Douglas Murray: "The rise of anti-Semitism is a sign of a society in decline"

Well, thank you very much for that warm introduction. It is a great pleasure for me to be back here in the Netherlands, a country where I spent quite a bit of time in the past. I have many friends and I think very fondly of um. Sometimes I remember a few years ago a Dutch friend of mine visited me in London and said, uh, I won't do the accent, but he said, uh, what are people in London saying about the Netherlands these days? I got caught a little bit and said not everyone is talking about you. You said um, but I think that's their problem, not yours.

There is a good reason to focus on this country. I think it is a fascinating and important country, with a rich population. history and a potentially very rich rich future, as well as all of us, depends on you doing things right, but I wanted to talk tonight on the topic of anti-Semitism and let me start with relatively recent events, after the The nature of the attacks of 7 October became clear. I said, hey, sometimes in your life a flare goes off and you can see everyone exactly where they are, everyone gets stuck exactly where they are. I thought that partly because I was in New York on the 7th and the next day there was an immediately planned protest in Times Square, it wasn't a protest in support of the Israelis who had already been massacred, it wasn't even an anti-war protest, which HE. a protest in favor of the ongoing massacres where people were waving banners celebrating the atrocities that were still happening and then I thought: well, I have to go to Israel as soon as I can to see this for myself because it was my belief at the time.

It's now that not only was it a moment where you saw everyone where they were, but several things were happening. One was what I described as Real-Time Holocaust Denial, where even as atrocities continued to occur, people said they had done nothing. Whether it happened or whether the Israelis had carried it out, there was a lot of debate in the first few weeks about whether or not the Israelis should release the footage that Hamz filmed themselves and, by the way, you have to have a particularly perverted mind to believe that. . The amazing thing about all the images from the 7th of the Hamas terrorists is that they were tremendously proud of their achievements, tremendously proud and also tremendously joyful, which is kind of a new level of evil.

In a way, many people have done many bad things throughout history, but very few are actively proud of them. In this way, some of you may have heard the intercepted conversation of one of the terrorists who called her mother in Gaza and said, "I'll call you." a Jewish telephone I have killed 10 Jews with my own hands pass father on the phone pass pass pass to the whole family I want to tell everyone your son has killed all these people with his own hands when I arrived in Israel and started to talk not only with the survivors, spending time with the families of the hostages, but also touring the sites of all the massacres in the kibbut communities of the villages of southern Ber and near o and the festival site The Dance Festival where all these hundreds of Beautiful young men were dancing early in the morning when true evil came among them.

When I was going through this, I always had a disconnect because I heard all these stories firsthand and was shown pictures of the partygoers' own images of the day. that they had recorded a bit of their escape or the death of their friends all the time. I looked back at New York, at London, at Europe and everywhere the sympathy had gone the other way and I thought it was extraordinary. In a way I waited for it all my life. every time Israel has done something. The global response

rise

s and

rise

s, whatever the size of the Israeli action.

I first heard the accusation that Israelis were committing genocide in Gaza in 2008, so I'm a little tired of that accusation, I would too. Of course, it would be the only genocide in history in which the population doubled, but let's put that aside for a second. It struck me that all these people in my country did not ask for a single day for the release of the Israeli hostages. I would have some sympathy, understanding and, indeed, respect for people who said, "You know, I campaigned for the release of the hostages." I paid my respects to the dead and those murdered in the seventh and deeply sympathized with their families, but I also sympathized with the innocent.

Palestinians: I would have some respect for that position, but it is very difficult to have any respect for someone's supposed pacifist position when they remain silent in the face of the largest murder of Jews since the Holocaust. A friend of mine passed through Tel Aviv in January and said, you know Douglas, this is the first place I've been since October where none of the hostage

sign

s have been torn down. I thought about that for a moment that in London you can't put up a hostage

sign

even if it's now. An 18 year old kid without being knocked down.

One of the relatives of the bbass boy, who is the youngest hostage. He spent his first birthday in captivity. One of his relatives told me that he went to Dublin to try to appeal to the Irish T-u. help from him, some help and, in fact, he saw there that the sign of his baby relative had been torn down. I said, just think about that for a second, if here in Rotterdam someone put up a sign for their missing dog, would someone take it down? Would someone break it? If they destroyed it, wouldn't we all say who this sick person is who goes around tearing down posters of a missing dog?

Everyone wants to have the dog at home and, yet, that does not extend to Jewish children, nor to women nor to men, one of the What has attracted attention in Israel since the 7th is the fact that so many People have focused on women and children and the importance of freeing them, and that's important, but it's also not a crime to be a 21-year-old at a dance party and there's no crime in being a 70-year-old grandfather. who hoped to spend simat Torah with his grandchildren, but all along the sympathy went the other way: the protests on the campuses not only fell directly on the Palestinian side, they fell directly on the Palestinian side.

On the mass side of Columbia University there has been an encampment for some months now, um, in the main plaza and overlooking that plaza, by the way, 18 great figures from the Western past, including Aristotle, Plato and Dante. I sometimes wonder what they would think of the current state of American thought that if they could see the students, one of whom recently complained that there were no adequate toilet facilities at the camp complained that he had to relieve himself in a bag and then throw them into a bigger bag of $65,000 a year $65,000 one year that girl's parents pay for her education, but it's a Columbia University in New York where Jewish students have been chased all over campus by people yelling at them: " go back to Poland" or on one occasion they were shown a sign in front of them that said "hamz, these are your next targets it is in London where we have had protests every weekend, it is here in the Netherlands where we saw an increase of eight times in anti-Semitic incidents in the month after October 7 and it is worth pausing for a second on that.

I wonder, I wonder if it was some other group in

society

that suffered such a barbaric outburst, if the public. would turn so strongly against the victims that it is difficult to imagine that a few years ago there was a maniac in America, a white supremacist who walked into a black church in the South and shot dead these innocent Christian worshipers and you know that no one in The United States of America or anywhere else in the world said well, you know they may have provoked you. No, everyone's sympathy is with these poor families who had to go through this horrible incident and it is the same with any other group in

society

except the Jews.

I think it is even to the shame of this country when a Holocaust museum opens in Amsterdam and Pocal Survivor is photographed running past an angry screaming crowd. to him and his grandson and one of the ways I maintain that you can tell that someone hasn't thought about anti-Semitism at all is if they say something like this: anti-Semitism must be eradicated once and for all: the former union leader Jeremy Corbin occasionally used to say that he is an anti-Semitic, but occasionally he used to say that this is why anti-Semitism, racism and all other forms of hate must be eradicated once and for all and I used to say that it shows that you have never thought about the affair.

I would say that one of the surprising things about anti-Semitism is that, unfortunately, it seems to be a perennial human being and I say this because all the evidence points that way, it is also a shapeshifter, it is probably the greatest shapeshifter in history there were people. that Jews used to be hated because of their religion and then at some point it became less acceptable to hate people because of their religion, then Jews were hated because of their race and then at some point in the 20th century It was no longer so good to hate people because of their race, but there was a twist left: the Jews who were hated by anti-Semites because they were stateless were suddenly hated because they had a state, that is, one of the ideas of several writers say that Jews are hated for absolutely every reason.

It is an incredible fact. Jews have been hated historically and by people in the world today and even by people from X until today for all of the following reasons. They have been hated because they have been poor and they have been hated because they have been Rich. They have been hated because they have not integrated into society and they are hated for integrating into society so they hate them, as I say, for being uprooted cosmopolitans and then for being Zionists. who dare to have a state and not be ruthless Vasle Grman, one of my heroes, the great Russian writer and journalist of the 20th century, took time in the middle of his masterpiece life and destiny to write about this. question and in my opinion, vasel grman said almost everything that can be said about anti

semitism

grman, who was Jewish, covered the battle of Stalingrad, was the first journalist in trinka and knew a lot about human evil and in the midst of life and destiny that gravitate around that midnight of the 20th century in the middle of this 900-page novel in the middle of midnight of midnight Grossman takes three pages to write about anti-Semitism and says something that can't be said enough and I wish more people would say it. knew, he talks about the way he says it's something that can be found everywhere, he says it can be found in the Academy of Sciences and in the games that children play in the schoolyard, he says it takes many forms , from a mocking and contemptuous tone. ill will towards murderous programs then says that this anti

semitism

is always a means rather than an end it is a measure of the contradictions yet to be resolved it is a mirror of the failures of individuals, social structures and state systems, tell me what you say accuse the Jews and I will tell you what you are guilty of.

I spoke to a psychiatrist a few years ago in a professional capacity. I must emphasize who claimed to me that he could tell with very considerable certainty when one of his patients was going to become anti-Semitic and I told him what the signs are, he said that one of the signs is that it comes just after the intense paranoia seemed to me to have a surprising sense that CU, why else do people fall for this? Even if they didn't want to do it, there is a great story that Paul Berman writes about in his book called Power and the Idealists, which has the rather unpleasant subtitle or The Strange Passion of Yosa Fischer, Not Everyone Wants to Know About Yosa Fischer's Passions . but it is a magnificent work of intellectual history and it gravitates around the history of the green left movement in Germany after the war and, as Burman said, the Germans who grew up after the horrors of the Nazis if they had been sensible, they had a government above all. don't be Nazis, don't be like our fathers, and if you're going to have some guiding principle, that's not a bad thing, but Burman shows how this generation, some of whom were flatmates of the future German foreign minister in the 1950s , they were still holding on to this light don't be Nazis don't do what our fathers did in the 1960s, many of them have come closer to the cause of the PLO and the upcoming Palestinian Movement at the time when the Palestinians are hijacking planes from an airline, one of yosa Fisher's.

Former roommates are on the plane with the terrorists and divide the Jews from the non-Jews. You've done it again. I would say that many of the people of our time are actually repeating that same mistake. I think the people who have been most expressive in the last few months or so fall into two categories: they are the ones I describe as the sinister ones and the foolish ones, the sinister ones are the ones who know exactly what they mean when they say from The River To The Sea, you know they are referring to the eradication of the only Jewish State they have a plan they seem to approve of violence very often they seem to sympathize a lot with Hamas knowing very well what Hamz is doing and then there are the fools, those are the ones who are very impressionable and For the trip, I'm thinking of the kind of people who shout from the river to the sea incessantly, as if you shout something often enough, we'll agree and we won't be able to identify whatriver are talking and we have no idea which one it is. sea ​​there was a woman in New York who was caught on camera screaming from the mountain to the sea what mountain I don't know the Alps something look at the way the world has reacted in the last few weeks the last few days trend on X we have all eyes on on Rafa, all eyes on Rafa, why would you have all eyes on Rafa?

Always, of course, he said as if the person in question had often thought about Rafa in the past and was an expert in everything. The arrangements in the neighborhood, of course, many of these people are people who are experts in everything and have been experts in absolutely everything in recent years. They used to be experts on pandemics first, then they're experts on vaccine policy, and then they're experts on how they withdrew from Afghanistan, they were experts on Ukraine, and now they're experts on Rafa. It's surprising how much experience there is among idiots. But it's very surprising to me because you can actually tell a lot about what someone obsessively focuses on and if I have decided that the reaction of Gaza and Israel to the seventh and the attempt to recover the hostages and the attempt to punish by killing or capturing the Hamaz leaders is in some ways what will energize them the most again.

I might feel some sympathy if those people had ever expressed any concern about the infinitely greater humanitarian catastrophes occurring as I speak. I don't see people shouting outside the KET gabar because of the ongoing genocide in Sudan. By the way, there are almost no cameras in Sudan. I know a journalist who is trying to get there. I would sympathize more with these protesters and others if they had spent the last decade or more marching and shouting and shouting and claiming that they were going to go on a hunger strike hunger strikes that tend to last around 12 hours, um and uh, if they had gone on some of that for 600,000 or more people killed in the last decade in the Syrian Civil War, but not a peep, not a peep, not a peep from those people for the 300,000 people killed. in Yemen in the last few years not a demonstration not a riot not a banner some of the protesters recently found out about the hootus um I'm not sure they know the difference they seem to think they are the same as the hootus but let's say that aside for a moment, um, the hoes had barely appeared on the international stage, shooting at ships in the Red Sea and hitting a British ship, as soon as the protesters discovered the hoes and they were hot for them too. we had people in London singing next weekend Yemen Yemen makes us proud turning another ship around imagine just hearing about a terrorist movement and knowing that yes, those are my boys, those are the boys for me and, by the way, none of those people seem to object to the fact that 13 young men accused of being homosexual in Yemen last month were sentenced to death, including crucifixion.

I thought that, again, it's an extraordinary place that you can get to where you decide that I'm for anyone, as long as "I'm for anyone, as long as it's against the values ​​that my Society holds dear. I'm for favor of anyone, as long as they are against it. I would say that the word "the extraordinary Jews" can be inserted at that point. What has happened in Israel in recent months has been that sometimes not only does a flame flare up, but sometimes a crack in the universe occurs, suddenly you can glimpse very, very clearly the true human evil and we in the West have been very, very lucky in our lives to very rarely glimpse that and when we have glimpsed it occasionally in This country in Paris, Manchester and elsewhere we tend to put it aside or let it go and hope we never see it again, but in Israel, on the 7th, something was shattered in the whole of society no matter if the people. in the south of Israel it was Orthodox Jewish or Ashkanazi or Safadi or secular or Reform it didn't matter what color their skin was they were the targets because they were Jewish and I can tell you that the enlightenment that this has caused in Israeli society is very, very little. understood outside of Israel.

I was in one of the B kibbuts where a man I spoke to in the hospital had been in his safe room, which some of you will know that all the communities there had safe rooms in their homes, but they didn't lock them. They were safe rooms to wait for rocket fire, which happened all the time. They got too used to it, but they didn't lock it because no one expected the gunman to come. house by house, all the houses in Baye and nearby and so on the ones that are not burned uh, you go to the safe rooms and there are bullet marks around the handle because in each one the person on the other side was trying to hold the handle towards down and some people held on for a while others didn't.

I spoke to a man who lost both of his grandchildren. They called him and told him that we are alone in the safe room, what do we do and him? I told them to tie a rope with one hand around the handle and try to hold it, but they were 13 and 14 and didn't last long against the Hamaz adults. Another man I spoke to was in his safe room with his family and managed to keep the door closed and then discovered that the terrorists had set fire to the house, so they were in the unenviable position that many families found themselves in on day of dying burned in their houses or having to flee and be machine-gunned and they saw the neighbors doing that to them, he realized that the house was burning and he ended up opening the vent in the safe room and he was there with his son, his daughter and his wife. and the terrorists threw a grenade and killed his wife and then a gun appeared and shot his son on both sides of the chest and he bled to death in front of his sister and his father, and his father, who lost his legs in this. him in the hospital and he said to me, "You know, Douglas, I was leftist all my life." This is not to make a political comment, but to say that many of these people in the most affected communities were people who did everything they could with their lives to live in peace with their Palestinian neighbors they had people who took Palestinian children to hospitals Israelis to receive treatment there was a 74 year old woman who did this every week and Heraz killed her and burned her in her house there were people who employed Palestinian workers from Gaza because they desperately dreamed of the day when they could live in peace with their Palestinian neighbors only to discover that when the terrorists came to their communities, these people who they thought were their friends, in many cases had given Hamas all the support they could. maps of where to go and when in communities about 20 km from the Gaza border there is a town called ofakim which became quite famous thanks to a woman called H who was a quite remarkable woman in her 70s and the hamz came to her house and they sought sanctuary And she fed them and spoke to them in Arabic and treated them like a Jewish mother and something very strange and at some point at the end of the day she managed to leave her house and there was a mass shooting. and she went outside and met a police officer who said, we know there are 14 terrorists coming to our community but we've only found 13.

She said, "Oh, there's one in my closet." But on sale, Kim, one of the survivors, showed it to me. that he was a member of the Knesset. A member of Parliament showed me the map of one of the terrorists taken from the body and it showed his house on the map, the people that his community had been employing to live in peace and who had given the intelligence to Hamas and on the map, because They knew it was a holy day, the first target was their home and then the next targets were kindergartens and synagogues. It really takes something to consider the people who dreamed these dreams of peace as the perpetrators and Hamas as somehow the victims, but that still seems to be where much of the world has landed.

It was decided, among other things, because the only acceptable form of anti-Semitism today is anti-Zionism. Some people occasionally forget to say anti-Zionism and say The Jews, but many people have remained disciplined in this regard, many people seem to claim that Israel, in response to a massacre like the 7th, should do nothing or should act on advice from a few Twitter warriors online. It is something very curious. I've been to Gaza quite a bit in the last few months, and if you see the IDF in action, it's a form of discipline in the military that I've never seen in any other war.

They know that all the young people in Gaza know their terms of operation and much of this is house-to-house fighting of an incredibly difficult kind, one in two houses in Gaza as a whole has weapons caches of some kind. A few months ago I spoke to a commander in Gaza whose job was to try to locate the entrances to the tunnels, as well as the weapons depots, and he said that no longer, if we enter one house, we no longer look for the tunnels or the ammunition in any other. room other than the kids room so we go straight to the kids room and you Flip the cot and you will find a rocket propelled grenade or a tunnel entrance and many of these tunnel entrances are booby trapped and Israel He has lost many young soldiers precisely in those circumstances, he has lost soldiers because very often, as any soldier will tell you.

A group of civilians come out with their hands raised and a few Hamas gunmen emerge from among the civilians. A few days ago, the entire world was obsessed with what was reported on the news as an Israeli bombing of a refugee. camp most of the news that reported did not report that rather than the Israelis being tremendously interested in simply bombing the refugee camps and wondering why they would want to do it, the attack in question occurred because Hamz, in his infinite care for Palestinian civilian human life, he launched a series of rockets in Tel Aviv between the tents in which the Palestinians were located when the Israelis attacked the launch site and it turned out that Hamaz was also using it as an ammunition depot , so there is a secondary explosion, but if you look at much of the world press and from what I can see, even the Dutch press only reports that the first thing they say is that the Israelis attacked a refugee camp.

It was the same at the beginning of the war. I was at Shifa hospital when that was the focus. It took Israel months to identify how many people were killed on the 7th, but surprisingly Hamz can get round numbers very quickly and there was an explosion near Shifa hospital, which isn't actually a hospital, more of a gun control. a garbage dump and also an interrogation system and um, there was a bomb there and the entire world press said that in a matter of minutes Israel bombs the shifa hospital and again said: well, what monsters would do this, what monsters would attack a hospital first, for Of course, as I say.

It's not a hospital, it's a command headquarters, but it took days and weeks, even the press that had reported on that first incident said that it was actually a rocket fired by the Islamic Jihad in Gaza that, like many of its rockets, fell short and landed. in the parking lot, but Hamz immediately said at that time that 500 people had been killed and the world reported this number. Not only was the story false, the numbers false, everything was a Croc, but as Mark Twain said, sometimes a lie can make it all the way around the world before the truth can even get down to business.

One of the reasons I think we should worry about this is because if Israel is not allowed to wage a war of self-defense to get back its stolen civilians, then in the future, neither will a country like this or a country like mine, if it is considered unacceptable to want to reclaim your citizens and want to punish the people who wish to destroy them, then we will all be in big trouble next, um. If we do the math, the equivalent of a seventh would be around 3,000 Dutch civilians killed in one day and around 700 kidnapped and taken into captivity.

I have a very high opinion of this country, but I would like to think that if that happened here, Your country and your government would not sit back fairly and just allow that to go unanswered and if there was an organization or entity anywhere in the crazy enough to want the destruction and murder of the entire population of this country, I would do it. I hope you have not only the sympathy of the world but the support of the world if you decide that this is something you couldn't live with. That's why I think that Israel's ability to fight wars is also our ability to fight wars, but that's not the case.

The only reason, of course, to be concerned about this issue that we are gathered here today to discuss and I look forward to the questions in a second, perhaps above all, is the reason that anti-Semitism is an issue that needs be discussed and What is thought is because, of course, as all historians know, it is the most reliable precursor, the most reliable guide, if anti-Semitism breaks out in a society and is tolerated and the Jews cannot walk safely through the streets of cities like this, is the sign that society is in

decline

and that everyone elseThey will be next the curse of the Jewish people is to be the canary in this C all mine but the world's desire to kill the canary seems perverse to me anyway there is a lot to unpack and I look forward to your questions the rest of tonight so thank you, thank you Douglas, now we'll open the floor for some questions. our lovely inam Marie will go among the crowd. um, yeah, um, I think we will.

Ask five questions and please like. In the Dutch Parliament, a question is one, maybe two sentences long, and always ends with a question mark. Baker, you don't want to know the Dutch day, you can talk like I can, but I'm, but I'm here. um H yes yes H hi um as a student I have been fighting a lot against antisemitism and anti-Israel sentiments on campuses over the last 3 years um and I feel like the ball is not rolling yet, what do you think will happen? The ball rolls I think once it rolls, it will keep rolling, but we are not there, so do you think there is a way to push the ball?

Thank you so much. My question is: is it possible to defeat Hamas Douglas? Do you want to maybe ask three questions or five threes? Okay, yes, I have a question for you, Mr. Mari, but first I want to say something, okay, that's better, I think it is. It's very special to have someone like you here who, as a journalist, not only writes his articles based on the information you get from your desk, but actually looking for the truth directly in the country, in the war zones, going there and being an eyewitness and based on that you write your articles, for that I think You have to be very brave and I think you are a great man.

Now my question and my question is the following. I've heard you talk a lot. a lot about the phenomenon of anti-Semitism in the world. I have not heard anything about the causes of anti-Semitism and I believe that it is necessary to know the cause in order to fight against it. Could you say something about it? Those are very good questions, let me answer them in no particular order. First of all, is it possible to defeat him? Yes, it is eminently possible and the IDF is very far from achieving it. It is just an arm of the Iranian revolutionary government in Tian that also has Hezbollah on the northern border, which is another issue that the world ignores, there are 100,000 Israeli families that cannot go to their homes because of Hezbollah's rocket fire, but the world He seems to have no interest in these Jewish refugees.

It's possible. defeating Hamas is extremely difficult but the last stage is underway the last stage is what is happening in Rafa some people say it is not possible because Hamas is an idea there is something in that but as a structure as an organization as a group that is financed whatever is armed and trained, it is eminently possible. There are Hamad leaders all over the world, including London. I wouldn't mind if there were some confusing incidents around it, but the leadership inside Gaza is eminently possible to destroy and when people say it is not possible. I always think, without resorting to the obvious comparison on our continent, think about the situation in 1945 with the Japanese: the Japanese had a truly jealous ideology and a form of idolatry in their King Emperor, most military and political analysts in 1945 believe that the Japanese will never surrender due to the issue of the Pride of the pure, it is impossible to consider that when the emperor signs the document of defeat that ideology disappeared and today Japan is a prosperous and successful rich and magnificent country, so it is eminently possible, but I believe that, certainly, peace will come.

It is only achieved by defeating Hamas. The worst conditions are that Israel is allowed to destroy it as a gamble, as I have said quite a lot in recent months, it is like saying "I will put out 80% of the fire in my house." put out all the fire or it doesn't make sense and uh then yes it is possible and achievable um put antisemitism in motion I think it was a question, you mean to put in motion the opposition to the fanatics, so to speak, yes, well, before nothing I salute you and keep up the good work.

Sometimes you may feel alone, but my own experience is that every time you do something well, but feel alone, you discover two great things on your side. The first is that you do the best. best enemies and the second thing is you make the best friends so don't give up in terms of getting things going. I would definitely divide your time appropriately, you know, don't deal with people who are, you know, fullon hamaz, you know? They are unlikely to be convinced at this point, but there are obviously a very, very large number of their contemporaries who are very, very wrong now that they have been taught to occupy that position, but that means they can be taught.

Outside of this, sometimes I have to give us spirit, which suggests that certainly, if you're in your 20s, you should be allowed to be stupid for a while, you know, if you're 30 and still stupid, we've got a problem Houston , but you know, talk to people who you think might be and, of course, a big thing is that they operate out of shame and, um, shame can be applied to them, um, as for the gentleman, thank you. for your kind words, I take the rather old-fashioned position of a journalist and actually go to the places I'm writing about um uh, but you asked the source, I mean, when I described antisemitism as shape-shifting, I tried to explain the fact that in a way the source is so amorphous that it's very difficult to pinpoint if I had one thing that I would link it to very, very often it's Envy um Sherk wrote a great book about this in the 20th century , but Envy is an extraordinarily deep human emotion and, once again, impossible to eradicate.

Thinking about all the anti-Semites in Europe in the past so often was Envy. Envy that the Jews had the money, for example. Envy of the idea that Jews had any access to society. Imagine what it is like for anyone in a country neighboring Israel: there are dozens and dozens of countries in the region that have Muslim Islamic governments of some kind, most of them are run by some kind of family crime syndicate and they take all the money. money and people don't You don't get money, like if you went to a North African country, like many of you would have done.

You see these societies that have so much potential and the potential is removed from people. You see young people hanging around the souk. nothing to do, no job prospects and then this country comes up, it's re-established in 1948 and within a generation it's this miracle and a country without oil, I mean, and Moses also found a country without water, which someone should have pointed out, it is very annoying. It makes life so much easier if you have water. This country without oil and without water becomes this magnificent success story in the Middle East and then has high technology and a much higher standard of living than that. of their neighbors and if you are a young person living in Jordan or Egypt, Lebanon easily let alone the West Bank or Gaz, why are they doing so well?

And there is another further problem in Muslim anti-Semitism that Bernard Lewis, among others, pointed out and that is Imagine what it would be like if you were told that you had the final Revelation from God and that the Jews were doing better than you. That's uncomfortable, so there are a lot of things summarized here, but I would say envy is one of the deepest. things in it and as I said before vas grman look at all the people who are, what are they doing, these I call Ronin in medieval Japan, there was a class of people known as Ronin, who were people who had sworn fifty for a king samurai warrior Le Lord and his leader had died di the Ronin were skilled warrior men who walked the earth looking for a new Lord to swear an oath to, that came to mind the other day when I looked at Greta Thunberg, she um.

A few years ago it rose to fame because something that made me understand medieval Europe a little better is when someone from a northern country with flaming eyes, a child tells you, you are all going to burn, think wow, that makes me understand the Middle Ages a little. better um but first of all she was first for the green and now she's still with the green color so you have to give it some consistency but uh uh but now it's hamz where did she do it? Where did Greta Thunberg, trying to save us from fossil fuels, end up in a square in Sweden yelling at a beautiful young Jewish singer, just a lost soul staggering desperately across the earth looking for a purpose, maybe her purpose should be found elsewhere? or a better directed question, thank you Douglas, we'll do one more series of three questions, yes, right there, and then you, sir, okay, and Marcus is there and please keep it short, guys, keep it short.

Thank you very much, my name is Marcus, I have a question. Um, you see certain countries in Europe that lately are very against the anti-Israel fanatics and they come partly from the old Catholic anti-Semitism. I'm talking about Spain, Ireland and, to a lesser extent, Norway, and my question is. Now there is a division in Europe between these countries that fiercely support, yes, basically, Hamas and other countries that oppose it, so we have two sides in Europe. My question is how do you think that is going to evolve in the near future? Hey, thank you so much for being here, I really admire you and um, thank you, uh, my question is this.

I want to address the big elephant in the room, the Islamic regime in Iran. I am originally from Iran. The question is this, uh, the Islamic regime right now is the biggest sponsor of anti-Semitism and chaos around the world, while its people, unlike most people in the region, consider themselves friends of the Jews. , friends of the Israelis and we have even seen protests against this regime, but the West's stance towards the regime has been weak, to say the least, and the only thing people asked during the protest was: "If you don't help us "Okay, we'll defeat them ourselves, but don't do it." help them, but we see the opposite, we see them defending the Butcher of Tan, we see them helping to find him, so my question is what should be done on the side of the West and what should be done on our side of the Iranian side must get rid of this , the biggest source, in my opinion, of anti-Semitism.

Thank you. Well, one more for this set. Thank you so much. Would you agree, Mr. Murray, that the current wave of anti-Semitism is based on the fallacy that the state of Israel was founded on a nation called Palestine that never existed as such, and so, if you agree, um um, join in no longer using the fallacious words Palestine Palestine Pro Palestinian protest, which seem to perpetuate the myth that Jews are villains who steal other people's countries, yes that is a very bright point and you are right and it is very important that the The world never talked about the Pal Alans as such until around 1964, as you know them, and then it really came after '67 and '73 um, they were called Arabs and uh, I mean, the Palestinian peoples are a collection of tribes and families and um, I have a friend who was born in Gaza at the time when Egypt ruled it and she was Egyptian, she wasn't Palestinian. she's not Palestinian um and yeah, the development of the idea of ​​the Palestinian people, which is a misnomer in my opinion, was because it turned the Jews into usurpers and it turned the Jews into overlords and it's very, very interesting. because that's how it was. a brilliant and brilliant tactic to do that, now you also have the one where people claim that the Jews just came from Europe and had no historical connection to this land and you know that the churches are responsible for much of this in the En The West does all these things as if Jesus were Palestinian.

It's not a very accurate reading of the text, but yes, it is enormously dangerous because it also plays into the ideology of our time that spilled over from the idiots on American campuses everywhere, as my friend Andrew Sullivan said, we all live in the campus, unfortunately, um and that is the idea that the whole world and newcomer to the United States, this idea that the whole world can be divided into victim and victimizer, oppressor and colonizer oppressed and colonized and so on and so on and so on Of course it is a totally inadequate way of understanding the United States, but trying to impose that on the Middle East and on the Israeli Palestinian crisis, the Israeli Arab question is quite incorrect, um Iranian Regime.

I'm so glad you asked, this is a big deal, isn't it? I mean, I agree with you. All you hear from the people of Iran is wanting to live in peace, and of course the regime does. exactly the opposite, the problem of the regime in tan is so serious, I mean, at the end of the Trump presidency, regardless of what one thinks of it, and you will have noticed that there are some criticisms that can be made, regardless of what one Think of him, he did it. he actually brought the mullers to their knees financially and that had some good consequences um and I think it would encourage people to take their country back from this vile regime again.

I mean, it's amazing um just yesterday or the day before yesterday uh uh the supreme leader sent send this message of thanks to the American students for showing up on campus on the side of the Palestinians, if I were one of those protesters, I'm not sure if I would retweet that It should be considered embarrassing, but there is so much confusion about this in the west, when RI had a helicopter accident the other week, I told some friends, I said, let's wait andLet's see how the mainstream media describes it and in the end we came, we mixed with Legacy RI, that was a nice thing. for a guy who hangs people from mixed cranes Legacy it's true he hanged some people and shot others um so swings and roundabouts um I I I'm amazed by those I I keep track of the way you can flex the reputation of someone just that term, my friend Jordan Peterson is always described as controversial Professor Jordan Peterson I knew he wouldn't be a controversial leader RI no no no mixed legacy Jordan would never mix Legacy only controversial but spicy Mixed legacy just as it was alag Dad was described in the Washington Post after his early demise as an austere religious scholar.

Well, that's a little bit of truth, but not the whole truth. I just hope with everyone that my Iranian and Persian friends can one day live in peace. in their country they deserve it, one of the great civilizations of the world, as in the case of Spain and Ireland, etc., I refer you to what I said before about people who stagger around the earth looking for a purpose. Ireland is particularly fascinating. I was saying this to someone over dinner. Ireland in my own lifetime went from being a highly religious society to the most secular society in Europe, had terrible Catholic Church abuse scandals and in the 2000s people simply drifted away from the church in Ireland to such levels. a speed and they kind of caught this kind of strange awakening thing from America and that became the new faith and um and they fight for this meaning by the attachment to a cause and some of that goes back in some way to many of the IRA terrorists trained with uh with with various Palestinian factions and so on.

Spain is a very interesting country. I'm not sure it's a religious explanation anymore. I mean, Spain is obviously still a very religious country in some parts, but I think the leftist Deputy Prime Minister who said last week about The River To The Sea I don't know if that's religious I think it's the new woke Cult I think has taken over I think it's that kind of weird oppressor oppressor religion that I was describing before um, but what a thing To say what a thing to say, I mean, I would have thought that if an Israeli politician said, "You know, we have to make sure that that the Arabs reconquer Al Andalusi", the Spanish government would be a little upset by that, so I think it is a Terrible intervention by the Spanish.

It will be very interesting to see how this develops in Europe. There is another thing, of course, which is to please, please, will be one of the things to take into account. Some leaders have decided to oblige. to small or large percentages of your population who believe, rightly, that they are very sensible on this issue and I would simply say to the people who want to go down that path, you know that the people in our own countries who support Hamas not only supports Hamas. and those in our own countries who deeply desire the destruction of the Jewish State do not merely desire the destruction of the Jewish State.

There is one thing that can be said with 100% certainty about every anti-Israel protest in any Western country: they have never taken place. the country's flag anywhere is evidence that they never sing the national anthem of the country they are in, in fact, they always hate the country they are in. Protesters in the United States who hate Israel hate the American flag. I was speaking at a graduation ceremony. The other day he talked about an alternative graduation aimed at some of the poor college students in America who weren't allowed to graduate because of the protests and uh, he had fought for the U.S. military, he had fought in the U.S. military. in Afghanistan and Iraq and In November he came onto campus with the American flag and they kicked him off campus and he said to me, Do you know Douglas?

I risked my life for that flag and I lost friends for that flag and for knowing people back home who believe in that place and that flag. I had no place here, it hurt more than anything. I would urge you as a point of a scientific experiment the next time you see a pro Hamaz protest here, urge them to sing your national anthem and see what they say. That's fine thanks. We will have the last three questions. The last three questions, please, without you. Thank you Douglas for your bravery and for telling the truth. I have a question about the silent majority in Europe and the West and students in universities, most of them do not protest. all these slogans and I don't agree with them, but many people lack the courage that you seem to have, so what can we do to get the silent majority to rise up?

He gets up and thanks very much, I think after his visit to Israel. you are a little more positive about defending Western values ​​and what do you think about Europe defending Western values? Because it seems to me that we are very divided countries. Thanks, yes, commission. Thank you very much Douglas for sharing your ideas and experiences from Israel. My question was: isn't there an even more underlying cause for anti-Semitism and all this, such as China and Russia trying to destroy our Western values ​​and the existence of Palestine and this movement originating from a left-wing movement in the Soviet Union?

Uh, isn't that what we should be focusing on? uh, as the root cause, and uh, because it's not just against the Jews, but it's against Western values. Yeah, I mean, there's quite a bit of evidence online, particularly of the way that various of our competitors and opponents like to help us in our own upheaval, um, it's very convenient for the Chinese Communist Party, you know, everyone in the West is trying to figure out what a woman is, um, at the same time they're drinking. about Africa it's like it's very useful for them um and if I were them, I would push that too, but what do you do with gender neutral bathrooms?

Ah, as they take over the Congo, you know, it's like it's a good movement that and there's certainly evidence that some of these protest movements are certainly encouraged and some false information is definitely being put out around Tik tok. It's very interesting in this war that there was clearly a switch flipped at the beginning of the war that meant that, 95% of the accounts were suddenly anti-Israel and uh, that's the Chinese Communist Party playing their tricks, they know it's you , you know it's upsetting for Westerners and um, that's good for them, they love it, um, but yeah, it's very Important point: the silent majority is very, very difficult.

I've been told all my life about the silent majority and I believe in it, but I wish they weren't so fucking silent, but I do believe in a Decency and common sense are recoverable, but they require people to stand up and there have been people who have done that in this country at great cost and risking their own lives. What this country has actually produced for a few years. some pretty remarkable people from a wide range of backgrounds and I think this country should honor the brave. I have one thing in particular that I would say that I want to say, by the way, when you mention that the majority of students disagree with this, it is Absolutely true, there was a survey the other day that showed the amount you pay for your education versus the number of protests on your campus and the most expensive elite institution had the best, sorry, the most protests and the ones that were technical universities where people are actually learning something, there are no protests, well, you know, I'm happy to encourage that trend and, uh, say you know if in the future it could be a pretty useful guide for parents, it would be for me if I was a parent sending a child to college.

I think one of the things I would look at is that our students are encouraged to waste time yelling on campus at someone who can't hear and that would be a way to stop the war, well, Benjamin Netanyahu is I don't listen to students on Rotterdam who do you think are narcissistic, boring and now, what are they and why were they created? I guess I shouldn't be too harsh, but let me finish this positivity thing, let me finish. On this positivity thing, you are absolutely right, sir, in fact, I wrote a book a few years ago, The Strangest Death in Europe, which was about our continent and, in the years since then, at various times people have told me he said, you know?

It was a very depressing book to read. I said yes, you should have tried to write it, um, uh, but there are many things that are very, very worrying about today's Europe in my own country, including many very deep problems. go ahead, you know, when I see 100,000 200,000 angry people, mainly Muslims, singing, you know, singing in the streets of London. I don't think this is a problem for the Israelis. I think it's a problem for us and, um, I wish more people saw that, but just To end this thought, you're right, I've actually gotten a kind of injection of positivity and I'll tell you why it's because of the young Israelis. .

Older Israelis used to say quite often that the Young Generation had weakened, you know? who in a way wanted to spend all their time on Tik Tok and Instagram, everyone wanted to party in Tel Aviv H, they had become, you know, weak and that's just not the case, they have been magnificent and I see them in the field the beautiful women young people 19 that I saw recently or a few months ago at the place where all the Nova Festival cars that had been burned and shot were brought to this place so that the last of the body parts could be taken out and these, uh, this they were all doing these very special people who care for the dead and these 19 year old girls were there helping.

I could have cried when I told you: do you know how old you are? Heck, your contemporaries in America, Britain and Holland haven't seen a fraction of what you've seen, but that's your advantage. You know that some time ago there was a young woman at a dinner party in Tel Aviv who was sitting across from me during dinner. on a Friday night and I told her what do you do, she told her how old are you, I said I'm 23, I told her what do you do, she said I'm an intelligence expert in Yemen, she'll be someone you know is going To be.

Know more at 24 than someone in Britain will know when they die, but it is a demonstration of the fact that sometimes, when things get serious, if you have prepared yourself and your children and your generation, they may also step forward and You know, there's always that question. I always had it my whole life. I'm sure you all had it too. You always have this question after the war, which was something like, who would she have been? What would she have done? Could she have become her? be heroic like so many people were and it's always a question that the Young Generation in Israel had that question, but they have answered it and I would just say that, in my opinion, it is a sign for us that if the time comes we will ever proof came, we should be as lucky to have a Young Generation as they have there and we should expect them to do the same anyway, thank you, thank you, glas, thank you very much, thank you very much.