Gone | The Steve Dangle Podcast

believe. Secondly, you know if things go bad in the future, if he comes back, people will say, well, maybe he took his foot off the pedal a little bit. But you know, we saw how difficult it was for his family, as if such Maybe he couldn't do all the things that are required of him. I just think he opens the door and some of those are narratives, of course, but narratives matter, that's why they write this script. Damn day, if everyone just went up and said what they thought into the mic all the time it would be absolute chaos, yeah, who would do that?

Did you mention his contract situation earlier and how it played out last summer and I, because Larry Tannenbaum? he went to the meeting and proposed that they give him an extension, we know this is public information and Rogers and Bell said no, we'll play until the end of the year and now it happens that they are a little surprised by Kyle Dubis. To go up there and say all this and I wonder what their reaction would be to this and if that leads them to not necessarily terminate the contract that was coming, but to have even more doubts about Kyle Dubus as general manager, that left them with more questions.

I mean, I don't think there's any doubt about it. I think basically what we heard in that clip you just played was new information to Kyle's bosses as well, so I think they were left wondering if he's awake. Know? Did the season affect you in any way? Did it just sell out? I mean, I don't have those answers, but we've all seen Kyle talk a lot and that was out of character, right? And I think he is a human being. At a level we can be understanding, but in a professional professional sport it is a horrible business if you are no longer good enough as a player, it doesn't matter what you have done in the past, you will be

gone

if you don't do it.

If you're not living up to your contract, they can buy you out and work in the media the next day instead of playing on the ice, and that would be horrible if you were in Kyle's place, even just as cool. a job like and I have been a great support of him. I have been consistent. I think the blade should have been extended. Maybe I would believe in him and I think he's ultimately going to be one of the best executives in the league if his time isn't up yet, whether he has to go somewhere else to do it or not, but if you're not up to it of the task right now in Toronto because it's a huge task, they may have to move forward without it.

Me again. I don't know how that's going to play out and this could be dated by the time you hear this because I think there's a real pressure to come to a definitive conclusion about this situation right away because there's so many other things to do. What is the deadline here? Well, I thought it was Tuesday and we're filming on Wednesday, so how far is the road? How was this extension made? If you can probably always move like you know, yes, then you have been offered. He's got it, he's got it in his hand, they've worked on an extension, I know that and he's reciprocated in that, as far as I know, yeah, but I mean, look, let's take his words, he's got to have a family like he does not.

I even know if he wants to make an extension now based on those words based on his family. I mean, I don't know what, I'm obviously not aware of what's being discussed inside his house, but you know the key part of that too. You guys heard this in his opening remarks and I actually missed it in real time, but I heard it when I heard it again. He said that in the last few days he learned how exhausting this season was for his family and you know what that tells me. that he's had certain conversations, I don't know if it's his wife Shannon or someone closer to him, but he's had conversations basically since the season ended that maybe shed new information or new light on his situation, so if that's the case, already You know.

If I'm reading it literally from those comments, you know he has a big decision to make and a lot has happened here, I mean, game seven was supposed to have been last night, right, oh man, you're actually right, but Solo I'm saying you know it's not long before you're fighting to try to keep the season going by doing everything you can with the team that you lose, know that he has to meet with the owners, he's getting ready for his locker meetings and then obviously. um, you know, and then obviously he's having conversations with his family where you know it sounds like something was brought up about whether or not to continue or the weight that they've had to bear and all this, so I mean, it's fair to assume there's a lot going on there and, um, no, I don't know where we go from here, but they need a quick resolution.

I think that's what you think. I think there are people asking this and based on what I've been told this probably seems like a question that we don't necessarily have to answer, but what are the chances that I'll do a Paul Marie says I don't know I don't know I don't know and then some another The team comes in six months and makes it so comfortable for him that it's hard to say no to that, you know, I mean in the sense that he's a popular guy in NHL circles and among teams looking general managers. Even the teams that currently have them would probably in some cases abandon them just to get a guy like this to pay the three and a half million dollars that a good GM in this league would make.

What are the chances of that? a possibility, well, I think it's a great possibility. I will say that Kyle Dubis will work in the NHL again, whether it be next season in Toronto or somewhere else down the line. He is young, he has experience, he is intelligent, he treats people well. great reputation, but he might need some time here. I mean, it could be that simple. You know, Paul Maurice was in a different place. Paul was, you know, Paul is on the back nine and he thought he was retiring essentially when he walked away in Winnipeg and you know.

I look back over time here, over the last two years I see that Mark Bergerman, for all intents and purposes, walked away from Montreal, had the opportunity to sign an extension and didn't because he was burned out after 10 years there, Paul Maurice after eight years old. in Winnipeg he chose to leave the Winnipeg Jets bench Brad Tree Living just left the Calgary Flames job and can't talk to anyone until July 1st let's not go down I mean we just have to talk about it sometime right . Enough of the dirty business and now we are also looking at the possibility of Lisa Kyle dubis leaving.

I mean, I know no one wants to hear this stuff from the Canadian market, but I think it's The Crucible at work and and now we've seen several high-profile people walk away from big jobs and Kyle again, I'm not presupposing the end here, maybe still stays, you have every reason to say that's what's funny if it's yours. program well and everyone who works here is basically his employee or has been there since he's been there, you know he's clearly in the fight with his guys, right? I mean whatever you think of him yelling at fans in Tampa or throwing a water bottle and getting angry like he's clearly in battle and loves his players and has more players coming too, like next year we'll get there to a point where you're going to have a nice Matthew in the lead lineup and maybe Nick Robertson and the players who have been drafted since Kyle was GM are becoming more and more of his team with each passing year and so much that this has been a disappointing year, the fact that you are willing to trade one of your superstars.

I mean, what an opportunity for a GM, well, and I'm not going to go there yet, what an opportunity, although I would like to remodel things the way they are, yeah, this program still has a lot of legs, obviously it needs a pivot and stuff. The pivot comes with uncertainty and you know it's a little risky or whatever you want to call it, but it's what you dream about in a way like you're trying to find an answer. I mean, it's a tortured reference we've all made, but like Messiahu's jury swaps for Kawhi Leonard, that's what you expect, like you're making a massive franchise-altering decision, but it could be the key that unlocks the door and change. everything that foreign Steve extends increases or decreases Sheldon Keefe's chances of staying.

I think I know the answer, but hey, I'm not sure he's as safe as he was if he leaves. I feel like the chances of Sheldon still sticking around are like five percent, okay? I mean, it's not like that, I just think the easiest thing to do if you're a new GM is to come in and say, "Okay, this guy's had four playoff runs and won a series and you know, let's have a voice." new, I think if Kyle Duba stays, you know, he gave some examples in his press conference of the things he liked about the coaching staff even though the team didn't get the results.

I feel like there's definitely more than five percent of chances that Keith has retained if Duba. stays, but you know it's very bad for Sheldon Keith in many ways, but my analysis of this is not even necessarily that he is really the problem, but that I think he is one of the solutions easier available to them, he has one year left on his contract, so you know, we've typically seen some head coaches, including Lindy Ruff, who coached until the second round in New Jersey, play the last year of his contract, but in general you would be talking about extending them this summer or changing coaches, etc.

You know, it's hard to know where we're going until we know who makes that decision, but I think even if Duba stays, he left the door open to make a change. Same question, but for Brendan Shanahan, if Dubus stays, Brendan is likely to stay if dubis leaves, does Brendan leave? I don't have the same feeling there Jesse, I would say again it's May 17th, does this board have a plan, do they have a plan B for Shanahan like me. I don't see who you're hiring. if you get rid of Brian Shanahan right and the story is that when they needed to get someone to be president, it was Larry or Tim Lywicki called Gary Bettman and said who he would hire and Gary said Brandon Shanahan and that's how they have Brandon Shanahan today well , that's the story to be fair, that's how a lot of business is done in the NHL, that's why you sign up for NHL player safety.

I'm telling you George Perros will be a general manager in this league. although I want to be fair, there isn't a big story that there are a lot of people working in player safety and I know that maybe it's more Junior roles that have wanted to make the jump and haven't liked it, it really isn't necessarily like that. the pipeline, I mean, look, it's hard to get these jobs, there aren't many of these jobs right, we actually have some GM openings right now, but there's generally not a lot of GM turnover, well, look at Canada, I mean , we did not.

I have had a GM swap for over almost a decade like any market and now it is in stock, yes, yes, and now it is all. I want to ask you some questions about Ottawa, yes, well, I'm glad you talked. Channing, uh, Jesse, because the only thing I'll say about Shanny this year is that he's been the least public Shanty we've ever seen and you don't see him much in the press box with dubis or sorry, the press box. the box whatever they put them in, uh, you don't see them on camera, obviously, they don't do a ton of interviews throughout the season anyway, I don't think they've done one since the end of the season from last year, right?

As the president of the Toronto Maple Leafs right now, you know in all honesty that we should have heard from him at Locker Cleaner, we should have heard from him on Monday, the fact that it's now Wednesday and we haven't known whether or not. It's reasonable to read this, I'm still going to do it because there have been a lot of rumors about Shanny and Dubus not getting along and I don't think that's why they're in the box together, but it feels a little like uh, Shani has left to Dubis, if this happens he will be the face and I wonder what you think about that.

I know he was there. I know he was in Tampa. I know he was in Florida. I know I don't know if. he was in Tampa okay so he was in Florida though yeah I'm not saying he wasn't in Tampa I just don't know I never saw him there so you're not seeing him either and you're there yeah and and you know they won their first playoff series as an organization in 19 years in Tampa, as in the there is a hallway outside the visiting room where, like Larry Tannenbaum, was the same hallway where I saw Scotty Barnes after one of the games in the previous series , but as you know, obviously, that's a big moment for the organization, it's a moment that you would wait for.

I'm not saying Brandon would necessarily be front and center in the locker room hugging all the players, but you'd normally expect it after knowing he's been around for nine years. Trying to do this here, I would have thought he would be there and again he could have been there and somehow he could have escaped my vision. Okay, is there something to read there? Yes, because I don't think there are many accidents. Honestly, with Brendan, I think he's very aware of what it means to convey his own image. I think he is very good at managing his bosses, which is his main function.

I think the main function of it is to be a kind of insulation between the board and thehockey. Department um and we would never see much of your work because we are not very aware of what is happening at the board level of this organization, although it is curious that it is starting now through the story again after 15 or 20 years of not hearing too much about the mlse board, they suddenly seem to be taking things into account a little more. I don't think it's an accident, although I don't know what's all there. I think some of the not-getting-along stuff is a little over the top, well, they're not as close as they used to be, although they used to be okay, well, there's tension, I mean, there's tension on everyone in the organization, like they've done. before.

I didn't make it and it's fair to say two people work together. I'm sure that even the three of you, as you build your business here, there are times when you don't all agree on the path forward or on a certain decision, I think that same dynamic exists for a president, a general manager or a general manager and a head coach, but you know, a lot of things changed this year, like they used to see him in a box at the hundred level, it's like one of the main boxes and you know you would see Brandon Shanahan moved there, you would see Lawrence Gilman , yeah, who was part of the front office, obviously, Brandon Protom, who's essentially called Louie, used to be there as a right-hand man and then you know, covet hits and everything goes to shit and I don't know where they're looking from because they had a whole building for like two years.

Don't get me started and now you know, but this year they came back and Kyle was. looking in the old suite that Brian Burke used to watch from and it's high up on the press box level and now he wants you to meet Jason Specs, who came to work with him and Brandon Pritam there primarily and all of a sudden, Lawrence. Gilman got a new title and was taken to a place where you can't see him and as far as I know, Brandon Shanahan was never in that box on a Leafs home game night, so you know he, I know, so what are you saying.

If Dubis signs this extension, they could work together, that relationship is sustainable for now, as far as I understand it, yeah, okay, I don't think it's at a point where they like it, look, they're fair, like I'm in practice. whole group these last few weeks like more than once they were together for an hour practicing talking seeing what was going on it's not like these guys don't talk um but you know, I don't think either of them could I could deny that there's tension and uncertainty and You know, I'm sure you do. I don't think it's all Kumbaya, but I think it rarely happens in professional sports like that, that might be something we don't understand, it's a different job. environment than other places like I think there are a lot of Fu matches in a lot of headquarters about important decisions and at key moments and under pressure and stress and all that kind of stuff, so I don't know how unusual it is but yeah, you're right, there were a clear change, so we can't deny that oh year after year it was the way it was and the thing is and like I said, let's go back to my original point, I don't think that's the case. an accident like, I think there's a conscious decision there.

I can tell what year Kyle dubis memes are based on whether Shanny is in the background or not, like when you see Kyle Duba's gifts because he's so animated in the right frame and Shannon's. no, but you can tell what year they are because you would see Shanahan looming in the background a little bit like Grim Reaper uh because he's very, you know, calm and he's standing tall or whatever and there's voice acting. freaking out over any play, I think, and that's not a slight against Shanahan, by the way, uh, I guess I'm wondering where he stands on the board because, as people that I was talking to someone yesterday about this, they're people that um, I work for other people, we tend to look at things right, we tend to look at our manager, our manager's manager, and say, the board, right, you're the if you're Sheldon Keith, you've got dubis, you've got Shanny. and then you have the board on you know, above you, we never look at things down, we don't look at things from the board level, how much do you know about the board level and how do they see this and what were the operations this end of week because I've heard everything from nothing to chaos, well it seems like this year there's definitely more dissent on the board than in the past and that Rogers specifically, his representation on the board didn't agree with Kyle initially staying like that.

I think that's a dynamic that's been there, so Bell changed his position, so I'm not sure and you know, obviously I work at TSN, oh yeah, but listen, I work at Virgin Radio, but no, I don't know. , Yeah. even though I work there, which is, you know, probably 28 rungs below the level of what we're talking about, but I don't have any idea about that, um, but I just want to put my affiliations on the table so that yeah, don't be conscious, look at the zoo, what is the city of Toronto like? Animals are pretty chill in the city of Toronto, yes, Metro train, you're a government worker, yes, yes, union civil servant, why are you on the Sunshine List?

It was incredible. I've never been to the zoo. We have to go to the zoo. We have to bring. I'll give you the tour myself. I love it. I've actually never been to the Toronto Zoo. My God. We've been planning this for years. We gotta want Steve to hang the zoo tour where you lead a zoo tour like on the old bus that you used to bring fans that we bring, yeah that's what we want to do, yeah that's where I honestly got the license, that wait. The zoo is licensed. That's where I take my daughter when I want to tire her out.

It's like you want to burn out the batteries and you only need to go to a couple of exhibitions. That is. Free water parks. Oh, look at the water. If you get membership, just show up. the water park, go home without spending it CJ um, everyone wants to know about this part, that's why I saved it for the last one more zoo. Can I help you with that best-selling book if you want more facts about the zoo? That's basically Steve. the zoo employees this zoo is ruining my life thanks for mentioning they were best sellers like that chapter was a bad idea chapter chapters it was a guy it was the whole half of the book it's called June Story it's a chapter um okay now this place is a zoo Always forever CJ you know everyone wants to know about this quote and that's why I saved it for last I wanted to hear the board conversation and the coach conversation the general manager conversation Kyle Duba said if he stays and Let's assume that in this scenario there is nothing off the table in terms of moves the Leafs could make this summer and also followed up with a comment about what it will take to win not only in the conference but in the division, he said that La western conference is a little freer flow.

I'm not entirely sure that's always the case, but that was this year. He also added that he didn't like having done extensive work on it, but it's his impression to see something like that from afar. and the fact that it will take a specific type of team to get them to the playoffs, but to win the playoffs in the East, even to get out of the Atlantic division, the Leafs have never done it with Kyle Dubis. um how do you start if you're the Leafs to address that like I've heard? You know, if we're talking about the top four here and I don't necessarily want to get to that yet, how do you keep that tasty stick?

Yes I'm going to go into the background, how do you approach telling teams that we're open for business? Because I've heard stories and we've talked about this years ago, where a team went like a fax to all 30 NHL teams at the time and they said this player is available for an offer email. I think it's like what you do all day, yeah, just putting it out there, so how would you approach this and I know you're? I'm not doing that yet, well two things, there is actually a list that circulates emails like GMS and GMS assistant with that kind of information, but then too much information got out, so they created a WhatsApp chat that only has like 32 GMS.

Not in that, so there is a there is a what's going on? what's it called? I can't say it, but I've seen it like I've seen what happens there and in fact I literally liked the moment when you leave as a GM, they just kick you out of the chat as if you were one, sorry but you're already out . Are live trees still allowed to be there? No contract, no way, okay Adam, what's the story about the F1 and Nikita mazapin chat? I don't know, you know how, oh, they fired him immediately the day the season ended?

There is a chat with the driver. Yes, there is a full driver. It seems to be quite common in all sports and subsequent sports. They are these WhatsApp chats where everyone. the guys just chat and it's funny because I have a CJ show chat, yeah, on my WhatsApp and I know that, but it's also no different, it's just a different level of business that you're doing, but the NHL GM chat, yeah and so I mean they have it as a way to get the word out, but also let's be real, there's no reason for Kyle to get into that chat.

He just told the entire league that nothing is off the table. This is the first time the Leafs have done so publicly. I invited you to call them and tell them what it would take to get Austin Matthews or we would love to get Austin Matthews. This is the kind of thing we could do. Mitch Marner. We have always loved him. It's like him. That already happened. Not now. "I don't know, because we don't know if Kyle Do is still the GM, if he's been inundated with calls, if he's taking those calls, but the Leafs just said something they were never willing to do, they've said it publicly." At least I'm willing to think about it, and I don't think so, here quickly.

Well, a lot of people have told me that the trade for them was that they should have made Marner for Kachuk last summer. I thought Chuck didn't want to be in Canada. I don't think you want to be in Canada, but that's why I don't even want to explore it because the Leafs at the time never thought about trading, they never did. were going to do that, they weren't, they weren't taking calls about Mitch Meyer, they weren't exploring that with anything like they were moving forward, so I guess in retrospect, yeah, we should have traded this guy for that guy, but that was never a conversation now they are going to have those conversations no, I'm not saying Marner for kachak, but why doesn't Florida like him?

I don't know, it seems to me like Florida has built a team around guys like Bennett and Kachuk. and Radko gutis and they like The Butchers, you know they do what they call best there in Florida, so you know, I'm not saying they don't have room for skill, but I just think they do, but now they're going to have those conversations so that This is fascinating, one more question before we talk about names, you don't have a lot of time to work on whatever deal you're going to work out because, again, the draft is in five weeks, free agency in six weeks.

CJ is off and six weeks in a day, that's true, that wasn't on his calendar if a deal is reached with the four principals involved and let's not mention any names yet because I have a question about that too and I'm going to ask Jesse and Steve do the same in the free agency draft. What do you suspect? Well, I think it's before free agency. Anyway, the draft is June 28-29 and free agency, but I guess it's July 1. Would you like to go hunting for plenty of cap space in free agency even though the crop is a little thin this year or do you know that?

That's what I am because they'll have 14 million, but they have a ton of free agents. The biggest problem is that if you trade a 10 or 11 million dollar player or even an 8 million dollar player, a seven million dollar player, it's difficult to do it after July 1 to other teams because the Other teams have made free agent decisions, so there are all kinds of reasons that say June 30 is essentially the deadline for any of these deals, of course, Matthews and Marner choose a complete new move. Clauses William Elander gets a modified no-trade clause like July 1st, it's easier to trade any of those players before that happens, you don't have to deal with his agents, although we can address it, but there are reasons, maybe you have It has to be done a little bit, but in theory you can just trade them to anyone before then and I think by the time July 1st rolls around another team is going to start spending money, even if you put a superstar on the market those trades are going to get tougher. of doing.

I mean, the window now is six weeks. You know, from now on you have to think about that to explore those agreements. You know, like I mentioned, Chuck's happened at the end of June, so it's July, so it's not impossible after July 1st, but I think it's much more likely to happen in the draft. The day after is June 30th, but before July 1st rolls around, okay, now I want to ask names, but do you want to do a sneaky one before that? Well, I wanted to ask. I'm afraid because you have friendly cats. I wanted to ask about the possibility ofmake it after July 1 because Mitch has a signing bonus of 725.

Matthews has a signing bonus of seven million dollars or sorry, 7.2 and Nylander has a 3.5. Is there any interest in giving up that incredible sum of money and then trading a player? Because there's added value there, well, that's always been the secondary part of putting those signing bonuses in the contract, the first being the players like to get all their money up front, of course, but the second has been and we've even seen it go back to the days of Matt Martin and other trades the Leafs have made for Andreas Johnson. I think it's another one where they've paid a signing bonus on July 1 and then that player's actual money, you know, is much less.

I mean, you would have it in front of you. I think after Matthews gets paid like he got paid like 800k after that signing bonus even less actually 725750 and then next year 7.2 up front 775 after but I'm just saying after from July 1st there are only 775 left exactly now if you are trading with Matthews a dramatic break you need to work with him and his agent because any team that is giving up everything necessary to get him needs to know that he wants to play there and that he will sign that, yeah , for him, although there is no exchange or moving clause.

The clause does not take effect on July 1. I feel like if you're trading him, you have to go to him first and get a list of teams he'd be willing to negotiate an extension with because otherwise it's not a great trade. If you're trading Mitch Marner, you can't really do that. because Marner can't sign an extension anyway until July 1, 2024. Now you might want to be nice to him. My phone exploded. I am nervous. Maybe you want to be nice to him. Let me check it. Yeah and change it to somewhere he wants to go because you like Mitch and you know there may still be ways to do it, but you don't need to get the player's consent to the same degree, but even with Marner, as you point out here, you know a lot of it. of the money has been paid upfront in his contract, so even though he has that pretty high cap hit, a little less than 11 million, he's owed the actual dollar, you can do the math for me, but it's a lot less. less, yeah, that's like you're trading a Selkie Trophy finalist who consistently has 98 points, looks just under 100 and you know what ability he has to eliminate penalties who are still in the prime of their game. career under contract.

Two more years and the money is low in relation to what the salary cap is. A man like me. Marner is the most valuable thing you could ever trade. I think Austin Matthews, of course, right now is a more successful player by just a few. degrees, but you know our Trophy winner and all that, but if you're trading games, you have to trade them to one of the three or four places he wants to play and that team is signing him to a $14 million extension and those teams They're, wait, wait, I find it frustrating hosting a show with me no, I love hosting a show with you two.

I've loved you all the time yes, I love you guys, I love you guys, no, I love you guys, oh, I love you. I know what I find frustrating is when I'm sitting on the dock on a long weekend and I have to get up to have another beer and I look at my can and say why can't you be bigger? how does that work I'll kill you you need to be bigger in Muskoka you know what they call the phenomenon exactly right thank you Adam Marie for me why am I lying how am I lying call your butler to get you a new pedal it's fair you don't have to get up from your dock you say Jeeves, give me a terrible life, here's the problem he manages is that he charges to buy the beer, so every time he has to go get one that costs me at least twenty dollars, I don't do it.

I think the butlers were not like that. I don't know, but it's not like I knew. Listen, I would know exactly. Yes, we should listen to you. Butler, mine is like a pay-as-you-go butler. Okay, anyway, long story short, tread carefully. Muskoker Brewery is brewed locally, it's not owned by a giant conglomerate, it's actually made by 200 people who live in Muskoka, a conglomerate like Adam, a wild business, that's right, that's right, it's also available at LCBO, the brewery, the grocery stores, excellent light beer to relax. after your work day or on your dock or your balcony during the long weekend or your yacht or your yacht could be great on a yacht Did you see Bezos on his yacht?

Oh my gosh, can you wrap this up so I can drink it all? right, hey, and they also have the extra large can, which is what I meant at the beginning. The can is: are you ready? 568 milliliters, drink it this long weekend and remember that Muskoka Brewery is independently owned and operated in the heart of Muskoka. a team of over 120 people, real Canadian craft beer and you can visit The Tap Room in Bracebridge just off Highway 11 on 118, fresh beer on tap to go and tours available with live music on weekends throughout the year. Summer, hey, how's that playoff pace going?

You shaved it off my face, what did you use to shave it? That's true and boy, look how cool they are, I mean, the beard is coming back, but it's coming out so evenly, even you, Jesse, yeah, yeah, no, I use. the beard trimmer they have I love the little dial or you just move it and that's what changes the frame you're cutting it's perfect today I feel like a four oh maybe 0.5 I have a meeting what's that There are guys named Weed Whacker 2.0 uh, it's got a better shape and a better motor than any other and it's actually really good for things like not only that, but there's also the ear, they have their ear and nose trimmer like Well, uh, the beer preserver, everything.

It's part of the performance package you can get with manscape. So Adam, I'm talking about the beard weeders like you do the other one, oh okay, when you said weeding, I'm like no. I don't think that's right, listen to the beard, the Beard hedger professional kit, this kit has the shampoo, conditioner and oils that you need to keep yourself presentable or not presentable in Steve's case, uh, and the trimmer that you need when the time to cut out the hassle, get 20 off and free shipping with pendant promo code that's right at manscape.com is 20 off free shipping pendant promo code d-a-n-g-l-e manscape.com pick a winner, hit the playoffs and wear manscape to shave that bush.

Okay, so I'll ask this question and I'll go down to the table. I'm going to start with Jesse. I'm going with Steve. I'll give you my opinion. Don't take too long with anyone and then we'll get CJ's expert opinion. I wonder who. Adam proposed that to rank in order of most likely to be moved Matthews Marner nylander Tavares start with least likely go to most likely so least likely to be moved of the top four to get to most likely we should start with the two suckers and that's what I'm saying, yeah, okay, and you don't want any reason, you just want to get the numbers, just give me the numbers, so we're going to be the least likely, so one is John Tavares, the most likely. released less like Steve, we'll go from lowest to highest following and we'll start with you and Jesse and then we'll go to me and then we'll ask the expert Morgan Riley no, no Morgan Riley core four one is John Tavares two is William nylander three is Austin Matthews four is Mitch Marner Steve your opinion that Jesse is stupid um Tavares least likely Matthews second least likely nylander uh I should do the most likely just to piss off Jesse but I'm going to say second most likely and Marner is most likely and I'm going to say exactly what Same as you Steve, so CJ give us your range from least likely to be moved to most likely to be moved, unfortunately I agree with you two and would like to take a different stance. opinion, but I think it goes differently, it's likely that of course they can't move him without his consent and he won't give his consent.

We know he said he won't do it and I don't think they'll be strong in a room. More than you know, sometimes teams make it awkward, but I think he's here. Matthew is next in terms of least likely to Nylander and I think Core 4's Marner is the most likely to be traded. Do you think any of the Core four are open to? outside of Tavares, who we already know the answer to depends on how you interpret it, open. I think they too are frustrated and losing faith. I don't know if they are losing faith, but they may be losing patience.

The whole thing, I mean, I go back to Mitch Marner's quote before the fourth game of the Florida series, it was a little spontaneous, you know, he just mentioned honing in on that noise like he still felt like he was blaming the media or the fans, I think. It's hard for him to play here he doesn't risk it seven years he lives here it's slash Muskoka all year round he can never escape this. I don't think he wants to be traded, that's certainly not what I'm saying, please don't do it. You don't call me on the radio, but you know if a trade happened, you know it could be time, it could be time, Steve, you summarized everything, like the contract situation with Mitch and Austin after July 1st and I look at the situation of Mitch's contract.

I mean, why wouldn't they? he doesn't have any right to make a trade until July 1st, so I don't think they'll ever trade Mitch. I don't think you'll get to the point where the no-movement clause takes effect. Oh, you're right. and yes, and he has to make that decision, no, if you are going to trade Mitch Marner, it has to happen on June 30 or before, because then who cares what he thinks he has no contractual rights in this situation , beliefs can take you anywhere, that's why. I think that along with the points CJ is making, it probably seems like he's the odd man out.

Do you think the Leafs could sell if they don't move a top four this summer to the fan base until October? I do not want to say. maybe they could try like they should, no, no, I mean, this is an organization that has surely demonstrated a willingness to make trades, I mean, Ryan O'Reilly was a Toronto Maple Leaf, uh, but briefly, very, briefly , made it very clear. that that wasn't going to spread, so it's not coming back in any way, why do you think it's just the organization, the market, what it is about? I think he loved it, like we saw things with his grandmother and his parents and I think he loved the opportunity.

I don't think he appreciated everything about being here and look, there have been rumors since the trade happened that he will return to St Louis. I'm not saying that's happening, but I'm not saying. It's something Toronto did wrong, I just think he always approached this as the end of season opportunity to win a cup, the opportunity to play for another team and then you know he also I think won't give discounts on the next contract. true, he can still make a lot of money, since you know that's his right, so, but him to me reading between the lines like he doesn't even do it, usually guys say, well, I'd love to stay here, but we'll have to see how it works, he didn't even get that far, so I think he knows he's going until July 1st, so obviously we have an Austin Matthews extension that can be signed on July 1st.

We also have a William. Nylander extension that can be signed on July 1. People forget that Austin is talked about all the time, but Williams got the best value contract on the team. He changes instantly if he takes more rights and CJ you said yesterday on your show that the potential players of Those three guys who could trade for Matthews Marner Nyland or Nylander are probably the ones who will contribute the least to you because he only has one year left and is another step below, yes, he's a phenomenal talent, but he's not there, he's not there, yes, and he's too old. that those guys of the three, obviously, Austin probably gives you more.

I think it's pretty easy for leaf fans to say and set expectations if Marner is the guy that's going and I say if at no point have I said that you need to trade for Mitch's murder, you should trade for Mitch Marner so I don't get called on the radio here, but if the martyr leaves, are we talking about a returning equivalency package and what I mean by that is a player who is perhaps younger and earlier in his development curve? We're talking about multiple players. Are we talking about prospects and picks? Are we talking about everyone being crazy?

Well, what if it's 75 cents on the dollar to get to the other side? What happens if it's not? What does this look like? What would the organization be like? Be looking at what they're adding to this core, I think it needs another star back, and what kind of star would be more likely to look like the Chuck Huberto deal or the Eichel Tuck deal, well, you'd rather I call talk, of course, um, which also included other players and national teams and things like that, yeah, uh, but I don't think the national teams and stuff and thisperspective that maybe could be something is what is valuable, it is the main piece that has to come back. be something that you feel really comfortable with and there are ways that it seems like it could be someone who is objectively a little bit worse than Mitch Marner, maybe he's a little younger, maybe he's a little cheaper, maybe he just does something something different that you think is missing in the organization. but it also still has star quality if they don't get at least one star back.

I don't even think you can think about it. This is the beauty, although I don't think they had these conversations until maybe. now it's like they didn't really do it and as far as I know, I surveyed the league to see how much someone would pay for Mitch Marner and when Chuck might hit the market last year. I don't think a lot of people thought the day that was happening, he was going to end up in Florida. I never heard Hubertau's name or Uyghur's name until it happened on Friday night in July. He was in Europe.

I woke up in the morning. I thought: wow! I'm sure you were excited about that. I mean, I wasn't, mentally I wasn't that worried about it, but I was like, oh, that's a great trade, um, I mean, look, you can only do so much, sometimes you have to go to bed or go on vacation or do something good. Adam and I have told this story before, but we were baked all night, uh. Ryan O'Reilly got traded to the league, yeah, and we were like, well, there's nothing we can do about it, yeah, I just enjoy it, we enjoy it, text some people, yeah, it'll be ready in the tomorrow.

I'm sure I told you a long time ago, but that crazy day on June 29th with the Stamko signing and the Superman trade I was taking a nap like I was literally missing everything and yeah, I remember I was in London in the afternoon Like I literally woke up. I got up and I was like shit, yeah, like I'd been remiss in my role as someone who's supposed to be trying to receive this news. It all happened in I think 30 minutes, oh yeah, and I'm literally not kidding, I was napping the whole time. I had no idea amazing uh man I don't even sleep much I just think I was exhausted at the end of the playoffs it's a long road Adam and I were exhausted too yeah get this so Marner is owed 16 million and a little bit a little more in real dollars, even if you pay the signing bonus for the next two years, so he's an $8 million per year real salary player, which is valuable.

I mean, obviously, a lot of teams have concerns about cap space, but there are some that are worried about the actual dollars being transferred to their bank account, of course, every other time a month, so I think it would be a pretty valuable piece, but I mean who knows people love Mitch Marner like they should, yeah he does everything he plays. most minutes in the league at his position, the moody nominee was up there for MVP this year, yeah, what are those huge points? And I think if you look at his situation from afar, you'd probably say, let's get that guy out of Toronto and let them play, yeah, because it's pretty clear, I think we've all observed that if he can be free and easy, if he can just live his life. and not being in your head too much, it's amazing, easier said than done.

No, the number of people better than him is pretty small, so I guess I think he'd make more, honestly, if he left. I think he could change his life. You know, this place is a crazy house. It's a fucking crazy house and we love it and we live here and we're part of the madness oh I'm excited about it, it's the middle of May and we're here, join the party, just, could we just keep the cameras rolling for four hours, We could go on talking about everything that someone would listen to, that's the incredible thing, this is what I love about being on a team where people care, but it's a lot if you play here. and if his family lives here and all that, from all indications, although he doesn't seem to believe that if he left, everything would be better and he thinks about things like the All-Star Game coming up in Toronto and how much he probably wants to be a part of that and being on the team and representing the city and the organization in his hometown and I just don't think he believes that if I moved to a different team it would be better for me, but From the outside looking in, I think we would all take that decision for him.

Well, if you're in this, you can't think that way, yeah, the moment you like playing for a team or working for a company and you start thinking, oh. He'd be better off in that company, I just think that once your mind goes somewhere else, it's hard to put that Genie back in the bottle, so it seems to me that he's totally interested in being a maple leaf, like he said. , even he recently reiterated that this has been the case. It's been his lifelong dream, I understand that it would probably be crushing, but sometimes it's not like that, as we all know in our lives, sometimes what you don't want is what's best for you mm-hmm and for there to be a possibility.

Which is funny you mention the All Star Game, so I was in that Arena now called fla live Arena, that arena in the middle of nowhere, near the Sawgrass Mall in Florida, the house of Kodak Black, yeah, how was it built? Kodak and uh, but? I was sitting in the press conference room and I had a flashback because I was there, obviously, the Leafs were losing 0-3 and I thought the last time I was here it was like Shanahan and Marner were on a stage announcing the Toronto. All-Star Game and I think it's so strange anyway, I don't know, I don't know why my brain is there, what, what, in your estimation, this team doesn't have, why didn't it work out, what do they have?

They have to do with whoever they move and I don't want to, here's the thing because inevitably what happens when things come to light is in the comments sections on Twitter, all that kind of stuff comes out and becomes like a bunch of dogs on a certain player, so the reason I don't want that to happen is Mitch Martyr, I don't want Marner or Matthews Nyland, sorry, or any of these guys, but if you're the Leafs and Dubis is the designer of extensions, remember in this alternate reality that he has already signed the extension. What do you think they don't have?

Oh man, I don't know what they think. I'll just talk about what I think they don't score enough two goals in the last seven playoff games. It's not crazy, how is it possible? Well it's one thing and it's been one thing as you well know that when it matters most they don't get enough scores because they only ISO the big boys and you know whose fault it is the fans. obviously and the media, yeah, yeah, this is exactly what bothers me, it's like, oh, it's hard to play here, well, I mean, imagine playing another sport where people care more about playing in Europe, like soccer in Europe yeah just tell me your Baby, without telling me your baby is right about LeBron James so they don't score enough when it matters and this is where I think I've gotten to where they have to change so Kyle refers to Kyle Dubis in his press conference, I believe. who believed that all they had to do was put on blinders and just focus on any negative feedback, any negative thing that came up in terms of an outcome like losing in a playoff series, they believe that they just had to move on and eventually everything would work out. good. to work and we've gotten to the point where you can't say that anymore and I think, unfortunately, kind of a consequence of that mentality is that these players just believed that it was okay, to keep doing what I'm doing and eventually everything goes. to work but you keep doing the same things and you're producing the same result and they don't even acknowledge that I didn't hear one guy just say I need to be better or that's something interesting, not a single player said I need to be better or I need to be better next year.

I don't think they believe in Chris. I think they believe that if we keep doing it, eventually one year it will work out just fine. LeBron James would tell you after every season whether or not he's one of his path to a championship, I'm not talking about luck, I think they think it's okay, so that's what they think, but they think that, to be Fair enough, Austin Matthews had the most shots, the most scoring opportunities, all in that Florida. series we didn't score and John Tavares didn't score and I think that and Tavares had what he had a safe escape, even, yeah, you know he had opportunities.

Austin shot off the crossbar at the start of the third game and a bunch. of other chances in overtime in the fifth game, at the side of the net and all kinds of things in between. I think they just believe in next year, you know they won't get bitten by a snake in that situation, but here's the thing. To some extent, they just have to do it, they need different types of players, they need a different combination and I think what they need more than anything is to be a little less comfortable in that locker room.

You know the good thing about Kyle Dubis, honestly, it's all true. Has it created a situation where everyone is valued and I think it's really created a modern workplace for Pro Sports and I think Pro Sports needs to get there, but maybe it's gotten too comfortable for some of those guys and comfortable how to do? that's a little more tangible for people who have never been in a locker room, well, they're certainly challenged by the coaching staff, as we've seen, as you know, remember the problem was remembering that at the beginning of the year it's a game after Arizona. and Keith called out the big players on him and then the next day he backed off because the big players were hurt, but he definitely put pressure on D Lander, particularly those big players, as I heard him give critical comments in the media. and push him and see him in practice and stuff like that, but I never saw him with him again.

I just think they never felt in danger of being traded, they never felt like the results of this game could change everything for whatever reason, it just feels, you know, like Marner's response after game five, it's like he thought that something is going to change, well we all have years in our contract you know, that's how he thinks it's going to change when we want it to be essentially correct, but I think management now has to proactively step in and drop a little bomb there and do it less comfortable introducing a new dynamic swap of one of the star quality players for another star quality player that not everyone is sure about.

You know you have to bring this person into the mix now and everyone is a little less comfortable in a good way. You know comfort is that things must be hard usually when you get to your prime in life, like I can't. was comfortable, it would be boring and easy, right? I think you get the most out of yourself when you're a little bit uncomfortable, so I think it's become too comfortable there for the players and I think a lot of that is good as they've tried to protect them from the weight of the market, they've tried to protect them from pressure.

I think they need to have more guys in the locker room that just want to chew leather to win that and I'm not saying these guys don't care, I just don't know if they know that they just don't have enough, they have to change that mix right when that you can graft on all the Luke Shens, Nola Charis and Rhino Riley like everyone I think in a number of ways they play very well or well um and they have for a few years Thornton folino uh who else who else could we need Wayne Simmonds , but it's all based on the guys earning half the salary cap?

Yes, ultimately they have changed the other 40 million more or less constantly and some have been better than others, but they have constantly changed the other 40 million, but the 40 million in the center are designed for those guys to beat you the series . and they are never all hot at once, one of them is hot when it matters, yeah, yeah, like I didn't see it. Look, they played pretty well in games four and five. Sheldon Keith said they lost the first three games, none of them. We were hot in games one, two or three exactly, so as the words go, we shouldn't worry about how games four and five went well, if that's when you lost, then what was the point of the rest?

Well, I mean, well, I think I was speaking in retrospect, as a man, if we had won one of those games where we had an advantage and two of them if we hadn't put ourselves in a position where only four teams in the over 100 years of history of the NHL is back yeah no here's the first to praise Nylander after the season by the way he just didn't want to because he was great this is how much they win the second game in which They weren't up to anything, just a game. of having to win, yeah, it allows you to go and have a shitty third game, which they did, yeah, because they come back in the fourth game, even if you lose the fifth game and the way they lost the fifth game and You return to Florida. 3-2 you're still in that series, yeah, like one game changes everything, it's crazy, I mean the playoffs are crazy, it's hard to win, we have to admit we've been on this

podcast

for a long time, yeah, and it's a sample sizein Mexico, like almost About three years ago, I put your TV in some of your stuff, it's much better than the Canadian streaming services and nordvpn is less expensive.

Check it out, so with the Leafs, does anyone have any leasing related questions for CJ? Will the Leafs be the second team? in Arizona, Batman is moving the Leafs to Arizona to save the franchise, no, and as I've said repeatedly to everyone, Austin Matthews isn't going to play there either, because he may not have anywhere to play Tempe, uh, residents from Tempe. They voted no on the new Arena, next to Phoenix Sky Harbor Airport, it's currently a landfill, so they chose, literally, they chose a landfill that burned down last year because of the new redevelopment plan, now, wow, they chose no. give it to a bunch of taxpayers. good money for that garbage dump to become something that is not like that, not in those words, I don't know if it is very different, no, we have been a game, I would prefer it to be a garbage dump.

I have been against it. I get it and let me explain where we're going with this. Yes, it's very funny. Well, it's because that's why. I totally agree with you and that's why you kept the residents choosing. a dumpster on a sand because of these two stipulations that Xavier Gutierrez and his group asked for and needed as part of this as part of the entire redevelopment project, etc., proposal 301, 302 and 303 of the city of Tempe, the votes were 't 56 no in 301 56 said no in 302 and 57 said no in 303 and this is what they really look like because I have to tell you what each of these propositions were about um uh well, sorry, not the proposition, here they are the phases It would appear that Arena would have had 16,000 seats 54,000 square feet of retail 1,100 parking spaces 1,500 square feet public safety and emergency response facility second phase would have been practice facility and operations headquarters 68,000 uh feet square feet of outdoor event plaza 50,000 square feet of music venue 200 rooms Boutique hotel 160,000 square feet of Class A office space 80,000 square feet of retail and 195 multifamily units the third phase 177,000 square feet of Class A office space 300 conference rooms sorry 300 conference rooms hotel up to 600 units of multi-family uh and 39,000 square feet of retail and the fourth phase the last 1,200 multi-family units 143,000 square feet of retail this would have included that's a lot of numbers I know this would have included it looked like it was going to be beautiful I'll say yes, he liked the red rings The agreement for property tax relief for 30 years, which supposedly amounts to something like 700, was surprising. millions of dollars that do not go to taxpayers' money.

Now when they make these estimates, they're conservative about the idea that it would be $700 million to me is a travesty, it's probably double that, yeah, and that number actually went up because the original projection for tax breaks was around 500 million and now they say it would have been around 700 million. You know how they do this. Like, let's minimize it and then once they signed an agreement, yeah, 22-year-old CJ used to do his monthly budget, there you go, yeah, oh, yeah, yeah. I'm not going out to the bar this month or eating fast food or anything else.

It's tight, yeah, and they accidentally took 200 million dollars from you, yeah, you know, that's how it works well and now I'm still looking for a way out, yeah, talking about 200 million dollars, Steve, the public would have had to invest 200 million of dollars in infrastructure. costs on this because sometimes you make the developer pay for it, but not in this case they didn't want uh infrastructure costs, including sewers and roads, power lines, things that the city would bear with the widening wealth gap. It also drew criticism like Some of the condos were reportedly potentially priced in the millions of dollars now in Toronto, that's not crazy, a million dollars, that's still a crazy number, they have a lot of space in the desert, although it's true , you know we don't have much land, so things. which you know, it's supply and demand, the average home price there would be like 325 350 something like that, not a million dollars like it is here, um, this is where it gets kind of interesting and I want to post this news report. .

For you, we're not going to play the video, but we can play the audio and this is from a local news station on Arizona News 12 Arizona and this guy in the first, I would say two minutes. and that's all we need to hear, it sums up Arizona's perspective perfectly because I think we're coming at this from the side of why don't they just do it, it's a dump, it's like just do it. but this guy summarizes a little bit more about where the coyotes are and then I want to talk to CJ about it because he wanted to set that story up right.

There were so many details that it's really important that we understand this. Can we execute? the video or not, I don't think we can, I don't think they're going to call us out on it, but let's just not listen to it because he speaks very well about it, okay, thanks, now we move on to team 12 political insider Bram Resnick Bram the results that came in about two hours ago the reactions are still very fresh and in some cases raw, this was announced as the best deal in the history of Arizona Sports, so what happened? Simply put, they didn't read the room. right, they totally misread the room in Tempe, this is a different type of election, an off-year election, you have a different type of voter, the voter was older, these are people who voted and who had voted in several elections before, so what the community they were in knew. connected to the community and the message sent by the coyotes clearly did not resonate.

You also have to wonder if any community right now would pass some type of tax that could somehow fund a sports team. Those are out, they are not popular. not at all and yes I know there is a law of people upset about this, the message sent by the negative side suggesting that this was a subsidy, the coyotes were going to get a tax subsidy from the city, clearly the coyotes were going to get a big cut , hundreds of millions. of dollars in future tax revenue to support the project, it just wasn't well received, it's just not the right audience for this type of message, yes, Graham, obviously, like you said, it's not the result the coyotes wanted, so, which are the steps to follow? the team and really also just for the city of Tempe City Tempe there are more than four mayors the current mayor the city council was disowned in this election they are not going to touch this again uh the question for the coyotes is that they are playing with mullets Arena, a university arena on the ASU campus with a capacity of 5,000, was supposed to be a bridge to the new Arena where everything was going to be perfect.

That's not happening. It's a bridge to nowhere if I'm the coyotes right now. m Gary Bettman, the commissioner of the NHL, I'm on the phone with Matt Ishpia, the new owner of the Phoenix Suns, and I'm saying, can we play in your Arena? because the idea of ​​three Arenas, three Major League Arenas in a community of this size, always never made any sense, the ideal matchup would be to have the Suns and the Coyotes back where they were, yes, before, where the Coyotes, By the way, they had a lot of trouble succeeding in that Arena, right from some seats with obstructive views. but I'm calling this beer right now because I could probably get this team at a bargain price if I wanted, yeah, the team that has no future, so let's leave it at that, um, it's a situation that I don't think we've ever seen before. one of the ones that I always talk about this one of the first topics that we had when we started this show in the first episode almost 10 years ago almost almost 10 years ago until the day when literally two weeks out of 10 years we talk about when the coyotes are going to To solve this situation, we've been in this program for a decade now and you bring in a guy like Xavier Gutierrez, who is known for taking distressed real estate and turning it into profits and being able to turn it around. and Revitalize couldn't approve this Clayton Keller posted a sad emoji Craig Morgan said this is a fucking existential question CJ you've been in this from the beginning what's your sense of things I have about six trips to Phoenix in a The short period of time he covered those bankruptcy trials is that in 2010, yes, I think so, he was on CBC Jim Bosley, oh man, he was young, young, CJ, well, unless that Matt Ishpia that is mentioned in the report there is the Hail Mary that I know you can never call anything the final Hail Mary, but I think right now we're focused on where the coyotes are moving and when that is, how come where we are, as Gary Batman called it, I mean, him.

He had a profile published in the Sports Business Journal earlier this week and Alan Walsh, who loves Gary, tweeted that he's trying to have a victory lap before the vote because everyone thought this was going to be successful. . I'm fine with Alan, I don't disagree with him, that's fine, well, there was optimism and I hope this passes through my sense from the beginning. They knew he was going to be close. Turns out he really wasn't that close. It was quite resounding. No. but I don't think they thought, I can't tell you exactly what their plan b, c and d is, but they weren't like saints last night, I think they're thinking now, okay, now we have to go down. on the next paths, but I think preparations have been made, including meetings with the owner of the Jazz and, sorry, the drawing of Blanco's name, Ryan Smith, in Salt Lake City, obviously, there has been a lot of talk throughout the years with Houston.

Um consistent meetings with Quebec City, although I don't think it's likely that Quebec will get the team, but I think the NHL has other places that they could pivot to and we all know right now that their priority would be to stay in Arizona and I mean this just from my mouth. I think Arizona could work with good property and the right building. We've seen that yes, but the problem is, I don't know, you say they have a bad property right now, but they don't have a building, they need an owner who is willing to build that building if they can't convince a taxpayer, but the The thing is that this was going to be the third sports stadium in the area in a huge area.

Yes, but you should know how many four three minutes there are in New York, in Toronto, there are two, and Toronto is bigger. You know, I think you should have, I think you should have a couple of these split teams in these places, don't you think? They were at the American West Arena. I forget about American Airlines in the 90s, yes, yes, they were there and it worked. They had losses of $40 million a year at one point because of the lease they were in and that's what led them to move. go to Glendale and build that new arena there, the problem was where the problem started because they wanted to build in Scottsdale at the time and Scottsdale said no and Scottsdale, if I can tell you for sure, they built a nice arena in Scottsdale in every NHL.

The writer would tell you that you have to go watch your team play there and that every player, when they hit free agency, would want to live there and play in their amazing place in the world, instead, Glendale let you know that He came with a brochure, built the marina and it really is in the middle of nowhere. I've been there tons of times for games. um, it's a night, it was a nice arena, it's a nice arena, honestly, if you just walk in the door, you're like, wow, this is nice, like there's nothing. bad with the arena it was barely used except where it was built yeah that was the only problem it didn't serve the fan base it was a nightmare getting in and out at the times the games will be played obviously when you have the option of sitting in traffic or maybe just watching the game on TV, eventually you start watching the game on TV instead of going and it was distant and, frankly, the organization stopped paying its bills in Glendale.

I'm pretty sure Glendale isn't a big city like the Arizona Cardinals play in the stadium right next door, have the Super Bowl there and all that, but I'm pretty sure the taxpayers of Glendale, a relatively small city, still They are paying for the stadium, as I don't believe. you know that so they rush to them and you know I don't live in Maricopa County where they voted this referendum was held in the last week or two but they don't want to foot the bill for a new Arena and that's their prerogative, I just don't see any other option right now, yeah, and the small and Arena only worked this year because there was this idea that they were going to build in Tempe, it's like we went through the short term pain. the reward well now there is no reward honestly no I don't see the coyotes playing in Arizona next year I just don't yeah the HBS situation is interesting because they just bought the Phoenix Suns like six months ago you know ?

That deal went through, so either they rented the arena from him and then they have to modernize it to improve all the sight lines because that was a big problem during the '90s, whereThere were so many areas in the arena where you couldn't. I don't see the hockey game well and from what I understand they already upgraded it for 500 million, yeah, so what are you going to put in another 50? 100 million. You're asking this guy who just spent billions of dollars on a basketball team and hundreds of millions of dollars on his Arena to retrofit it so the basketball team will now spend more money and bring in this new tenant.

We don't seem to know that Robert Sarver was completely against the hockey team being there too as if it were the biggest. he's not in the picture which is cool so maybe the other side of that is you go well if you want if you want to do more yeah you cross your fingers he buys me the equipment well I'm just going to Let's say that Xavier Gutiérrez will stay with this team now as Alex Morello. I apologize, you know the play for Morello there were all kinds of plays too, but you know, I think they were going to have a casino nearby that he would control in that place.

I don't know where he's going, maybe he wants to be the one to move it, never that. I don't think that was his approach. I mean, clearly, they've been working for a long time, honestly, I've met with these guys, uh, times. Flat Circle at least a year and a half ago they came to Toronto and I had coffee with them and they showed me the plans for the Serena District like everything, so this is before they've been in this for a long time they wanted to be in Arizona, I should make it clear, but now that they're there it seems like they're at the end of the road with this project and I don't think there are many other places where they can. think about pivoting to you know, maybe he's thinking about selling the team.

I'm not sure what machinations have to happen, but I love when you use that word wow, because there's a lot of machination. I mean, this isn't as simple as, oh yeah. just move here, but we saw the Atlanta Thrashers when they moved to Winnipeg. The announcement was made on May 31, so there's precedent for doing it on a tight time frame and it's going to be an interesting couple of weeks, so how long can it take? They stay in a stadium that everyone calls Mullet Arena, a stadium with a capacity of 5,000 people. I was under the impression that after the retrograde or the update, sorry they had to lower that to 3200, yeah I think 5000 is what it used to be 3200, I think that's what it is for an NHL game now, how long they can play? that Arena without knowing what the future is, I have a hard time seeing how they will play there next year unless you look, maybe it was supposed to be like three or four years, but maybe there will be an agreement with the owner of the sun in the short term . term here and he and they are going to modernize that Arena, maybe they can play there one more year while that happens, I guess it's possible, but if how long can they play there without a plan, something better on the other side?

I think it may even take another year unless they have a plan that is tangible. I mean, first of all, the players are not happy just as the NHL PA is not happy on behalf of the players they represent, the other owners are not happy. because it's a total loss of what your profits could be income and I think again you bear that pain if there's something great on the other side, well that's been the idea of ​​great on the other side has been eliminated by this referendum. in mind, the city council and the mayor supported it seven to nothing in November as if you were the coyotes and you were working there, you are thinking this will go in your favor now that the rug has been pulled out. just all the signs to me point to a relocation now my question is why I want to know what made them think this would work and why they did it and I mean this vote, what made them think this would work and why it cost them so much get motivated.

No one vote because I'm looking at the Maricopa County numbers that were shared last night. Less than a third of potential voters turned out for this. Isn't that normal in all voting these days? It is not like this. Look at our choices. oh no the Ontario government was tremendously bad and even that was better than this yeah it's like they have these referendums all the time in Arizona like me they're fine oh yeah that's part of "it's okay if we go "if you ask for a follow-up. Question that I will not be able to answer, no, no, but my general understanding of how it works there is that when there are big decisions by the city council, the normal thing is that it is put to a referendum and people like it much more than we do.

We're used to being here great, but I guess if you always have these referendums on things that you may or may not be interested in in your town Pueblo, whatever it is, yeah, there's not a lot of people, but that was always the risk, right? What are the real numbers? Were there 30,000 people who voted? The numbers are 29,153 and it's a 16,000 seat Arena they were voting in, but at the end of the day you were at the whims of 30,000 people. It's a pretty small number of people, exactly, but less than the number of people it would have taken to fill the building voted yes on this and it was primarily young voters who thought they were going to show up but didn't. 12 something like 12 there was a tweet that I saw of oh, it was from Bram Resnick, who we just saw, who voted in Tempe, the turnout of voters 65 and older was 63 and made up 43 of all voters, um , that was a warning sign, another 70 of voter ballots in three of the last three Tempe elections and I'm trying to find, I can't find the one that said young voters were about 12 percent, that's abysmal, yeah but P I'm telling you the voting numbers in the entire world like you're depressed we're at levels of apathy everywhere on everything isn't it cool I mean we could have a real existential conversation can you bring the groceries ?

However, the entire business of professional sports is changing. I'll say that and a lot of these homeowners, of course, I mean they can understand why, if you're a homeowner, you'd like the city to cut taxpayers to take on most of the risk. I'm building you a building and then just extracting as much capital from the building as I can, it's a good setup. I just don't know how long it's going to work. I mean, look at the world in general as if nothing is happening in a vacuum anymore, as if inflation is increasing. crazy in the world, yes, there is a lot of uncertainty out there and there are many haves and have nots, there is a lot of wealth gap, many of you know that there is an entire generation of people in their twenties that were sold while growing up, that if they go to college have a good paying job be able to buy a house and now they are looking for savings plans that last 30 years to be able to make a down payment we had a career counselor in the US I have had banks going to college, yes the Banks have failed in the US in the last three months.

See what will happen next. The way all these sports leagues are built is the idea that every time there is a new media rights deal. rights or television rights that the price goes up, that's the fundamental truth, that's how the MBA has grown the NFL, true, it relies heavily on those media deals, but we are in a time where companies of means they are not. no they're not profitable they're not profitable and that's why people are being eliminated they can't monetize the audience to the extent that they used to and here's the other problem the technology is great for us the right technology It is not inflationary, technology is deflationary.

The easier it becomes to spread a message or play something, the cheaper it becomes, the price of these televisions in this room is much cheaper than they would have been 20 years ago and by extension the cost of consuming NHL games or the NBA should increase. It's going down, but market forces are making it go up and this is like two speeding trains crashing into each other right now and that's professional sports, I don't really know what's going to happen in the big picture of professional sports seriously. because it's all based on this, like what's going to happen with the upcoming Canadian rights deal in the NHL, but we see other potential customers that know figure it out, the NFL just sold a single playoff game to exclusive Peacock streaming, so what NBC, which has NBC Network, said.

We're going to buy this just for our peacock streaming network and it costs them 110 million dollars for that game so the NFL has a much larger audience than the NHL but there are ways for these leagues to figure it out in the NFL with its giant audience with the largest television audience in the world is realizing that the NFL and the NBA in particular have a global audience that the NHL has not built, I mean, obviously there are European countries where the games are being held. world hockey championships right now. where people in Sweden, Finland really love the game of hockey and you can get a significant audience, but there hasn't been like Danny Chell is being left behind because that's where it comes down to now, it's not just like what's your Canadian. audience as if everything should be on a streaming service at some point in the near future and should be available worldwide.

I'm concerned about the bigger picture of the whole thing, yes I think it's about going back to the NHL for 30 years diminishing their product and not growing the game internationally, yes I mean we need dramatic change, we need new leadership , well, yes, or some real intention to be greater than they have been. It would be great if they could motivate young people to vote for belief. Well, okay, speaking of which. Speaking of which, I'd love to know how many young people voted in the last provincial election. It is believed that the coyotes died spent less than a quarter of a million dollars to activate the vote and chose to start the campaign, while the opposition.

They spent over two million dollars backed by high-powered unions who wouldn't have received a guarantee that they would be the ones to build the project, so you know they spent an eighth of what the opposition did and expected to win. This is politics and its internal interests. However, the polls told them they would win, so this is an arrogant failure and we know now we know that polls don't work. We saw it with the election of Trump. We know those surveys don't work. We know that's out of the window. I know that's why. It's amazing that I'm always last in everything, so let me ask you this CJ, this is existential, they could have a deal, uh, it worked with the Phoenix Sun order, is it matteshiba or ishpia, ishpia, they could have worked it out by now, but yeah they move and Again, I can tell you that they don't have that agreement worked out.

I think they want to have that conversation. Okay, so one of the conversations we don't know, but it's not made like it's on the air right now. I have this on good authority from several people involved: the NHL will be meeting with the Coyotes owners any day now and they have to start working on what the alternative scenarios are, one of them eshpia. I think if it's a relocation, I'll most likely wait, let me. I'll explain um out of 10. Give me a score out of 10. A market score out of 10. Probability of these markets out of 10. These are the ones that have been launched recently.

Houston 4 out of 10. Kansas City 4 out of 10. Quebec City 2 out of ten Atlanta 0 out of ten whoa uh Atlanta needs to build a new range and I think they'll be in line for future expansion but like it's all about building a range in an upscale neighborhood. off center and by the way, don't base your opinions of Atlanta hockey on what happened with the Thrashers because a hell of a lot more things happened with the Thrashers that are reasons why the Thrashers didn't do it. Hockey can work in Atlanta, it just never had a great shot. Well I'll say the same if they leave the Phoenix area, it can still work.

I will say, under the right circumstances, it could be amazing. Scottsdale Arena feels like the five coolest places in North America, yeah, yeah, yeah, but when that Scottsdale thing fell through, it was different leadership, oh no, it was the exact same guy, sorry, okay, uh, uh, the next one, uh, in southern Ontario, that new Hamilton Arena, that Oakview. The group is definitely not making an NHL team, sure not, they're just going to make 20,000 seats have a nice surface and it'll be indoors for the coyotes, now below freezing, okay, what's your election off the board? because I have one more city, well, I think it's probably Salt Lake City or something that has to do with the Suns, honestly, I think so.

Salt Lake City out of 10, what would you give it eight? Because the owner of the Jazz tweeted today, uh, I didn't. I even know yes he tweeted today someone someone tweeted uh uh reporter Chris I'm buying the team that the Stanley Cup playoffs always offer please bring this to Utah on Ryan Qualtrics and Ryan Smith is his name and he just tweeted and I'm really sorry about this This was a month ago, he tweeted again moving about the big rumors that came out. He met with the Board ofa game on Ice, although that's true, it's true, honestly, it's not like that in the hard way when I was a kid, like I was exposed to. basketball and soccer and sports where you basically just have a ball and then of course a net, yeah and that's it, and I think a lot of kids just don't get the opportunity to be exposed to hockey, this is actually the argument for having teams in Arizona and Florida and everywhere we want the best, yes, the best athletes in all those places, at least some of them to put on skates and become Austin Matthews Austin Matthews Matthew nice, weren't the Chucks raised there, yeah, but they were raised by a NHL dad like they could have been raised on Mars and I'm just saying and been exposed to the game, yeah right, like their dad played in the NHL, not the Shane Doane's son who is coming up the ranks as well, but his father played in the NHL. so yeah, yeah, I guess Shane could have found his son anywhere with skates, yeah, they're more random families, you know, Austin's family has this history of athletics, you know, whether he's big, his dad He was a pitcher, his grandfather was a notable basketball player. he was going to play a sport and he would be very good at it and probably a lot of them, now he's a good golfer and all that other stuff, but you just want him to not play baseball like all of hockey existed like Way Beyond when you and God when we're around it's based on the little kids still playing and they want to play and keep the pipeline running 400 sticks oh man I mean everything yeah it felt like out of reach in the family I grew up in .

Like my parents, I played hockey but I was never the first. I was never in danger of making the NHL, so I'm not Gore. The goals were three, three and 21 seconds, three and twenty. I mean, at least I managed to do it. I did it. the Coburg Sports Hall of Fame, come on, that's definitely nothing, but the point is it felt out of reach back then and it's gotten even crazier and if you live in Toronto, I didn't live in Toronto, I mean, he's a factory guy, but we need kids from other places too, yeah, yeah, and that's why we need the best in the best hockey.

We still need kids in rural Finland and places like Russia and hopefully at some point, Asian kids will eventually like to come play this sport because they are coming to basketball, right, oh yeah, basketball is crazy, because a kid can pick up a basketball that's athletic at 16 and become an NBA player, just like if you didn't skate at 16, it doesn't matter how good of an athlete you are. You never play yeah Pascal Siakum is famous because he didn't play basketball until he was a teenager so you know why and he was drafted in the first round so that's an extra challenge that hockey has you literally have to get them children are five or six years old.

Like you're not skating at five or six, the odds are the same, it doesn't matter what athletic gifts you have, the act of skating is so unusual that you have to develop your muscles in a different way, you have to learn to do things while you skate like en Anyway, as Steve has shown us, yes, no, although I'm cool now, right? However, I can pivot and I am very proud that you know what an achievement it is and it takes time. Well, I won't even make it funny. The difference between you and me is that I only had the opportunity to skate when I was a kid.

It took me like five years to say oh, okay, this is fun in a way where I'm not completely useless, right? I haven't played hockey in a long time. I can skate but I don't like playing with pads and with a stick and all you would fly around me maybe not Jesse I want to set up stpm like hockey nights like every Friday or something and we all go play somewhere in the center you know it would be nice if I had told it to us on my own show, but I didn't tell it to you guys, so you might not have heard it at Christmas time.

My family has always rented ice when we could and we like children as my dad goes out on skates, as you know my brothers have children. My sister's kids, you know, it's a wide skate and this year, my oldest niece now had a boyfriend, a nice young man who thought he would skate with us and we got into a game of pick-up and I was trying to dodge him and I went to pick up the puck a little bit and I hit him dead on the ankle oh and I was like oh my god what did I do?

Welcome to the child of the family. I know what he was like with both hands on the wrist. He was polite and kind, but I'm sure he never wants to see me. Hey, it's exactly like, but in my mind I thought, Well, I'd just like to lift the puck over his stick and just catch it. Square at the angle you have it at though, like the football game in Wedding Crashers Goldberg, hockey and crab cakes, that's what we do, so even then the competitiveness comes when you get the chance um CJ uh overdrive yesterday I was talking about the Leaf loss versus the Oilers loss and then I'm going to let you go because I know you have to go this is long which one is worse oh sorry I just got a text and I totally lost the train of my thoughts.

The loss of Leaf. Oilers lost, which is worse. I don't know if they both lost, which would be fine, which one is worse for their organization, that's definitely how they both see it, yeah, yeah, but I mean, they both thought they were going to win a Stanley Cup or have a chance to win a Stanley Cup. , and They finished earlier than they thought, the Leaf loss is worse because they have bigger questions this offseason, okay, and I think there will be bigger changes in Toronto than in Edmonton, so I guess it's worse, but it's gradually like in this one.

Honestly, it's do it or don't it is fair enough, well listen, we'll end there. CJ has been kind enough to give us two hours of his time. CJ. Thank you so much. And you have a new CJ. The show is coming up tomorrow with Julian oh my god I have to do it again just keep the

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