Former Irish PM: 'A bit odd' that a UK leader had not visited the republic for years

Good morning, Mr. Hearn, good morning, Trevor. Now American presidential visits to Ireland seem to take on almost the flavor of pilgrimages. What do you think this one really got right? I think the president of the United States of America or what matters is the majority of the heads of state. Always very welcome in Ireland, I think President Biden, you know, for 50

years

he has been a very good friend of Ireland in all his roles over the

years

that he has been here, many times he has been here twice as vice president and I think you already know. who addressed the dummy building that relationship with today's MPs, you know, moving around the country as he did from Northern Ireland to the border counties where his relatives come from in the west of Ireland and getting to know quite well, you know, a large number of people from various organizations, you know, that strengthens our contact with the United States, which is very important as well, as you know, and the enormous number of American companies that are in Ireland, a large amount of investments that we receive from the United States and the number of Irish companies now operating in the United States very successfully, as you know, President Biden's affection for Ireland, playing as it is, has not been taken entirely positively.

Here he said the UK should work more closely with Ireland. support the people of Northern Ireland, what do you think he meant by that comment? Well I guess he was referring to the fact that before Rishi Sunak there was very little contact between the Irish government and the British government and the institutions of the god transport agreement and unsurprisingly the British Irish Council um didn't had gathered over a long period success of prime ministers had not attended I think the last one who attended before Rishi Sunak's attention in November was Gordon Brown and you know that was your last interview who has that must have been 13 or 14 years ago , so I'm sure that's what you meant because, frankly, it was a bit difficult that countries that are so close together couldn't get a British Prime Minister to attend a British-Irish Intergovernmental Council for so long, but I think you, More than anyone, you will understand the sensitivities here.

Former Northern Ireland First Minister Arlene Foster says Joe Biden, whom I quote here, hates the UK. Do you think that? There is a part of him that is basically anti-British no, no, no, um, isn't he working very closely with the British government and Ukraine? Are there no ongoing contacts between the British government and the United States? United States and you know we have to live in the years when Trevor found it very difficult to get an American involvement that did not go through the British government and there was a time when I was younger when we were told that Ireland North It wasn't our business, that was totally a UK business now, luckily we've all matured and had a bit of common sense and we've moved on from those days, so you know, nowadays, luckily there's dialogue and we've built relations. but you know, I think it's good for President Biden to remind people that that's the way it should be. um uh Sir and I know that you are a legendary diplomat in many ways, but I feel like there is a sigh behind this.

It is a relief that Boris Johnson is no longer in 10 Downing Street. No, to be honest, I don't really care who the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom is. That's the UK thing, but you'll still appreciate it and that we found it very difficult to deal with piracy, he seems to be a very colorful and very nice guy, but you know, we had problems with safeguarding, problems with protocol, we had a lot of problems with Brexit in the first frankly, I don't think we would have had the institutions in order and Ireland down on and off for the last six or seven years if it hadn't been for Brexit in this course of some difficulties and problems mentioned, but you know We in Ireland try to live in the future and try to get on with things, and you know, I think what we need to do now is air it soon.

The Prime Minister actress has really done a good job, in our opinion, here in the last six. For months she has strengthened efforts to make things work in Northern Ireland. A lot of positives will come out of the Good Friday agreement, not just in terms of peace, but a huge number of the different parties to the agreement. the legislation, the demilitarization, you know, dealing with prisoners, you know, dealing with a lot of the problems of the north and south, has gone away and now we are left with politics with the institutions and, to be fair, the issue of the Prime Minister soon will really be trying to To solve that issue, the Windsor framework I think almost solves all of those problems.

It seems that there are some pending issues that we have to resolve. I look forward to meeting you at the Prime Minister's meeting on Wednesday because this week in Northern Ireland all the people who were involved 25 years ago, including Tony Blair and President Clinton and Hillary Clinton, and they will all be in Northern Ireland for the next three days, so we hope to have the opportunity to, you know, be able to communicate with each other and also with each other. architects of that deal and you, as you say, will meet with the other people who made this happen, there will be a hint of disappointment in that group, you Clinton, and so on, a quarter of a century after the transferred government still In advance, yeah, that's a disappointment, Trevor, it's um, you know, we set up the system based on power sharing, where everything has to be agreed between communities, now the problem for us is that that's been difficult, um and if one of the parties are not happy with something they can withdraw now, that's what we said at the beginning of your article, where I said there should be a review.

I think you can't have a situation in a democracy, you know that every time someone is unhappy with something that they can just tear down the institutions, you can imagine if that happened in Westminster or it happened in dollars, so we have to try to find a way to deal with it and you know if we have achieved it. They collapsed on different things over the years and the last time champagne was involved they collapsed over cash for ashes, which was an environmental grant scheme, at this time it effectively collapsed over a Brexit related initiative , but we have to try to find a solution.

So it only comes down when there are elections and we have to find a solution to that, but it has to be done at the community level. Northern Ireland remains a divided society. We have made a lot of progress, but our problems still exist. of integration and um, so when we make fundamental changes if it is not through community consensus in my opinion, anyway, everyone does not agree with me that it has to be done by agreement and it is the only way to move forward, but that is the disappointment, I think I'm happy with so many things that we did 25 years ago, but the fact that the institutions haven't been up and running is very unsatisfying, well, you know, one of the I guess your triumphs was that you had to deal with what I guess many people would say that he is one of the most difficult personalities in Irish politics, in fact, politics anywhere, the Reverend Ian Paisley, and you got him, um, given that experience, what would you say about his successes in the documentary now when Let's say we're just not going to return to the institutions until we get our way, for example, the protocol.

Well, his politics is the art of compromise and I dealt with the late David Trimble for a long time and, as you said, Mrs. Paisley and all the time we were able to make progress because we were prepared to compromise. So, you know, the Prime Minister, Mr. Robinson, came in and with Martin McGinnis and you know, I think we, Peter Robinson, Mark McGinnis, I think. Randy the institutions very, very well and it was at the base as a compromise was at the base of trying to see where they could reach a middle ground and you know that you don't make much progress in politics if you don't do that and I think we have to get away from you, you know this is the position and no other position is satisfactory.

I mean, it's not sustainable, they are sustainable and it is not in the interests of the people of Northern Ireland. There are huge problems in Northern Ireland. There are everywhere, even here in Dublin, but you know the only way because I can't let you leave without asking a question that I respect. Our viewers in Ireland would like to know the answer. There have been many presidents wondering about it. the British Isles in recent weeks and more to come with Clinton in um now Irish President Michael D. Higgins will resign in 2025. I note that you have recently rejoined your Fiona party, um, are you going to be the one of the party? running for president next time um I remember state councilman Trevor and I work.

They advise me the president every time he seeks Our advice um he has two and a half years to run and great support from the president and traditionally in our protocols no I won't get into that topic until about five or six months before the election, so the answer That's in the future. I won't listen to no, thank you very much Mr. Aherne, thanks for Trevor and good morning to you.