COVID Psychological Manipulation: Unpacked

welcome to this video and from Sunny Sydney Australia. I would like to welcome Rosney Neong Cook, who unfortunately is a former registered psychologist, but we may move on to that Ros, welcome, thank you for coming, thank you for having me. John, the pleasure is all mine, thank you, so you've started one or you're a founding member of an organization called the Cape Byron lighthouse statement and I think the evidence that there really is about the lighthouse, right? and uh, what lighthouse? represents yes, but how did all this start? I mean, presumably a few years ago you were a happy psychologist, specializing in children and fame, something went wrong, something went wrong, John, and that was like for many of your listeners and for yourself.

It was the Covid lockdowns and the government's response to the lockdowns. Psychology is my second career, so although I am in middle age, I have only been in this profession for 15 years, which worried me the most. What I was seeing was the harmful effects of lockdowns, the potentially harmful effects of lockdowns on children and families. Actually, I'm not in Sydney. I'm in an area west of Sydney called the Blue Mountains and the reason I'm raising this is I don't know if you've heard of it but about 6 months before the lockdowns we had one of the worst bushfire seasons in Australia we have ever seen.

Did you hear about that and where I live? We are in a tourist community, so we had already seen that the local population had suffered dramatically in terms of loss of income, there were no tourists coming because of the fires and when we see that in a population that relies primarily on tourism, we see, of course. uh, I don't know if it's natural, but the increases in drug and alcohol abuse, domestic violence, you know, all kinds of abuse throughout life and when

covid

came along and they were talking about blocking cruise ships, etc. ., who bring a lot of tourism here, I was especially worried because we had already lost an entire summer tourism season and when they were talking about stopping the cruise ships and locking us up for a long time, I was very, very worried because ultimately it was the children that I work with are downstream of the impacts on the parents and when the parents lose their income when the parents are also locked at home, of course, it is understood, as I said, the increase in domestic violence in abuse of drugs and alcohol and that flows into the children who end up very traumatized, so I was very, very worried, however, as a relatively new psychologist, I didn't think it was my place to speak.

I assumed that the people who were higher up the chain, so to speak, would speak up, uh, because it was very obvious to me from the beginning that the

psychological

impacts of this were going to be devastating, not just a little bit devastating for the generations, so It's how I got to this, yeah, and what you initially did with these concerns, how you expressed them. and if you were able to communicate with your leaders and I tried initially, I liked it, I said, I waited, I think a lot about Ed, then I would talk to other people, whether it was friends, family, other professionals, and I remember this kind of I became more and more worried when I saw almost these very intelligent people with stunned faces, they just didn't take it in, but again I kept thinking, well, who am I?

I must be wrong, in some way I must be wrong because surely the powers that be who are, to the extent that I felt more superior to myself, they will come and fix things and when was it, so the first lockdowns of 2020, actually I thought and I hate to say this, but I actually thought it was going to be the northern winter of 2020 21 that I was going to see so much

psychological

collateral damage. I mean, can you imagine being a mother, a single mother on a Glasgow housing estate with five children having to homeschool them etc, so I thought it was going to be like that?

It would become obvious that this was much worse in terms of the psychological impacts and people would do something that didn't happen. So I did it. I tried to speak. In the end I don't know if you remember, but we did it. we went into this four month lockdown, we had incredible lockdowns here, we went into a 4 month lockdown on July 20, 2020 and it was very obvious because that was, if you remember, back in that Delta era, we knew from what they were saying . in the media that it was going to be months, it wasn't going to be weeks this time, and that was the point at which I wrote to the psychology boards, I wrote to the different professional associations and told them very, you know, politely, What are they?

What we are doing here we know that the collateral damage is going to be enormous. What can we do? And they told me, very, frankly, that yes, we understand it and other psychologists have written like you, but you have to understand that if you talk. You will face disciplinary action due to the Australian Government's gag orders and I remember seeing your response to that, John. I remember having such a visceral response to that because I thought that's the way they talk in North Korea or China and I mean like it may sound naive now, but I couldn't believe it.

I would face disciplinary action because I am terrified of what is going to happen to the children of the country and the planet in general, but what they did say was that they said other psychologists have done it too. I wrote to them and at the time I didn't realize that neither of them had, so I ended up contacting two psychologists that I know who are very experienced trauma psychologists and, again, it was always very difficult to open those conversations, wasn't it? ? people would think you're some kind of anti-conspiracy theory theorist, which is how all the media had programmed things, so I asked them nicely if something felt a little off and they just blurted out yes, absolutely, this is awful , so I suggested that we made a video together and the three of us were going to do that, however, at every point I wanted to bring up, they said we can't say that because we could lose our license or we can't say that because we could lose our license and at the same time In the end I was going to be so helpless that there wasn't much point in doing it, so in the end I decided I just had to do it.

I can't not talk, so I will. just, um, and I will do, you know, extensive due diligence to try to protect my license and I did, and it was during that process that I discovered a lot more than I realized. It's pretty incredible, isn't it psychology, medicine, science? work on debates work on thesis synthesis of antithesis Progressive dialectical development exchange of ideas and here we had this city capital totalitarian authoritarian Ian dictatorial edicts that said shut up do what they tell you ignore your professional training there is no debate here we know better your role is to obey.

Your role is to say yes. I remember kind of um no, it's almost like a Stanley Milgram situation, isn't it? It's absolutely a 100% Stanley Milgram situation and that was one of the things. John, the interesting thing was that when I decided to make that video, what I was trying to communicate was that the collateral damage was going to be extensive, my feeling was that and my family is English, my mother grew up, you know, she was born during the Second World War. World Cup, so there's a real legacy there of kind of keeping Cal and carrying out the period.

And I thought it was more about raising awareness at this very unique time in history where in the Western world we haven't had major calamities. in my homeland and that's really unusual, so previously the whole community was connected in a more understanding way and I'm talking in an autonomously understanding way, whereas now most people don't expect that kind of thing to happen, Like I said, I mean. I've traveled a lot, I've been to Russia and Turkey and all these places and I used to laugh a little when I saw their corruption so open and I thought, oh, that had never happened in England or Australia and how I was wrong and that was the premise with which initially I was making that video, but then when I started doing the deep due diligence, like I said, I suddenly found this whole new world of censorship and that was the part that didn't.

I know about censorship and propaganda and then I realize horribly that the entire population is very traumatized, not used to being traumatized because there haven't been these extremely stressful situations in Western countries in general, um and not only that. but that they were using and very profoundly misusing psychology as a weapon to make people comply. I was so deeply distressed by this John. I kept thinking I was wrong. I kept thinking I was wrong, how could this be happening? You know, I told you. when we made ched previously I ended up losing two stone the existential angst of this blew my world away.

I couldn't imagine that in Australia or England the governments could actually be deliberately censoring and publishing this highly coercive propaganda to make people fall in line to obey being stuck at home with those potential harms of the dam, but then ultimately , coercion is not even a strong enough word, uh, people finally had a gun to their head to take this vaccine or you lost your job, you felt it you were defending your patients and your clients you were a professional advocate acting absolutely in your best interest because I see advocacy as fundamental to the role of any healthcare provider my patient doesn't know the things she is in a vulnerable situation so I advocate on her behalf and that is what you felt you were doing was absolutely like that and what I also did.

I'm sure you have something similar in the UK, John, we do. I know they have the same thing in Canada, in Australia, yes. When working with children, we have something called mandatory reporting obligations. Do you have something similar? If we have a feeling that there might be some form of abuse or neglect, um, and there are eight different risks of significant harm that they feel we owe as professionals. I pointed that out to the various authorities and normally that is done on a case by case basis, but in this situation, when I went and looked again at the eight different forms of potential harm and they range from physical violence, neglect, risk to the Unborn Child, which was another huge, all eight forms, absolutely unequivocally, were going to be, you know, potentially at risk because of the government's response, so I released my video as a mandatory report and the interesting thing was I spoke to a lawyer.

I'm really nervous about doing it too John, I didn't want to do this. I'm not someone who talks in general. um, you know, I've never done anything publicly, but I've gotten to the point where, as a father and as someone who works. with the children I can't I can't not talk, but I used that mechanism and spoke with a lawyer the night before. I finally got the courage to post that video and I said, "I want to do this as a mandatory report, how does that relate to the gag orders, so we had gag orders, you didn't, in fact, they put gag orders on us." silence in Australia, all health professionals do not speak against the government's vaccine policy and, uh, he said, he said oh, that's a very good idea, he said that it actually triumphs, he said that by law the obligations of Mandatory reporting to protect children are higher than gag orders issued by bureaucracies, so these gag orders also include lockdowns and other

covid

restrictions, uh, no, they were just about the mandates, the vaccine mandates and that's how they got me because although I talked a lot in that video, I did about the psychology, not just the psychological harms, but I was trying to raise awareness with the public about how the entire community had become so divided in these sort of I don't know tribes versus Man United football tribes, right, but I also talked about the precautionary principle and at that time they had just started the vaccine rollout and they were going after pregnant mothers and the you know, which for me was always, I mean, from a common sense standpoint, we've lived the idea and all you know is that many other situations of this type surely give untested chemicals to pregnant women when we tell them that they can't eat.

We are still going to use certain cheeses and soaps without trying them, I mean for the love of God, so actually that's what they used to suspend me although I said uh very clearly uh as a psychologist I can't talk about these things however there are other professionals That's what they say , I was still criticized for speaking blindly, so the legal obligations introduced by statutes prevented him from complying with the mandatory legal reporting requirements. It's just a complete contradiction, yeah, and I may not be using the right legal terms, John, uh. someone could attack me for that, so certainly mandatory reporting requirements are statutory.

I think the gag orders were under some kind of emergency powers and I don't know if that might have a different nickname. I'm not entirely sure. I'm interested in the psychological techniques the government used to get people to comply. I mean, what kind of psychology exists there and how it was used in the Australian situation. The psychological piece, I think for me.Could we talk for hours about this John? He is really huge. I think for me, as for many others, it's been one of the most disappointing pieces because I think people really need to understand when I went into psychology as a second career.

Again, it was naively assumed that people went into psychology because they wanted to help people, but in reality a large number of psi, the highest performing psychologist at the University, were carefully selected by and I'm sure you can guess who are the advertising companies, the gambling companies, uh, it's Silicon Valley now, uh, but also these nudge units and, uh, the B units around the world, nudge is an interesting euphemism, right? is that so? n nudge nudge means covert psychological

manipulation

of thought. Bingo, yeah, and one of the tricky things with nudges is that a lot of people, and I think there's kind of an inverse correlation with people being more educated and having more letters after your name.

You're immune oh, I would never fall in love with marketing, I would never fall in love with advertising and it gives me a boost. I'm too smart. I probably had that arrogance when I was 20, but if that's the case, let's take a look at all these multiples. -millions or billions are advertising companies around the world what is really key with nudges and any psychological use of marketing gambling is that it all targets the unconscious areas of the brain, it targets the posterior areas of the brain, um, I'm sure. You already know this, John, but possibly some of the viewers don't, it is estimated that around 95% of our decision making in everyday life, how we travel around the world, how we respond to different situations, is mediated from the back of the mind.

Our brain. uh, of unconscious decision making and those unconscious drivers that are very, very primary, they are very innate, they actually are, there are different estimates between 200 and I think someone is saying 20,000 times faster and more powerful than our prefrontal cortex. and this again if We're going back to what I was saying before about that we live in this unique time in the West, we kind of really rify our prefrontal cortices, don't we? It's about who is the smartest in the class, who can last the longest. data and that's this part of the brain and it's very, very smart and it's great for doing math and it's great for all kinds of things, but it shuts down when we're stressed, as you know, it shuts down or it certainly loses a lot of power and pushes.

They were based on that, they were based on the fact that people operate from the back of their brain, they are very distressed, they are very scared, they are excited with sympathy, uh, and what happens, if I'm going to get into that genre, it's just that a little bit too yeah no begging please yeah please so like a really basic psychological 101, when we're under extreme stress, our brain and nervous system completely change the way they operate. if we are simply sitting in a quiet place one on one. -a situation and what the body is trying to do is ultimately keep us alive, so it takes the brain, takes the resources away from these newer parts and sends them to the main muscle groups, the legs, the arms, so we can You can fight or flee and people will know it as a fight and flight system and that's great if you're fighting a bear or I don't know if you want to jump out of the way of a car, so if you want to jump car out of the way or you want to start a fight or you want to run away from someone, chase a companion or escape from a saber-toothed tiger ex exactly all those saber-toothed tigers that we have around right now let me close that um so it works very, very well because you move very fast um, however, in a situation where there's actually no real physical danger to life, it can cause all kinds of problems because what we ended up with in 2020.

It's 2020 when this all started. Not that I'm a little confused, yeah, we ended up with all these families, uh, and Friends completely divided again into those kind of football teams, highly intelligent rational people, people with a pre-existing deep connection who were completely separated and what happened coming back to the brain so what happens is if you and I are talking if you have a different point of view than me if I'm calm and in that parasympathetic state I'll say oh that's interesting John oh okay and then I might go out and think about But if you're yelling at me or it comes out of a media screen with loud red noises and, oh my God, everyone's going to die of Covid, then again the brain goes into sympathetic.

During arousal, it sends most of the blood down here and the prefrontal cortex contracts, so you can't hold two contradictory points of view in space and deal with it rationally. And very unfortunately, this is when the psychological defenses and the pushing come in because we now know that I didn't do it at the time, uh, but everything had been programmed to separate so that people would come in, well, they didn't want to separate, they wanted everyone Did they not follow the government line and the way they did it? I'm not sure if you've seen that there have now been some kind of review articles published about what the most successful nudges were by gender.

Have you seen that it doesn't? I haven't seen it again and that's how it is. Disappointing to say the least, for women it was about staying in the community looking after their children etc. for men it was about, I don't remember the term they used, but basically it was that you're a coward if you don't get vaccinated and at this point in history, when men really feel like they've lost their role, the waters get very murky, um, so that the government subconsciously tells you that you are a coward if you don't get vaccinated. vaccinate your family you are a coward you are not a man you are not protecting the weak man that is that man up that is exactly and it is so manipulative it is horrible what they have done.

I really did it. I didn't realize this when I made the first video, but now that I went and looked at all these techniques that they used, it's um, yeah, I almost feel embarrassed as a psychologist, um, but by that, John, I just want to say that it's very So it's easy for people to jump on the psychologists who work in the nudge units and say, "oh, you know, they're complicit, they're evil, all these things, but I really think the vast majority of them are young." They take them out of college, come in, give them big salaries and think they were doing the right thing.

I don't think everyone was thinking for a moment that they were trying to manipulate people to achieve bad ends and they were OB, they were obeying orders and conforming, yeah, um, it's a bit, I mean Solomon, since things also come in In that, don't you know that you simply conform to those around you? He has psychology all over him, but the idea that there was an organized government department that increased fear to increase our sympathetic activity and deliberately reduce our rationality is actually quite disturbing and everyone who watches Ros knows it. Sometimes I get anxious and I hate, I hate the feeling of course, but the worst thing about it is that it robs you of your rationality yeah, you can't think clearly, you know, usually I'll say, okay, we have a particular situation here, let's look at the airway, let's look at the breathing, let's look at the circulation or whatever, you know, that's In a first aid situation, as long as there's not a catastrophic hemorrhage, initially you know that you have a rational way to resolve these things and the anxiety it just robs you of that and it's just horrible that this happens. and it really is, I think it attests to the potential power that governments have and should act as a warning of possible dystopian situations for the future because these powers are real, this psychological

manipulation

I would call, I could euphemize it. at a push is that these things are real and we are all susceptible to them we are susceptible to advertising you know what we are, most of us are average drivers we are not above average drivers like we think because by definition it has to be average you know, people have this unrealistic assessment of themselves and I am prone to external environmental stimulation and other people and authorities massively.

I would say a lot less than it was before the start of this pandemic, but yeah, let's get on with what led to uh what. It's Lighthouse uh Roos, why did he make what was a lighthouse? How did that lighthouse statement begin? Yes, actually, I know you know John and possibly some of your readers are, but Kate Barron's lighthouse statement really was an homage to the great Barington statement, uh, and if you remember, that one that focused on well revolved around around the focus protection for the elderly and the sick, they were saying let's stop these lockdowns, too much collateral damage, let's focus on those who really need extra protection, um, so our statement is about raising awareness about censorship, and that's the censorship of a large number of health professionals around the world.

Everyone who, as we've been discussing, was deeply concerned about what was happening with co-politics and was really concerned, you know, which was particularly worrying was that this censorship and propaganda, especially, gave the false impression that only there was a truth that they kept talking about, trusting science and with the implication that any other narrative was not scientific, so it's about freedom of expression, it's about letting people know. that there are a large number of healthcare professionals speaking out, many of whom were subjected to what can be described as highly draconian treatments by medical boards and governments around the world;

We were sort of like the naughty kids in class who were setting an example with the ultimate goal of terrifying others into submission and obedience and in my case they took away my psychology license. They threatened me with jail. I was there with huge fines, uh, and they even gave me a psychiatric evaluation that I didn't go to. So we still have, like you again, most viewers will know a complete media blackout of any alternative viewpoints. People who speak out are often ridiculed and labeled with those words which have again been pushed to the 99th degree and weaponized as things like anti-vaxxers and conspiracy theorists, when people hear those words they automatically shut down and yes, It's really about letting everyone know that we are not this fringe group of dangerous charlatans, which is what the media says, that there are actually great many of us who know what we are talking about and have a very different story to tell.

It's frightening. You don't agree with me. Therefore, you are probably mentally ill. That really is the ultimate statement of arrogance. We have this censorship problem basically all over the world, do you think? And it's not just these issues that you raised, we have things like particular treatments that should be available for open discussion and debate, things that are things done things that aren't done, you know, putting your own examples in your particular professional situation, it's I mean, they're nurses, doctors, environmentalists and all these people or even ORD citizens around the world, are they seeing this or are they?

No, they're not seeing it and if they're not seeing it, why the hell not? I think one of them and as I mentioned before, John, I was back in the UK for a month at the end of last year during a family visit and after I lost my license I spend most of my time talking to people like you who are aware of what's going on. I spent very little time on, whatever you want to call it, the other side of the Looking Glass when I went back to the UK and lived in the UK for many years.

I went to UNI there. I spent a lot of time with different Fred families and groups, who I really love and respect. Very smart people, but none of them know what's going on. and I remember after about 3 or 4 days I thought I can't do this. I have to go out. This is very difficult. But it actually became a complete gift because I was living in Worlds and we passed. a lot of time in a lot of different homes where people were reading I don't know what newspaper they were watching the BBC they were talking Yes it's true but I think what we can so easily forget is that there are so many doctors, health professionals, everyone There is a type of people who are really on our side, whatever you want to call it, who are so frustrated with these people and think they're stupid or complicit, but having that window back into that world really reminded me and I think it's critical for people to understand.

If you're not stupid or complicit, you have no idea and if you do here, I think one of the mistakes we've made and I've certainly made it myself was that from the beginning we were just sending all this information to our friends and our family because we wanted them to know what was going on, we were trying to send them all this data, but again, when people are very psychologically defended in the face of a potentially huge existential threat, they can't process a lot of new things. data, so even if you manage to get a little bit throughof a crack, what will they do?

They will go to Google, yes, or they will go to Facebook and there again they will see that no, these people are crazy against conspiracy theories, just stay away. It's dangerous and it goes on and on so you might even go to a fact checker to check the facts haha ​​right thanks reiters or all those friendly news initiatives I know so this is one of the pieces for me, the most important piece is psychological. consciousness until the entire Playbook that they have used is a psychological Playbook and therefore until people understand the psychology of what is happening, it is really difficult to see a way out of this mess and I struggle and I have mentioned this above.

John and I have said it publicly and I'm not. I often get blown up with many of those in the truth community, so to speak, especially doctors, this is not a medical debate, ultimately it is a debate. medical, but ultimately it is psychological, we have to understand how people got to where they were and how they ended up. I agree with the opinions that they made because if we have a lot of people that let me understand, let me put this in better words if you find yourself in a situation where you are in those two tribes of football where you are very divided, whether "About covid, whether it's about gender, the climate of Ukraine, it's fundamentally the same if you have smart people who are in a very different position than you until you understand the psychology and you can see how they have come to the conclusion that they have come to you. ".

You're never really going to get anywhere, you're just going to continue to see them as some kind of opponent, but I really think, John, that the vast majority of us could surely have some personality disorders and psychopathy at the top. from the government at the top of the pharmaceutical companies at the top of the media the vast majority of people are good, they are lovely, they love their families, they tried in that terrible covid situation to protect their families, those are all those innate impulses and if they were totally caught up in the whole media story, then they believed that vaccinating their children, vaccinating pregnant women, all of that was the best thing to do and that we were dangerous, so to actually be able to look at the Other people's stories bring compassion.

For them, that's really the way out, as far as I can see, or a lot of doctors still believe that they just have to shout data louder and louder at governments and at the courts, um, but for me, I don't think that's the one. the way, so we have a lot of people who just have preconceived ideas about the reality of what's happening, yeah, largely because it seems to me because I think what you've said is that it's kind of rubbish. in a kind of garbage situation, isn't it because the media is controlled because the narrative is controlled because there is only one narrative because detractors of that narrative like you are punished?

Yeah, we end up with a situation where, well, well, I want to use the word Orwellian, it's an Orwellian situation, there's a particular truth and if you don't hold that truth, you might be sent for a psychiatric evaluation and that's really scary. , scary, is this related? Don't know. I know I've written a couple of psychological terms, they may not be psychological terms. I have sort of massive delusions in The Madness of Crowds, it's that kind of huge group psychology, so when I talk about these pieces I usually explain that. There are sort of four main pieces that are psychological pieces that are causing the first to be, as we said before, most people in their daily life, their intellectual processing is unconscious from early childhood, the second is that when we are alarmed , like I already said, we go to the back of our brain, um, the third and the fourth, so to speak, I'll talk about the third, first, the third is the dependence on primary caregivers, so When we are young children, Obviously, as humans, we have to rely on these strong primary caregivers to protect us for at least 10 years.

You'll be lucky to be able to take care of yourself after that, but you might be able to, and that innate drive is so strong that very Unfortunately, if a caregiver is not safe, so they are abusive or neglectful, which children unfortunately They almost always do is internalize that it is somehow their own fault because a child cannot, does not have the ability to reject a primary caregiver. So even if you have a child in a highly abusive situation who has the potential to go to foster care, they would rather stay with their current caregiver than go to that foster home and even though that's when we're kids, then growing up and everything this is, of course, unconscious, right, these are unconscious impulses when we grow up and go to college and move into our first apartments, those kinds of things that dependency on the primary caregiver doesn't just dissolve when you turn 18 or 21.

It is unconsciously transferred to the government and the institutions that are supposedly there to protect us, so again, if that government again does something that is unsafe, whether negligent or abusive on the part of NE, we will still prefer to default, especially when we are stressed ​​for what they're saying and So moving from that to the fourth piece, which is the group psychology piece again, I think it's like we just talked to advertising. Group psychology is a piece where people think they are too smart. I would never be part of a group. I'm a free thinker, etc., but the group psychology piece I think has been the number one driver of what's happened.

We are pack animals. We are pack animals. We swim with the fish. We fly with the flock and once again. The higher the stress, the more we hold on to that package and it's been one of the most interesting pieces for me. Why didn't many of us do it? And that is an extraordinarily complex piece. I think I certainly have enough. some theories about that um I guess the psychological theory here would be attachment theory I mean it's bulbous and people like that made the original well that's yeah fascinating you've sent that John so look I think the Attachment has a big part to play. with it and, interestingly, the insecurely attached to is more likely to see it, this is one of the few times that being securely attached because if you are securely attached, on a primary level you trust your caregiver and that again is transfers to the government. and also people that I see and this is a really sensitive piece because people have this assumption that if we talk about insecure attachment we're talking about oh, you're telling me that my mother didn't love me, no. not at all, insecure attachment is something that travels down the family line, it's a huge piece in the post war again, this is a piece we could talk about for a long time, like I was talking about before, keep calm and carry on . to insecure attachment, but it came from a place of love, we have to protect our children who are seeing bombs that are blowing up many family members, you know, from being killed on the front, so let's not generate emotions in our family because that leaves. too vulnerable people, that's an insecure attachment, so there is also a construction site next to my house at the moment there are Croatian guys there.

I see over and over again people who grew up in countries where they had the former Yugoslavia, what we would do now. Call insecure caregivers, so what happens is they get together and the amygdala scan a little more for danger, they don't just assume everything is fine, whereas if you grow up in the west with a secure attachment, it's much more likely that why you should do it. people distrust their government, John, and this is a huge piece, this is what made me so sick when I found out that we should be able to trust our government, we should be able to trust our media and our doctors and medical boards, just They relate that a little. al igdal, the igdal migdala is this type of guardian of the higher centers, what is the mdala?

Yeah, so, I and again, that's why I think everyone needs to understand basic psychology. I used to show it to 5-year-olds and I can even go here and show it to you because I still have it from my Telly Health sessions, that's how I used to show the amydala. Can you see them? Yes, young children, so we have I have the anger and the scared rabbit and I would describe the amygdala as the security guard and the security guard wants to keep you alive. He's a big, strong guy but he's not very smart and he makes mistakes, so you can really think about the amygdala.

It's kind of like our brain's fire alarm, it's looking for threats to keep us AA to keep us safe, much of what we might now call the ego exists, it's there to keep us alive, but it has false alarms, etc. If you grew up in a family or grew up in a country where there was constant conflict, then your amidala will be alert, it will be alert for danger, you are less likely to believe everything you hear, you may have a little more of a questioning mentality, uh Authority, and yes, people who grew up in countries where there was war or trauma, uh, children who grow up in traumatic situations again, are much more likely to see it than people who are firmly attached and had a really easy life in the West and that's a lot of doctors and a lot of medical work, not all, but a lot, many of us are essentially pre-programmed to adapt to being good little citizens 100% yes, I think there's a genetic piece there too, but that's for another day, yes, Well, again, that refers to attachment, doesn't it?

If parents were not well attached, then their children would be like we can get this. generational type, not so much. I think there are some dopamine and serotonin transporter genes that are involved. I used to work with a subset of the population that is referred to differently as highly sensitive or has differential susceptibility, have you heard? of this type of research area, no, no, do you want me to talk about it or are we going to go on too long and need to give ourselves a couple of minutes? Yeah, a quick couple of minutes it's basically about 15 years ago. like Darwin and Wallace, who came up with their theory almost exactly at the same time, there were different groups of researchers who came across this same theory, at the same time, some of them working with children, some of them working with mosquitoes, I want say.

It was extraordinary what they found, is that again they have different numbers, so I call it on average about 12.5% ​​of the population and that's the entire file. The energetic scale is very sensitive and what that means is that people get a little angry and they are saying, oh you, you are saying that I am emotionally sensitive, no, it is environmentally sensitive in various ways, it means that people respond, there is more plasticity in their response to situations, how I've done it, there are several explanations, uh, the one that kind of intuitively fits well with me is that it's a kind of speciation event similar to the way we would consider a canary, you know, we would put the canaries in the mine to see if the right things were dangerous, then these highly sensitive people are. a situation for better or worse, so if you put them in good environments, they thrive, they are the top percentage of musicians than intellectuals, etc., etc., if you put them in a very stressful environment, they go the other way, so they fall apart and end. drug and alcohol problems across the board, but the theory says that speciation, the genetic reason we're still here is because our job is to go out and look for new fields, so to speak, like the canary, so if we go out and we find a new environment that is very safe and flourishing, then we do very well, then the herd will follow us and if we go down to the coal mine it is horrible, so no one follows it, but the way I see it in relation to what's happening right now, it's the job of the highly sensitive phenotype to scan the field to look, to look at everything and it's really a piece of the system that thinks well, it's an ability to see the field, it's an ability. look and have more variables in mind and consider how they are going to affect the organism and whether they are ultimately going to be safe or not, so in this case you are looking at all kinds of things that are highly unsafe, so what I What I What I found is that the vast majority of people I talk to in the resistance or in the Freedom Community, whatever you want to call it, are very sensitive.

Many of them have a lot of trauma. Both me and I, so I started out quite docile because I had been forced to go about my professional career following guidelines which, to be fair, for most of my career I was based on many of them, of course they were wrong, but they were based on the best evidence available at the time, so I have done so. Me, but now I question absolutely everything, so can C? Can I C? Can you change to get into this yes from 87 and a half to 12 and a half? Can you learn to be one of the 12 and a half percent?

I have absolutely done it and it has to be safe, you have tounderstand a little bit of psychology and it has to be safe for you to do it and I'm so glad you brought up that point, John, because I too did a complete 180. In fact, right at the beginning of those very dramatic first weeks of confinements. I asked my doctor about including my daughter in the vaccine trial. This was like 18 months before she came out or a year. before she came out because she had a very compromised immune system and at the time they were saying that covid was only a risk for the elderly and those with compromised immune systems.

I think there are a lot of people again in the resistance community that get very angry with people who do 180 degrees and change, I think the most powerful thing is that change is turning around, you know, being in a position, following complying again, why would we question the government telling us to do this? It's not safe, uh, you. I know this, sorry, CO is unsafe. Why would we question it? We live in England, we live in Australia, there is no propaganda, they will tell us the truth, so it takes quite a long time and a lot.

I haven't heard your story, John. but the stress and anguish of making that change is not good for me, so it was cognitive dissonance you know, we, science said that vaccines were perfectly safe just to use vaccines as an example, you know, science said that official science said that ivin is a complete waste of time yeah so I was talking to the doctors in Africa who said who told me they were saving lives with ice. I was talking to uh um, Kyle, who was the first vaccine injured person that I interviewed who had severe myocarditis from a safe vaccine and I got this tremendous dissonance and it actually took a while.

Did it really take quite a few months to accumulate this evidence and then the evidence just kept piling up and piling up? I say no, no, all official teaching cannot be wrong. You know the government has the best interest at that time. It was almost almost overnight when the damn thing broke out and I was like, just a minute, this Emperor is completely naked here, yeah, and it was a pretty harrowing situation, but I mean, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm glad I can do it. Being at 12 and a half%, is it the red pill? I confuse them yes R take my pills is 12 and a half the number of people now that are realizing that what is happening is increasing, so this 122% are now getting about 20%, do you think I see myself? , that 12 and a half%, as I said, comes from a particular field, it's just the genetic predisposition, yeah, so I don't know.

I've heard so many different figures with this, I don't know. I know John, but if I can, I'd really like to go back to the point you made about how distressing it was now because, for different reasons, we were exposed through my daughter's health program, and I guess you because you were a nurse educator. and I would be listening to a lot of different people, most people are not exposed to this, like you said, just like me, just like most people I talk to, the veil lifts very slowly and the way it works is that the subconscious mind is a kind of being people talk about planting seeds, it is being Pepper with fragments of information and a mass is formed, the neural network begins to form together and then it will begin to emerge in Consciousness, as I said before so that people could search on Google. it comes back but then more comes in and it starts coming so when you finally leave it's very fast and it's very distressing and that's the part that I would really like people to understand is that if we can take that point of view it's almost like waking up to a sleeping baby, it really is, isn't it?

You can't go in if you go in and yell at them to wake them up, you go in very, very gently, it's just that we can have compassion for people, that's when they discover that the floor is going to fall on them like it happened to many of us and we have to do it with a lot of softness and eliminate all this division that has been deliberately done, the majority of people are good, the vast majority of people are good and they are trying to do the right thing, so if it is possible and not everyone can like it, I constantly tell you that, especially for people who have been really bullied by governments and lost their licenses, it can be difficult, but try to have compassion and you I know that giving you these little snippets would make it a lot easier to live in this delusional world, but I personally want to stay in touch with reality.

I want to follow the evidence and you know no, you don't always necessarily like it. the conclusion and and especially when it contradicts some of the axioms that you've actually lived your life and you realize that they were actually wrong and then there's a little bit of shame and embarrassment, I really mean, I mean You know, I think the propaganda about vaccines is huge and when I realized it was propaganda I thought for a moment I wrote a textbook on physiology and one of the chapters on it was on natural immunity, where was that going? Yes, I wrote a chapter about that.

I taught it for 30 years and yet you don't seem to have that rationality and then when you realize it was propaganda and you think, how could I not use that information that I've spent my life accumulating and that you can say even now? I'm still confused, yes, it's just not a good place to be, it's not a good place to be and we certainly don't have all the answers yet. I mean, I like you, John. I almost fell to my knees when I realized I was like. Oh my gosh, they're using psychology, they're using all this propaganda, um, yeah, it's been amazing what they've done, the shame piece is one of the biggest psychological blocks we're dealing with, especially in the medical profession, is the piece that has to be handled again with greater sensitivity and is the reason why I think raising awareness about the psychological part is so important, have you heard of the double bind theory?

Simply put, it is where people find themselves in an impossible situation. Damned if you do. Damn if not, they happen frequently in family situations. But in this situation, as an example, if you take the average doctor around the world, they have studied incredibly hard to get it. where they are they have a hypocritical oath that is an extremely important piece for them so they have the hypocritical oath that I will care and do the best for my patients and then they have a government that says in some countries you are gagged but in other countries, you are quite implicit, so ultimately they are completely stagnant.

Now, Bateson's way out of the double bind is that he says that the only thing that can be done is to illuminate the double bind, it is necessary to name it because when it is named, then I can start looking for solutions and I go back to the doctors again. I think they are in an extraordinarily difficult situation. Yes, there may be some who are starting to realize what is going on and who are too scared to know and there are certainly others who still just don't know. I remember having a great chat with CLA Craig when I finished a couple of months ago and she said to me: Ros, you're your average doctor, your average GP in the UK, they work long hours a week, they're parents. they've got all this huge amount of Juggle that we all have these days, they can watch the BBC in the evening, they'll get regular updates from the GMC and if they smell something not right then they'll go. to the GMC or any of their appropriate professional boards and have them told the same party line, so it's very, very difficult for them and I think again we have to be very careful about how we treat people who may have this huge barrier of shame on you for I mean, if you imagine highly intellectual doctors and other professionals seeing us as anti-contra fringe conspiracy theorists, that's what they've been told to do in a complete 180, which we're actually right about, and especially with doctors whose entire self-concept was built from childhood on being the smartest kid in the class, the potential for shame is so great that we must let them know that you were manipulated, you were psychologically manipulated, you did the best you thought you could, you know what you did. what you thought was right.

So one of the reasons I make these videos you know actually admit that you're wrong to admit that you're ashamed, it's pretty hard to do, but you know, maybe if people see me doing it. They might follow you, you know, it's true, nosk, eh, know thyself, that's what it's all about. What we have said also means that we do not need to name them, but it makes sense for some historical situations where totalitarianism and dictators have taken over. charging and rebelling against that standard narrative, it becomes remarkably difficult and one of the things that really terrifies me about this whole thing and one of the very important reasons for doing this is that dystopias are possible, you know, we have, I mean.

North Korea may be the classic example, but we have dystopias where all of these manipulation techniques can be used by small numbers of people in power to control large numbers of people. Yes, the divide and rule type of strategy is also used. Mhm, I mean there was There was a time in our colonial history when around 40,000 British officials were administering 400 million people in India. How can it be good to get Maharaja A to slightly disagree with Maharaja B and, you know, then you have smaller groups to control and um, we have the division, we have the psychological manipulation going on and I think it's fair to call it manipulation psychological by the main media, yes, where there is a narrative, anything else is attacked, nothing else is trusted, anything else is a fact of misinformation.

You ladies tell you what the facts are, but the fact is that they are making it up as they go along and there is the medical version of that, of course, sorry, the medical version is medical journals, you know, they often publish what It is bought and paid. Yes, I'm so sorry, I interrupted you, what were you saying? No, no, no, no, I'm not sure because absolutely other points come up now and for me I don't know if it was 15 or 10 years ago. Do you remember Marci Angel? she said about lanet and njm so you remember her, I mean that should have done it.

I've seen that there are quite a few similar articles where the alarm was well and truly sounded, yes, and she basically said after, I think it was 20 years as editor of the New England Journal of Medicine she said, I can't do this anymore. I can't control the amount of corruption. What if a better word from a farmer is selecting what comes in and I can't? do it and with full awareness and I think I remember at that moment thinking oh brilliant, that's what then no, but I think with the psychological piece yes, people throughout history have been trapped in various psychological manipulations, but The thing is, it's like with a magic trick John, when someone shows you a magic trick and it can leave you absolutely stumped for hours when they show you how they do it, it disappears and the same goes for the psychological piece and that's why A lot of the work I'm doing outside of Lighthouse is starting to educate the public about what's going on in a very safe way to show them because it has to be done in a way that eliminates shame.

It's not because people are stupid, but because people have targeted their unconscious brain directly. that will always win the race Drives behavior What is the reason? We may have spent the last time discussing this, but why is admitting you're wrong so difficult and harder? Yeah, I mean, that's the m. Part of the problem, yes, I think I'll speak from a British, male point of view because I grew up in a very British, very male family. I think one of the biggest problems we have is that men particularly are raised and especially private school boys, um, are raised to discount their emotional life when they are little, if they cry, stop being so sensitive.

I'll give you something to cry about for all that kind of stuff and, again, I don't think this came from any kind of malevolence. I think it came from the fact that ultimately men are the physical protectors, men are the warriors and so historically we needed men to be tough and therefore we pushed. Turn down the emotions, so we have all these men walking the planet running most of the big organizations, the media, the farmers, all sea levels, yes, those who don't have most of the, there will always be exceptions , but don't have those emotions. your kingdom complete again your self-concept your e you know the ego and I'm not using it in a pejorative sense is formed around your intelligence.

I rose to this level because I'm very smart um so this is it if all of this is put in the sense that it's been the smart one versus the ant, you know, the idiots, science trusts science versus the idiots who don't. They understand the science, so I mean they've done wonderfully, John, you've got to give it to them. We have to give importance to how they havemanipulated this, so we have to do it, we can't and this is the piece right now. We still have everyone trying to analyze the data. Look at all these vaccinated.

Look at this. Look at this. Trying to surprise. I don't think that's the way they have to understand and that they have been manipulated. As? How do we do that and how does that take us into the future? So I think we have to do it. Obviously we're going to do these parts with this podcast, but I think in the future we have to consider psychological awareness education from the beginning. Children, parents, caregivers. It's not rocket science like I showed you before, even the basic parts. I teach it to five year olds and they love it, they learn it right away, they will be talking about their friend.

Oh, there goes my fire alarm, okay, it's just my amygdala, but if you try to teach that to a 50-year-old kid. CEO of a large agricultural company a year old or 60 years old, it's much more difficult, so I think there has to be absolutely and I know we're talking when you're in Sydney, uh, I'll talk about that piece that We need to look at psychological psychoeducation. generalized and understanding perspective taking, I mean perspective taking such a big piece in this type of Salan task that we use with children with autism. There is no Salan task. I'm glad I came.

I'm learning a lot of psychology, please tell us, this one is really basic and I mean, it's mostly used in research, but it's how we understand a child's ability to consider how they hold another person's perspective, so is called. the field of theory of mind and yeah, basically I'm thinking about B, you're thinking about B, you know I'm thinking about A, I know you're thinking about B and I know you're thinking that B might make you think I mean, ends in this mirror of mirrors, it gets very, very complex, but I know that he said that she said that he thought that the conclusion is that with this task it is like this, so you You have these two little dolls, you have Sally and you have Anne, and Sally has a basket and she puts a chocolate in it while you look and there's a basket in the box and then Anne walks out of the room, so you're showing this to 3.

Anne, four 5-year-olds, walks out from the room and then Sally takes the chocolate and puts it in the box and then Anne comes back and you ask the girl where Anne thinks the chocolate is okay, so it's if she was conscious, then if They are very small and I don't remember which ones I said, but she'll think it was where she moved to the box, but after five they should know well, wait, she was out of the room when she moved, but ultimately what we currently have is we have this division that is created in adults who are not failing in the task of Salan, does that make sense?, so we do not understand that we are just going to join your man and you are an idiot, right, and I am divided, we are not going well, so you think that these vaccines are safe and we are dangerous because they fed you this propaganda and therefore they are right and they can't see where we are, yes they are labels and stereotypes.

It is not like this? They're good at it and they've deliberately weaponized those words so that as soon as people hear the word anti-vaxxer or conspiracy theorists, remember those old cartoons from the '70s and the evil villain hypnotized people and they? he would have those big eyes that roll around, that's what happens, people hear antivaxer and there they are just there. Do you think I had planned to ask this question? But organizations can behave 100% psychopathic, meaning they are motivated by money and can act in a way that is completely aoral to achieve their ends psychopathy means to me that people are just things that can be manipulated MH uh yeah I'm a psychopath PE other people are just things I can step on I can do whatever I want with them as long as it's serving my ends, now organizations can behave like that.

Do you think some organizations? Of course, we are not naming any examples, but is it possible that organizations are like this because there are specific people who really are and a very small proportion of the population are psychopaths, are in control or can occupy high influential positions in organizations Yes, and not only in companies. I would argue that the vast majority of the institutions that currently govern us and are meant to be protectors are acting in psychopathic ways. the judiciary, the government, huge levels of bureaucracy and, again, it's very important to say that it's not because there are evil psychopaths and I don't even want to say that all psychopaths are evil because they're not, but it's not about individual actors like you say, organizations. they can form their whole new culture and that as a group means that people will follow that group and fall into it.

I really believe that and again I think it's a big problem that we have, there are a lot of redpilled groups around the world that are still trying to fight the government role commissions, this and that, I mean, you know, I'm involved on one here, but ultimately the way most solutions you know are trying to fix things is almost with this. starting from this premise that there are bad people in those institutions and if we just eliminate those bad actors and put in good actors like you and me, John, then everything will be fine, but I don't think that's the case at all, I think they are those systems and institutions that are largely in the way you're talking about create the B acors yes, they have a particular culture that they do that that encourages people to behave in a particular way yes and of course over time, that involves particular people Recruited, so you know, if you choose an agency, say the BBC in my country, the way I perceive it is a completely different organization with completely different objectives now than the one I knew when I was young, you know , when working remotely. areas of the world the BBC was an absolute lifesaver you know you tune into It Go D this is London and that meant you were going to understand the truth has changed you know in the last 40 years it's just changed beyond recognition you know there's this The evolution and Unfortunately much of the evolution seems to have been in a negative direction and I see the same thing in Australia.

I see the same thing with governments and the fact that this is happening in many places at the same time for the last 40 years. What is happening in many places tells me that there is a possibility that there is an external cause that is affecting all of these. Am I just being paranoid or is this a possibility? So I try to stay away from John, from what's behind all this. There are some nice things. Diverse and quite terrifying theories. I'm staying in my lane with this. My feeling is that in the last 30 to 40 years, what we have seen, we have seen a huge increase in psychological manipulation, psychological knowledge, advertising, marketing, we have also seen. this explosion of MBAs, yes, yes, and master's degrees in business and administration.

Yeah, that's right, and all their MBAs, uh, I think our Prime Minister might have one. Actually, I'm not sure about that, yeah. The NBA, I think is a big deal because ultimately, and I worked at Accenture a while ago and I remember it was the last company I worked for because I remember seeing partners. I didn't even know they made half a million dollars, a million dollars, huge amounts of money, which is ours. society sees them as some sort of top of the tree yelling at each other like little children, all they focus on is profits and getting as much as they can from people, it's about getting as many people as possible. possible. buying things they don't need making them feel insecure about who they are without having these things, so I think that's a big part of it and then of course there was the whole behavioral economics.

The fields really began to grow. and understanding that, again, the amydala, the midbrain, all those nuclear parts, that whole reward pathway, how beautifully it could be manipulated for profit, so I think, very, very sadly, that's a part of this that again comes back. because we need everyone we need. pull the rabbit out of the hat and we need people to understand how their brain works, we need people to understand because you realize, I mean, my daughter, who's 14, talks about it all the time, oh, okay, they end to enter this or that. In another state, if you teach it from the beginning, you will not fall into these things so easily, and if you do, you will be able to recover quickly.

And it needs to be stopped. Ros, do you think the current state of communications and electronic and web communications around the world are part of the problem. Is he a potential ally? How should we see it? It's a great question. John. I think things are starting to change. There is still much division over the sincerity of that change. Certainly yes. We take Elon Musk and Twitter for example, we saw a lot of early voices, uh, deplatformed, if that's the right word, deplatformed, uh, now they're coming back on board, there's still a lot of people who have a lot of problems with Elon Musk . a kind of Switzerland, I don't know, what I do know is that we currently have a place where previously hidden and dissident voices can now communicate with each other, which is good, in terms of the rest of the communications, I think the importance of Understanding Psychology I think it's very important for people to understand how algorithms work.

I don't mean on a very deep technical level, but simply in terms of the echo chamber. I think most people who, if we're going to call them red pills, are red pills now. pretty aware of that and how it works, but certainly, again, the vast majority of people who are still completely unaware of what's going on don't know about all these other platforms that they're looking at, they don't know for example, if we put this video or I won't say YouTube, some things are banned on YouTube, some things are banned on Vimeo, some things are banned on Facebook.

Again, we need to understand that those algorithms are in place, but also how those algorithms are in charge. of those algorithms, for example, trusted news initiatives, um fact Checkers, as you said before, the writers have people, uh, board members who are also on fisa boards, etc., etc., so again, public awareness around those pieces is really important, with the focus on eliminating change. It's not your fault, you're not stupid, you were manipulated and couldn't see this other information because of the way the technology was used. Yes, you are recruiting people called Lighthouse Keepers who are a vision of what a Lighthouse Keepers is. and what kind of visions these people have, so a lighthouse keeper is with us, we are executing the lighthouse metaphor, it is the people who make the light shine and show a path of safety through very, very turbulent waters.

Initially, I'm sorry. I've got a kitten here on my lap, let's take a look here, she's, hello, look, she's, she's Daisy Daisy, as long as she's well behaved, she's more than welcome, she's well behaved, she's my other cat that We're trying to introduce her to who she doesn't like so much, she's very scared, um, but when we were at the lighthouse, when Rob Paul and I initially met to talk about this, it was about, like I said before, raising awareness about censorship. about the punishment for many of us of dissenting voices and that was who we were mainly profiling, interestingly what happened is I contacted many of those people around the world, many of them are under gag orders.

I wanted to be Lighthouse Keepers, but under additional conditions. Gag orders from lawyers from their governments, uh, and that's why they weren't allowed to speak, so we've spread the apron a little bit, so we have people who make everyone talk, certainly, but not everyone has been disciplined in this. Some of them left their jobs rather than lose their licenses, but the point is to speak out, to go against the group. I guess most of us have. It hasn't been easy being a lighthouse keeper. Many of us have lost friends, family, colleagues. to share the messages that we have, but we would absolutely all do it over and over again, because we think it's so important, do you want me to say who they are?

Yeah, I mean, just reflect first, there are threats at different levels, a lot of the people I'm working with, like you, who are particularly brave but have largely lost their livelihood, a lot of younger professionals, it's harder for many of the people I talk to. They are older, retired or at the end of their careers, they are the most outspoken, there is also another level of threat. I mean, I've had the police around with death threats, you know, there are some pretty strange people out there and it's pretty difficult in some ways, yeah, yeah, so what kind of visions would these lighthouse keepers have?

What are we waiting for? Can I jump to two points of what you just said before I talk about what the first one is? You talked about brave people. There are a lot of people who see people like me and the other lighthouse keepers as if we have some kind ofpersonality trait of bravery and courage and I want to be really honest. This was the most difficult. I've done it once in my life and John. I had to have a meeting with John before this interview because I am not a public speaker. It's not easy for me.

You know, I think I think it's courage. and bravery is not about not having any reaction when you speak, it's about overcoming all your terror, uh, and your doubts, whatever they may be, and continuing to tell the truth, because for me, at the end of the day, as a mother and as someone who worked with uh, highly sensitive and traumatized children. I just couldn't not talk. I actually stopped for a while. I thought all this was too much. And I said someone else had to do this and then I couldn't sleep for the next three nights.

I thought in the end I had to do it even if it meant giving up everything um so please don't think that there are brave and brave people and let us do it we need everyone to talk it's very important because the more people talk the faster the group grows uh the and and that really is another type of substitute primary carer another piece you mentioned John was about retirees um I was speaking to Ros Jones who I know you've interviewed before a great lady yeah. yes, she is a lovely pediatrician, yes, yes, a great thinker, incredible, incredible, she is one of our Lighthouse Keepers and one of the things I have seen and this is not so much from Ros, but from other other retirees.

Our culture currently has, unfortunately, old people and retirees are in a kind of pasture, they are in the heat of junk we are a young marketing if you are over 40 you are gone we are beautiful with you you know it's all that kind of thing and this is again something really unique In history we always used to listen to our elders, they have the wisdom and I really think we have to go back to that, there are many retirees who have told me, oh, I'm over it, no one will listen to me and I believe. On the contrary, I think that we retirees should really encourage them to speak up because, as Ros says, as MOSI, Dr.

MOSI, one of our other Light Guardians says that they have nothing to lose. Absolutely, if you are a young person who just got out from university and you are just starting your career, you have mortgages, children, it is much more difficult, but there are retirees who see what is happening and there will be a large number of them, please add your voice because not only can you say what you want ? But actually the younger ones really respect your wisdom. It is safe in psychological terms. The elders have wisdom and security. Just give me maybe one or two examples of the visions that these people have.

What kind of bright highlands are they? I think a very common theme that we all hope for is that we think we've gotten to this crazy place in history where we've never been so divided where there's a lot of trauma, but from that it's almost like we had to get to that place. horrible from which people could start to wake up and look at the psychology but also the history, how we got to this place in humanity and what are the lessons that we can learn here because when we understand how we got here, we all need to have it, I mean , there's been too much trauma, but part of it we just have to laugh at ourselves, laugh at these incredibly arrogant, um, including myself, you know, I've had enormous arrogance over the years.

Um positions that I've taken that I just haven't had discernment about other people's opinion, so I think it's really almost like an elevation of Consciousness that this is going to achieve and we all really believe that and I despite everything what is happening. Continued I am very excited about the future I think we are headed for incredible times, but I think many of the current systems need to be disbanded and reformed. I hope you are right. but there are also risks, so I'm glad to hear an optimistic outcome. How do we support Lighthouse in practice? Will you give us all the links we need?

Anything practical. I'll give you all the links we're about to provide. start our social media campaign one thing: I would ask John if he is okay. We've used social media quite a bit in the last few weeks and have gotten thousands of likes, retweets and comments, lots of likes and retweets. The signing of the Declaration lasts 30 seconds. a minute Max, but I think we live in this world now where so many people are scrolling on their phones and doing the same thing on retweet and I really encourage people if they want to be active, come and sign the Declaration that we make.

We have a survey that also targets healthcare professionals and we published it a few months ago to build a story of what healthcare professionals around the world have been through and, as I'm sure you do, I imagine that It's starting to paint a pretty incredible picture, you know, obstetricians now cutting down trees and dentists waiting tables, there's a huge amount of people and it's a really powerful message, so we want to keep collecting those stories and we. I'll be back with them pretty soon. I had to pause that survey briefly because there have been some changes to how mandates and things work in different countries, but that will be back up in a week, and yeah, I.

I'm not sure if I mentioned at the beginning to a colleague of mine and I that we're starting a psychological awareness um I don't know if it's going to be a podcast uh kind of a series um and in that we're going to talk a lot about how to talk to people and again understand from a psychological perspective that trying to shout more and more facts at people is not the way, it is the way we very gently begin to plant seeds, is that right?, is using a psychological strategy to be so effective. as we can to slowly splash the back of the brain so that people can start to question themselves they have to do it themselves, we can't, did you understand that the Declaration there Ros, what does it say?

Uh, yeah, do you want me to pull? I go up to the website I'm not sure if I just read the Declaration, so oh, the Declaration is quite long, um, give us the gist, then okay, then I'll go to the four key points, yeah, um, number. one must cease all silencing and censorship by bureaucrats and regulators, including experienced professionals and scientists, there must be respect for every individual's right to freedom of opinion and expression; Second, the right to informed consent must be upheld and must include being fully informed of the relevant issues. risks as well as any proven or presumed benefits number three mandates and other forms of medical coercion are unethical and must cease bodily autonomy is an inalienable right of every individual and must be respected and number four there is an urgent need for transparency and reform in science and medicine and to stop the increasing globalization of public health we demand the restoration of the voice and decision-making power of individual professionals and those they serve.

There's not much to disagree with. They're just not being done and we can all see that that's yeah, that's happening, so that's what's there. We will put the links to those links to your new materials. Let's try to gather some of the Visions. maybe Lighthouse Keepers, I think that would be something really interesting for viewers, we'll work on that, so there's a lot of interesting things happening, glad to have an optimistic video, we covered quite a few pessimistic themes. I'm afraid here, oh absolutely, but I think the power of humanity, yeah, there's a lot of things, big concerns in all of this, um, and similarly, I hear people talk most days, but ultimately , I truly believe in the goodness of humanity. and the future is in our hands but we have to act and shape it and take it and that's it and again while please sign and while this is just um while we talk about medicine, the censorship of medical professionals, it's not just so that medical professionals sign is for everyone to sign, yes, everyone watching is free to sign, yes, DEC, yes, great, Ros, for now, I hope we talk again and, uh, I really want to edit this.

I usually find editing a little boring, but there's so much interesting stuff that I want to listen to it again and thanks for all the psychology, which is, some completely new stuff and refreshing some old stuff for me, so that's it. Great, for now just tell us what the temperature is in Sydney right now. It's still hot. I'm not in Sydney. I'm not in Sydney. Oh, you're in the mountains, of course, yes, so it's cool in the mountains. Whether it snows where I live or not people are a little surprised by that um so I would say it's about 17 degrees celsius oh that's not so bad, what's it like in a beautiful carile? oh, it's always hot and sunny here, apart from the days it's not like today it's been more or less today it's been warm around 9° but quite humid grayish rainy it's beautiful the car is beautiful but I kind of get used to it yes we take vitamin D because we don't get it from the sun oh it is Not that conspiracy theory, John, uh, it could be because I'm talking about that, so I guess it must be, but one of our Lighthouse Keepers from the Pauler house had the medical board talking on the phone and what they stopped him for was because I talked about vitamin D on Twitter.

Incredible, I know, but we'll follow the evidence where it takes us, but for now, Ros, thank you very much, thank you John, it's been a pleasure.