that is why Pipi can do what she wants with total freedom and without worries. the way I want it, that of course is exaggerated and it's not like that, that's the two of us of course and everyone who watches and listens to us but we haven't found a middle ground so that's what I mean a little more your own or keep your own In this sense, too many are on the move, so they are always willing to do everything that others expect of you so that they can then find recognition in their community and be able to belong to it, then it becomes very problematic. yes, as I said, I also think it is a wonderful figure who created the first Lindt children and also a wonderful example like that perhaps.

What could happen today is that we all develop and of course sometimes we develop in such a way that one obviously bothers others or that again there are limits according to the motto that one is as free as one does not affect the freedom of others . On the other hand, that is what I am experiencing right now, but instead new ways of working can be designed. so that things emerge in the group when each person gives their development potential, so to speak, something that was not even thought possible at the beginning. Insecurities can also be endured by individuals, where some emotions arise because something develops suddenly, where the birth process occurs. a little painful in the true sense of the word, but I have also experienced groups that then together come to a result that is not possible at all, but the path was sometimes a little difficult, but on the other hand, this brain inflammation in the true meaning of the word really stimulated him, so, it was clear that then I would say that all this diversity came to light and that's what I think.

It's wonderful if something like this succeeds or can succeed, but they also say that you need framework parameters, you also need doubts and someone to deal with it, so I know that I can then deal with the fears according to the motto that this doesn't work for us and that was really there, so now I would like to understand education in another way in the strictest sense of the word, so that one can look at this process accompanied and see with alert eyes where is which child or which adult in this case , and young adults also want to develop differently or where not Even believing that they can do it, that you can push them and guide them in the right direction and that also gives them the space to try it, that would be one way to get the whole pile of socks which will then unfold so delicately, hopefully. a little bit that can accompany you on the path together because or do you think that this really has to happen in self-organization on your own?

What I think is the prerequisite for this to work is that you open your perspective a little when you do it. They are busy with these fears. Look, now the end of the world is imminent and all people are stupid. If you walk in, all you see is the end of the world and stupid people and if you look at it from a different perspective, then. Suddenly you realize, hey, there's already an incredible amount going on, so there's a lot of foam on the surface and something starts flowing underneath, so I want you to use the example of Pippi Longstocking to translate it into the concrete reality of our lives.

Today what we are doing here is not a planet that your parents have. Pippi's children. I should do Longstocking, otherwise it is an invitation to think about what can be done so that that child retains his joy of discovery and creativity and still feels that he is fragilely connected, then that means saying that he is loved unconditionally and now the question is. because that is somewhere with us now and the answer is yes, interestingly, there is and what I have found that is closest to that are the so-called forest kindergartens, which are completely different kindergartens, there are no toys because there are no toys, there is no discussion of especially sought-after toys.

This eliminates many stupid competitions involving fire trucks and Barbie dolls, kindergarten teachers who run or accompany a kindergarten in the forest are different people than those who go to the stationery store. kindergartens, so you have to try hard. You also have to be sure that you can control a situation when you're outside the room where things get a little crazy and you can't just close the door and lock the kids in there. , but now they run away and do what they want and yes, they are a bit like Pippi Longstocking on the move. Everyone finds something out there, so one person makes things with stones, another with leaves, and a third with pieces of. wood There are endless things to discover and create at the same time.

You will notice that as a group they make a very good team because they really enjoy doing many things together with others and then they build a dream. home or a sukkah or whatever together and these are very important experiences and we know from conversations with elementary school teachers. I know that primary school teachers sometimes have a situation like this where three four five children from the forest kindergarten appear in the first class. and they break the entire previous system in the first class and not so much as to drive the students crazy.teachers. But they don't let others treat them with condescension and they don't let others impose their ideas on them when they arrive first. they check their smartphones and want to explain to them how to find the nude photos, they laugh at them and they don't need them and they also give such a happy and self-confident impression that they become very attractive to others and then become the real leaders of the school class and not in the one who trumpets the loudest and realizes it, as is often the case now.

Yes, Pippi Longstocking is possible and if many children like that went to school, then the whole school would change and the primary school teacher would also have a completely different job, so you can see that the processes are underway and of course, This has long since entered into working life. It is increasingly clear that the old hierarchical structures were one above saying what everyone has to do, that they are too rigid, too strong and that they do not lead to people really wanting to get involved, so you can use Pippi Longstocking for hierarchical order structures. You don't have to use it at all because you have to have such a duty, since currently most of them drop out of schools, but that is a thing of the past.

An economy like this will no longer exist in the future and economic enterprises can only succeed if they do. having employees who think for themselves, who look for solutions together with others, who also identify with what they are doing, who enjoy coming to work and not because they have to and and and and then you notice that some people say where are they supposed to come from? of the schools. They definitely do not come from universities and where companies are, especially startups try to organize things from the beginning in such a way that new complications do not arise again and again.

Union culture. So first of all, you like each other, it sounds very strange, but you also have to like the people you work with, so just walking next to each other is not simply a prerequisite to actually being in contact with each other and that. Secondly, they have a common concern and that seems even more exciting to me and that's how we work in academia when we have a group of people in front of us who don't get along, we ask them what they do. you really want together, what do you have in common? If I don't have it, we can fire them then nothing will work and then if they at least realize it won't be that bad, we can look for something and then We're not looking for a goal that they achieved at the end of the year, we're looking for a goal.

A common concern, better yet, a matter close to the heart that is equally important to every employee on this team. , what they would like to achieve and why they need it, but the team knows they can't do it alone and then you get a community connected by a common concern and this continues, so it is developing, we can't stop it anymore, we don't even need keep going like this, suddenly they are so creative, they support each other, they help each other if there is a problem somewhere, each one takes the initiative when he knows the way best and there is no envy. and there is no jealousy, all individual particular interests are put aside because by pursuing these selfishness the common objective cannot be achieved and then it begins to become a community that pulsates and grows and that and with example it can then be demonstrated that there are other forms of growth besides you get bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger.

What grows is the intensity of the relationship between people, which is similar. The way it grows with me in my brain is also constant, but not in the sense that the skull space is getting bigger and bigger, but. in the sense that these nerve cells enter into increasingly subtle, increasingly intense and more complex relationships with each other and that is probably the concept of growth for the economy, after all, in the 20th century we have not yet returned to snow on the gross. national product and

prof

it maximization, but trying to shape the relationships between people in the company or between the company and customers and suppliers in such a way that everyone is really happy and wants to be there.

These are the by-products that then succeed, but no, but the work is not so that they create, so to speak, the quarterly landscapes, since they create a completely different practical value and, of course, there is also a corresponding different value consciousness that you can use these human things in this way too. intensity Yes, I am also very satisfied, I also experienced it in the groups in which the corresponding value is actually measured and then in the end, even in sales, purchasing decisions are made precisely because it is intensive because you are connected to it When you notice that there is a concern, there is a deeper meaning there and then you continue to work on it accordingly and people like to buy these things, but now in the old terms, no, yes, the secret is It's really very simple what they create .

In this way, these members of this system all have the feeling that their broad basic needs are covered, they feel connected and also accepted in this community as they are and at the same time it is seen that everyone who is in the Community is happy. when they go with their autonomy, make their own decisions, use their own design options and with that the whole store develops and they can't stop that and when you look at it like that, suddenly you realize what is happening in many other teams . , especially in the Economics team, what kind of friction losses are created, energy is lost, so we should not be surprised that we need that continuous energy that is essentially disappearing because of these broken relationships that we have with each other. which then makes people unhappy.

They have to do it, because things are very bad, they have to indulge in something and treat themselves and then they have to use their free time for it and then, in their free time, they spend a lot of energy again. and yes, consumption: these are all substitute satisfactions that in the end lead us to destroy this planet, eat it and ruin it when, so to speak, this spark or this virus is transmitted so that you realize how good it is for you in the truest sense. of the word, especially the word virus because maybe we are infected by the wrong ones, but I think that even if you now approach the role, how do you get or how do you get them to say yes to the managers and especially to everyone who In the teaching area, other qualities are also required, so I also notice that you give him the space for that and also sometimes you can really lead if something gets a little bit out of control, that you have to give him that sense of purpose, these concerns. clear, so to speak, and ultimately the insecurities that individual people have during this development process or maybe don't fully integrate into the community in a way that they can.

I'm allowed to catch up and give myself the space to develop these things and also be able to withstand tensions and fears and so on, so that the team can learn, but I think, um, I wanted to get out there again, what kind of people are they now, between quotes, adults or leaders who create this space for these things to be possible because this is probably possible for the first time in the Academy for Potential Development, so people first have to experience it and it's great to do it and it's not really necessary all ? This substitute satisfaction no longer exists and then you continue to look for these new communities and other forms and, so to speak, logically you get different ideas about the cooperation between economies and the connection with nature.

What we see over and over again is that in the moment this happens. a community finds a common concern. Then this common concern becomes the compass that guides the actions of individuals and the way they shape their interaction and said community no longer needs a manager and that is why I sometimes tell managers that their most important task The important thing is that they actually have some unnecessary data and there are not many who understand what that means, which means that I have to do everything I can to do it, I have to invite my staff, encourage and inspire my employees, take responsibility. responsibility for yourself, for the team and for what we do here.

If the team wants to do it themselves, if they can do it and then take responsibility themselves, I can step back and basically only then am I really a manager because then I can oversee the whole thing from this meta position from this stepped back point of view and then also I can notice changes outside and in the company that I cannot see otherwise when I am like a donkey driver and I am constantly busy with the whip and the carrot by which I have to hold the donkey so that it runs to where I was I want to have it there and now it comes, but today they close the circle again with Pippi Longstocking.

Managers who I tell this to. They often post messages and say I can't do that, then I wouldn't be a manager anymore, exactly, and then I can't speak very well anymore because they wouldn't be able to understand what I would have to say. not anymore, but what you really have to say is when you really need others to whom you can comment, who you have to make the object of your instructions, your interviews with employees and your evaluations, or at the end of your measures, if you really need then unfortunately you are a needy person then you are not a manager then you are someone who for some reason is missing something which you are now compensating for by giving orders to others and if you keep looking for what might be missing then you realize that you didn't have the two basic needs that he could not satisfy.

He does not have this connection with himself, with life, with other people, with nature and he does not feel free as a manager either. He always knows that if he doesn't meet the requirements of the company at the top, he will be kicked out of it, so he will be more trapped in this structure, this pecking order structure, and whoever can do it. If you do not satisfy your old basic needs in this way, like Pippi Longstocking, you will become someone who tries to assert yourself in some way and usually at the expense of others, turning them into an object and then the circle closes and others have to do the same. same. someone is an object again and like that he goes down the whole staircase and you can't go on like that, that's the old school episode of the century, it took people to just say what the manager said and where we ended up, we've seen so you can have managers until thenthe abysses leaders, or people burn out and get sick, etc., I think so, but that's why I got into it a little bit, so to speak, because I experience that these leadership opportunities also exist with teachers and teachers after motherhood.

I give the power, like I flew, in reality I'm still there so let this be clear, I give the space, I accompany, I develop and of course, in case of doubt, I have to go up because she is always there. in a sandwich position like that to represent that is not easy at all, on the contrary, you need a very clear or very great clarity of your own development process, your own connection and also to be able to bear that, perhaps even separately, from the outside, Looking at these meters is also sometimes like that. It is not so easy to bear, no, but it is they who really have leadership or the new leaders or the teachers who can really bear to become superfluous in case of doubt, but they are not superfluous, they say that the opposite is urgently needed.

I have a concrete example of school and how learning works and what role teachers play in it. There is a truly inexplicable phenomenon that is relatively. well said stupid students most kids can't do anything in school but they can pass driving school okay almost no one is stupid enough to not be able to pass this driving school test and you have to wonder which one It's the difference. and what the difference is is completely banal. A small adjustment in the driving school has made a separation between the person who helps the student learn what she needs and the person who helps the student, but not the person who then checks if she has understood. everything and if it is possible, that means that we need it and then it means that the driving school student has confidence in the teacher and is supported by him and and is helped and then everyone does it, but that the prerequisite for this is that be not the teacher of the driving school in question Then the test is taken and at the school we do exactly that and then I said do it somehow, so that you separate it, I have also written to one or two of the. ministers of education who have always said that came back into the discussion and what I later discovered is that there were teachers, no less, who then said yes, but if I don't give the grades now, it will mean that the students learning from the teacher how it works photosynthesis, for example, or the integral calculation and then now there is a certificate that can be done digitally, which you acquire by showing that you can do all that and also the thumb identification or whatever, everything works. so and if I tell the teacher to the teachers then I suggest to them, so to speak, but then I will no longer be a real teacher and thenwe will once again have in front of us needy people who absolutely have to evaluate others who, in these prominent positions of power, only feel important and significant, so to speak, and that is simply sad about this Example, for which it is also of course how difficult such a process is and I think that everyone who listens to us now and identifies themselves in quotes through a company through a certain position that he or she has through a I don't know what kind of title that, for so to speak, you can try, what is it like without it, so if I introduce myself with my first name, so to speak, or enter an environment where people don't even know me and where maybe I don't tell half of my CV beforehand to gain respect, but just by trying I feel like I'm in such a new field and how can I convince myself without having to make a breakthrough, so to speak?

I think something like that would also help to see each other there another time. No, that's always said and I don't believe it. The optimal strategy is that you can always imagine yourself in your blocks because you are so identified with it that it is part of your self-image and that is why I think one should try to invite and encourage people to ask themselves questions like these. The solution they came up with is that, for example, you always have to make others the object of your evaluation and then I discovered that almost everyone can tell when they started doing that, usually when they were kids at home with mom and dad and they too they can do it Describe the emergency situation in which you did it.

Mom always said put your shoes on right and then I said stupid mom for the first time, wonderful, that's all, then it happened and then I kept saying stupid mom and Then I made others say things and then I found other people who also thought their parents were stupid and then we tried to ignore their parents, so to speak, and then we belittled them and yeah, and then we also dominated the peer group and then we were managers. you become someone who then simply dominates others and when you realize that you were not born with it and that it is not part of your personality, but that it was a solution that you found and unfortunately it is still becoming more and more successful, you have been thrown away. and that's actually a big complication because now you're stuck there and you can't do anything else because you've identified with it, so people might get the idea and say no, I'm not doing it.

I don't want that anymore, I don't want to be a prisoner of my own ideas and the solution once found, and then they're on their way somewhere else and that's something there, they don't have to prove something in some way, but they have to do it. something. a decision whether they want to continue like this or not. People who have then made a decision and what they then see is that they suddenly become authentic, they become free, the light shines again on their faces, they have the desire again and that's it. development, to get out of the entanglements that one gets into throughout life.

There is more to do, by the way, we are doing something like this from the academy, which we call an aid program for all those who want to free themselves from their entanglements, but we will have to wait until spring to achieve it. The key then is really self-reflection or self-reflection accompanied yes not through that it is an accompaniment but a support and a slightly unhealthy direction. They're set up on the side, but everyone has to go through the process alone, so no one can change someone else, only you can do that and that. You will only want to change yourself if you believe that is good and you also have to understand that what you previously thought was right was actually more of an obstacle, that you were walking around as a needy person, driven by these undisturbed needs.

As a result, you were also someone who constantly needed others to strengthen themselves and that is much better than being someone who is not as motivated and who is with himself and can give something to others, but is not innate with other people but can get lost. In the course of life and the great opportunity that we humans have, unlike animals that still walk with their instincts, you cannot change them, the great opportunity we have is that at some point we recognize ourselves as being so complicated and that then we can decide to get out of that and I think that's possible, so if you're at the point where you want to do that, maybe it's good if you find two or three other people who also do something like that so you can get there not just like grass in the wind, because that is a A different life that arises suddenly is more beautiful, it is more attractive, but then you have the same way that someone with stubbornness in a crowd sometimes has difficulties and that's it.

It's also easier if you find others who have a similar stubbornness, then it is. You better really look for the environment where the other stubborn people are outside and can pollinate each other a little, and above all, you can always reflect on yourself, I don't think so because it's a process, that's why I think these barriers that you just mentioned are Well, you can be people but also other situations in which you voluntarily put yourself to return to CS or yes, something else, because it is also a process that you recognize, okay, where really? I take it and then there are some leftover things or suddenly when I have removed it with the shovel I reach the lower area or something else No, then they are things that logically, in the true sense of the word, involve a bit of high-level work . deep inside yourself, no, along the way when you suddenly start to recognize your own stupidity, yes, absolutely, yes, I think it's funny too.

Sometimes it hurts, there is no doubt, you can look at us and listen to us. here, if you give me something to think about, maybe some suggestions and I'm glad we were able to discuss this so well between us, I'm free to go, you're completely on my side. Thank you so much. Rita for the many fundamental ideas and we hope that many people take this path of self-development. Thank you all very much and see you too.