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Pilots Fired After Caught Sleeping Mid-Flight

May 15, 2024
This is Northwest Flight 188, an Airbus A320 flying from San Diego to Minneapolis on what should be a standard 4-hour

flight

, but for the last 80 minutes Air Traffic Control has been calling them with no response. Now sometimes it happens while we are flying. that we go out of range of the controllers when they are supposed to move us to another frequency and we can no longer hear them, there is a term for when radio communications are lost, we call it Nordo, which technically is not radio, which is not really the right word to describe it, there is no radio like the previous plan that didn't have any radio that was a Nordo, uh, but we call it going Nordo when radio communications are lost and what happens in that scenario is that someone from a a nearby plane will call you and air traffic control will use that plane as a relay to get the message to you or it can pick it up on a frequency we monitor most of the time called guard, something you'll typically notice when you arrive on the

flight

deck of a commercial airliner. is that they will have this frequency waiting on the second second radio 121 dimal 5 now Technically, when we fly we are supposed to listen to two frequencies, one frequency is the one we are listening to.
pilots fired after caught sleeping mid flight
We're communicating with air traffic control and this second frequency guard that we use to monitor emergencies if that's something you can hear if there's been a plane crash you'll hear an alarm so you can relay that information to air traffic control and then You can use it in case you are out of reach of air traffic control. Now what I do is I have the main frequency that I'm speaking on louder and then I have the guard 121 decimal 5 up at about half the volume and ratio. The reason I do that is so that when I hear someone talking to me on my plane I can tell what frequency they are talking on if it sounds on a normal frequency.
pilots fired after caught sleeping mid flight

More Interesting Facts About,

pilots fired after caught sleeping mid flight...

I know they're talking to me on radio number one if something like that sounds. smooth I know it's on radio number two so I know where to respond to the person who's talking so it's a trick I learned in the past and I still use it now, that's what the guard is supposed to be used for, but in In the US, some

pilots

don't listen to it because on the radio you hear people making cat noises like this. Now you are on guard. I'm not the police on duty. In fact, we have an airline that has designated itself as a Monitor. and watch that frequency, but that's not my airline, so I don't have to.
pilots fired after caught sleeping mid flight
The on-call frequency is generally overseas. You will never hear people meowing or using it for any other reason when you cross the ocean. to monitor that frequency and people will use it in some cases to find out what's going on with the weather or things like that, but usually there's another frequency that we monitor to cross the ocean, so that guard frequency you should really listen to in the case If you lose your radio or you're out of radio range or there's an emergency, that's what it's used for, but the controllers, regardless of where you are, will be able to contact you on that frequency if you're out of range. from their normal radio they can call and look on the screen where you are call that control controller say hello, get on guard and call these guys and tell them to come over to your frequency.
pilots fired after caught sleeping mid flight
I couldn't pass them to you so that the controllers would call you on guard, you would hear your call sign and say, oh, okay, they're looking for me and that's how you're never out of radio contact, but here on flight 188, these Pilots obviously weren't listening to the guard because air traffic control hasn't been able to contact them for over an hour. At the beginning of this audio, the flight attendants had just called to ask how long it was until landing and that prompted them to make this call. to air traffic control Northwest 188 188 Minneapolis Center ahead Roger, we got distracted and have flown over Minneapolis, our air engine we would like to do a 180 and get to 188 R, turn right towards the heading of one zz be radar vors will place you there waiting There and, um, we'll see if we can't get you the right copy and, well, you gotta give him some credit for not getting lost.
One of the worst things that can happen to you as a pilot is to lose your overall situation. consciousness which means you don't know where you are in space and these

pilots

obviously knew where they were let me show you on the map this is the great state of Minnesota and their goal was to go here in Minneapolis but they are actually here near Oair and like They came from the west, they surpassed him a little. Now I don't know what the weather conditions are like, but one of the first things that comes to mind when I hear that you're going to have to wait, what it says here 188 rer and turn right to head to one Z, there will be vectors of radar set up there, waiting there and, um, we'll see if we can't make it all the way, but they've flown over their destination and now they have to hold on, so my first thought will be fuel, how much fuel do I need to get to the ground safely and what the weather is, which I don't really know because this was a long time ago, of course these controllers will wonder what's been going on with these pilots, so here they'll follow up and find out what happened on heading 1z0 North 28, radar vectors for your descent as well and radar vectors clear to Minneapolis ping one z z for Cle and then CLE arrival okay arrival Norwest 18 188 Center um you're at 3375 okay 3375 18 don't stay here 12372 2372 by now and I'll make the arrival SE here in just a moment you can stay here and um I'm Miss Freeny and I just have to verify that it's safe it's marijuana remember what I talked about before.
Sometimes Air Traffic Control uses a group of pilots to transmit a message to another plane because they believe they have run out of range and that is why they do not listen to them. I think that's what happened when this pilot checked in with him 188 you at 3375, of course these controllers ask if the pilots are okay if they have control of the aircraft because this is after 9/11 so they don't They made sure everything was fine in many cases, if you haven't talked to air traffic control for such a long period of time, fighter jets will be sent into the air to come look and see what's going on.
What's going on? Is the plane safe? Are the pilots awake? They are going to do some things to wake up the pilots and they are going to call them and they have their own procedures for the things they are going to do. To do something I'm not going to talk about in this video, but they're going to make sure that the pilots, if they're

sleeping

, wake up, so if you ever look out the window and see something like a fighter jet flying outside, it's It is possible that your pilots fell asleep, however, if the pilots lost their radios and were out of contact because their radio, let's say they spilled something on the radio, stopped working, which happened, we have a way to transmit to control of air traffic.
Hello Everything is okay. but our radio doesn't work and they can see exactly what we're doing and everything, and they'll know by that code that we set up. Hey, everything's fine with the plane, but they're having some problems with the radio and that's totally fine, that's no big deal, but these pilots didn't do any of those things, they said they were distracted, we just got distracted, so Of course, air traffic control isn't going to take oh, you've been distracted for the last hour and a half. That's a long time to put it into perspective, let's say 5 to 10 minutes, that could happen all the time, you could be thinking you're on a frequency, uh, someone else has helped you, you can still hear people. talking on the radio but no one had said your name so you just ignored it that happens five or 10 minutes that's no big deal 15 would be a bit long if it lasts more than 20 and you don't hear anyone talking about anything and you haven't heard your call sign Call signal will appear on the guard frequency many times, what the pilots will do is just turn on the microphone and say like anyone there and the controllers will say yes, we are still here. it's just quiet and we're doing that because we're like, man, maybe we lost contact or something's wrong because it's so quiet during Co, it was like we were flying just being one of the only planes in the sky and we're flying around and you don't hear anything, it was really strange, but a lot of times the guys would turn on the frequency and still be there because it's strange, so you have to make sure you're still in radio contact, so that's what will happen after a while, but then of an hour, if you haven't heard your call sign you will know there has been a problem, this is what will happen next 188, how much Fu do you have? 188, do you have time to give a PR explanation about what happened i88 uh is there any way I can explain the distraction?
We're just having some issues with the company and that's it. That's all I can say right now. This time record. I guess air traffic control keeps asking them what's going on, hoping that these. The pilots will probably hang themselves because the military and some of the big bosses at the FAA are telling these controllers to find out what was really going on, they normally won't ask them those kinds of questions unless you have an emergency. or a fire and they don't have that situation, they may also be trying to verify that these pilots are actually the pilots and not someone who has bad intentions.
I don't know, but these pilots are being smart, so to speak, to not crash. In itself, there is a voice recorder in the cabin, as most of you will know, and that voice recorder in the cabin records everything, however, it records itself, it is used in case of an accident, so it will continue recording until there is some kind of impact. This plane landed safely. that there was no impact, no one died, but when that impact is when it stops recording, so it will continue to record on itself so you know that the longer the flight, the easier everything will be because there will be no information on the voice recorder of the cabin. and most pilots know this rule buried very deep in the rule books on page 764, the information obtained from the log is used to help determine the cause of accidents or occurrences in connection with the investigation under part 8:30 , the administrator does not use the cockpit. voice recording in any civil penalty or certificate action essentially what that means is that if you are badmouthing your boss and it's recorded on that recording, they can't use it in any way to penalize you, that's basically what it boils down to, However, the FAA doesn't really care because at the end of the day they can do whatever they want and if you're not flying the plane safely, it doesn't matter what the cockpit voice recorder says, you haven't checked in for an hour. . and a half and that's what's going on with these guys, they're trying to get that information because now you haven't talked on the radio in a while, everyone's involved and you've got a lot of attention on you and you don't want to be blown away with everyone paying a lot of attention to you. to you and who you are and what's going on.
You want to be under the radar. You want to have your entire career and no one knows who you are. That's the key. So these pilots said no. By doing this while

sleeping

, they said they were working their schedules now in some countries. Pilots are allowed to take controlled rest, they don't call it naps or sleeping, they just call it controlled rest, but the FAA doesn't allow it. I think being a guy who takes a lot of long trips and flies on the back of the clock in the middle of the night and who rests an extra 15 or 20 minutes while you're in the seat makes sense to me, as long as the other person is there. and awake and stay awake and there have been some recent changes to mitigate these risks everything in aviation what we do is look hey this is a risk and flying all night is a risk even though this flight was not all night but flying Pulling an all-nighter for me is definitely a risk, so we have measures to prevent that risk from becoming a big problem, such as sleeping for 80 minutes, according to this FA document, although several foreign airlines allow naps on the cockpit during flight, the FAA does not authorize such naps in the cockpit.
Now the interesting thing to note is that they don't want someone to be there while the other person is not there to monitor them, however, on a freighter if I'm sitting there alone while the other pilot gets up, goes to the bathroom, He puts out food, starts making coffee, they could be gone for 10 or 15 minutes and I'm up there doing all the things by myself while that person is there. do all those other things go to the bathroom get some food make some coffee that could easily take 10 or 15 minutes, so is there a real difference between that and me sleeping there for 15 minutes or them sleeping there for 15 minutes, what would help them be better? more alert and more awake and be safe while flying no, I really don't think so, however, I can't make the rules, I'm just out there flying the plane, so those are the rules thatwe have to continue until the FAA says "hey, now we think that cockpit naps or whatever everyone calls them is okay, so you can do it, in which case you can do it and the funny thing is that before, in exactly that same document, "They say it is beneficial in restoring both performance and alertness." levels, especially during long periods of wakefulness, but rules are rules, so don't do it.
What I do is I turn on all the lights that are in the flight deck at night, I turn on all the lights so that that way it's nice and bright and it doesn't make it a sleeping environment. I've had people who do is dim all the lights and make everything very dark and then they turn up the heat, they heat everything up and I say, look man, I'm like a glass of milk and a cookie away from being useless to you and sleep for the next 4 hours, so I say if you want to do it's dark, that's fine, but if you're going to hear me sleeping in like 10 minutes, then turn on the lights and turn everything on, it's just that's not going to work For me, you can't do everything.
It dims in the middle of the night while I'm tired and then I'm like, oh yeah, this is so cute it's never going to work and I think it's stupid, so I mitigate that risk by turning on all the lights and that helps me stay. Wake up, the other thing is they now have this crew alert system, whereas if you're not touching anything, if you're not turning on the radio or touching something on the control panel, if you're not doing any of those things after a certain amount. every once in a while you get a message and it looks like this, once we see this we have only a few minutes to respond, if we don't respond within a few minutes it becomes something like a fire alarm noise and I once had that some pilots did it. that I was at The Galley just making food, I was on a break, but they just wanted to see what was going on and they took it to that Nordic fire alarm and I heard I came running and my heart was racing because I thought something.
Something really bad has happened because we were on a cruise over the ocean and they said, "Oh yeah, we saw that new thing, we just want to see what happened, what kind of thing the pilots do, so they just wanted to see what was going to happen." pass". Now airplanes have mitigated the risk with that, so between lights and just knowing how to handle rest, now the manufacturers have put this there so that so the pilots, if they fall asleep, look like humans, they could have an8. one hour flight, it could be just two people, it could be done in the middle of the night across the ocean, no one talks to you, it can happen and if you don't respond and you both fall asleep, which would obviously be a problem. you have to have your plane wake you up, so that way there is risk mitigation as well.
Now according to this report both pilots have had their licenses taken away which means the airline can't keep them there as pilots and TR is kind of sad because I'm sure these pilots have probably had a very good career and such Maybe they've never made a mistake, but that's one of the things about being a driver: they don't allow you to make any mistakes, you make a big mistake and that's it and that's how it works in the world of being a driver, there's a lot of glory but there's also a lot of glory. pressure if you do something stupid like fall asleep even though it was just an honest mistake and I'm not saying that.
These pilots fell asleep but were unresponsive for 80 minutes, so whatever they were doing, they could have been watching a movie and having a good time up there, but you're not doing what you were supposed to do. that he was flying the plane, so regardless of what it was, you made a mistake and sometimes one mistake is all it takes and it's all over for your career. Pilots can then reapply for their licenses and try to get hired by another airline and they can go through this big process, it happened. I know a guy that happened to it.
They lost all their licenses because they made a pretty big mistake. They had to redo all their licenses and then reapply for them. This happened in 2009 and 2009 10 11 no no The airlines were hiring, it was a terrible time in aviation, really hard to get a job, so to have something like that on your record when there are literally thousands of pilots fighting for every job, so a These guys are going to have a very hard time getting a job. Anywhere for a few more years, probably around 2016 it started to pick up and obviously now it's crazy, so if you ever look out the window and see a bunch of fighter jets flying with your plane, your pilots probably aren't asleep , but they are part of an air show.
I look forward to hearing from you until then, keep the blue side up

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