Joe Rogan Experience #1347 - Neil deGrasse Tyson

allow the ice to melt and maintain a liquid state, okay, co2 under air pressure, normal air pressure you want. to melt but it can't hold a liquid and turns directly into a gas if we had a much higher air pressure you could make the co2 melt and have liquid co2 so now watch what happens so okay you will blow your mind again, this is Just this is really good, okay, it's good like physical chemistry, so here you go, so watch what happens. What happens if I reduce the air pressure? Well, the transition from ice to water remains the same, it is not affected, but the boiling point is.

As you know, cooking times need to be adjusted on mountain tops because when you boil water it is not at 212 degrees, depending on the height of the mountain, there is less air pressing down which prevents it from boiling. Well, the boiling point is not absolute data about water. It has to do with the pressure of the air above it, if you have extremely high air pressure, the water has to reach a much higher temperature before boiling, so the boiling point of water that is reported in all textbooks it's at sea level at atmospheric pressure that's how you get 212 degrees if you start reducing the atmospheric pressure it's 210 degrees 205 degrees 200 degrees 190 degrees 180 degrees 180 oh yeah, and that's not as hot as 212 degrees, so you have to cook the food longer in all the cooking times increase for this reason so now lookI'm not done with you Oh, let's keep reducing the air pressure, okay, in theory, it's possible on Earth, no, no, in the Himalayas, yes, but, if you take it, you can ascend in some type of helicopter or some type of device, our hot air balloon or whatever, but I.

I'm saying you can do this experiment in a lab. Alright. Keep reducing the air pressure. The boiling port continues to drop. It's hard at 70 degrees 150 one hundred twenty one hundred degrees Fahrenheit 80 degrees Fahrenheit fifty degrees Fahrenheit forty degrees Fahrenheit thirty-two degrees Fahrenheit. holy shed that passes the ice melts and turns into water the water evaporates and turns into steam and all that happens at 32 degrees there is an atmospheric pressure by which water ice and steam coexist and it is called the triple point of the water and all the ingredients have a triple point point Wow Mars Mars is very close to the triple point of water, so you can take a simultaneous bath in certain regions of Mars a simultaneous bath because the air pressure is so low it's like one hundredth part of the Earth's air pressure, it's very, very low so you know a place where a pot of water, ice cubes and steam all come out at once is at the triple point so here's the lesson here is that We live life in our world at atmospheric pressure and we define what is normal based on that life

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based on how our senses interact with that environment, but the real universe is much stranger than we think. that we are exposed to what our five senses are exposed to on earth, what did you think about?

Elon Musk's idea of ​​bombing the poles of Mars in order to warm it, yes, some of these are pie-in-the-sky type ideas, but let's get to what he is trying to achieve, what you want to do and what you want to present . heat you want to block the ozone you want to block the ultraviolet it's so you can protect organic life okay so we have an ozone layer it's three oxygen atoms oh three and oxytocin likes ultraviolet light so the light ultraviolet comes from the sun and is eaten. the ozone eats it and when you do that the ultraviolet light does not reach the surface of the Earth, so although they sell where sunscreen is used and you have sunscreen 45 yes, that is for the 1% of the ultraviolet that passes through the atmosphere yes you're above the atmosphere, you're toast, so, because ultraviolet is highly hostile to organic molecules and what we're made of as life, so you want to protect, you want to give life a chance, so you don't just want to warm up Mars, You want to find a way to block the ultraviolet light coming from the Sun, so some mechanism is needed, if it's not ozone or it just lives underground for example, that's fine, then I don't think we should think of the idea as literal, but it's just a general principle of what you want to achieve on Mars by doing it you want to heat it you want to protect what could be the future of biochemistry and then you see it and then you wait you don't know you wait too long If you could, you want to speed it up and then terraform Mars.

I have visited SpaceX a couple of times. It has a cup that you can buy there, then it has Mars, okay, and then you put hot liquid in it. and Mars turns into a greenish-blue arable marble, so yeah, it's really cool and it doesn't tell you that when I bought a cup of Mars, you know, you show it and oh my gosh, what happened? It is a land. cup, but it doesn't look like Earth, there are a lot of people who continue and we also believe that there is a lot of water that was once on Mars, which is a certainty, and we believe that it is just sitting underneath in a permafrost, so it doesn't You would have By the way, to get water to Mars, in the very distant future, you can redirect a comet and get all the water you need, but how far away are comets everywhere?

Dude, we're at a shooting gallery. Yeah, that's not what I asked. Do you think it is before we can read the reference our weight in time? Yeah, okay, sorry, we know how to do it, but there's no real incentive, so there's no engineering-funded plan to do it, but we know how to do it on paper. how to do it in any conceivable way oh yeah so first of all it happens with or without us because we are in the path of untold thousands of asteroids and comets so what you would do is find one that comes close to us anyway on the seventh orbit in the line or the hundredth orbit in the line and then you would deflect it slightly in such a way that it would then collide with Mars or even with the Earth if you wanted the Earth to need more fresh water, yes.

I heard it's possible, but it's not. The problem is that something really big that would fill lakes would be worth it if it collided with the Earth, that would be bad for life on Earth because it is a spontaneous reservoir of energy that can change the climate and do So you want to do that on a planet that you're trying to terraform, isn't that the speculation of how the water got here in the first place? So if the jury is still out on that, there are labels in the oceans in the water molecule. That tells you that the water must have come from more than one source, so that's what confuses things, we want it to be something simple, it all came from comets or it all came from the interior of the earth through volcanoes, the Volcanoes emit lakes and historically lakes and oceans.

There is a lot of water that comes out of there from the calderas, so the problem is that, as we say in science, it is determined that there are many comets that have delivered all the water, there is a lot of water that could have come out of the volcanoes to give us until the end, but in the oceans it is clearly a mix, so the last word is not yet known on what you think about what is happening, why now with the protests over the construction of this larger telescope and more new, yes, the TMT 30. meter telescope, which would be by far the largest of any type of telescope.

The history of astronomy is one in which larger telescopes become larger cubes to collect light. That is the only telescope that exists today. They are the same as telescopes when they were invented. They're just bigger, okay, the principle behind them is bigger because what they're doing is simple, all you're trying to do is get as much light as possible and the more light you get, the dimmer the object. that you can detect and the farther away the object is that you can see and so for every generation of new large telescopes that have been built, our understanding of our place in the universe has increased and deepened, so that's just the background, the proposal is for the largest thirty-meter telescope ever seen. the Big Island of Hawaii on Mauna Kea, where there are other telescopes there, well that's where the Keck is, yeah, I think if that's where the Keck is, I think they spotted it in a hidden place behind most of the lines of vision, but that's not so much what's important here, it's that the native Hawaiians, from what I've read, view the mountain as a sacred place and therefore placing a telescope and another telescope there becomes a kind of invasion of sacred land, and yes, it is a There is a confrontation last time I looked, I mean people protesting in the streets and there are some Native Hawaiians who accept this because it means jobs, high quality jobs, engineering jobs, You have to build it, you have to maintain it, there is a whole supporting infrastructure for that, that means jobs. and it's done in collaboration with the University of Hawaii and all the other telescopes are associated with the University of Hawaii, where people get educated there and at the end of the day, you have to ask yourself how you're going to make decisions.

Go ahead, do you do them democratically and then vote or do you want the natives to be the ones who decide their own destiny and if that is democratic that is fine, then the natives vote well or are the few people who protest who win? The day I mean, it's complicated and it's very, there's a lot of nuanced issues, there's a branch of thought that the United States government and normal municipal leaders have no authority over this, there are some who claim that This is a property native Hawaiian who doesn't belong to any municipal entity of the US government so not even state representatives have the right to weigh in so there's a lot going on there okay but if I had to weigh in here's how I would.

First I would say I think what should happen is I don't know if they have the infrastructure system set up, but if they could set it up this way, if the natives consider the mountain to be sacred, the natives should have full say. of what happens to the mountain, okay, that's how I think it should be, so now what you want to make sure is that any decision that the natives make and vote on is fully informed, you don't want to vote, be misinformed or misinformed informed in any election let alone if you are voting for a telescope on your sacred mountain that's fine otherwise you are voting out of nowhere yes you know you are influencing your future based on partial information and decisions based on partial information or bad. decisions no matter what okay so I would say do the voting with the natives and make sure everyone is fully informed and here's a little bit of information I just want to add to the information okay you know what we do as astrophysicists : We study the universe quite passively. that we sit at the end of a telescope and wait for the light to reach us, it is not a Petri dish where we stir it, heat it, freeze it or break it, or we are simply there in communion with the cosmos, my doctoral thesis. was significantly fed by data I got from mountain tops in telescopes.

I got my data from the mountains in Chile from Lola and it employed all the natives of the natives, the local people, that's another telescope, so there are all these telescopes that have specific access. points to the universe, not everyone correctly asks the same questions, so it is the collection of all the data that gives us a complete understanding of what we believe is a complete understanding of the universe, so what we do is try to understand our place in the universe and all I'm going to say is that if you have power over what happens on that mountain and it's sacred to you because whatever it is, it's something important to you and your sense of understanding your place in this. world that is a spiritual meaning.

I can tell you that what we learn as astrophysicists from the tops of those mountains gives us a deeper understanding of who and what we are in this universe, so I would say that whatever your concept of God is, whether he is the creator of the universe, the spirit . energy that permeates all of space and time whatever your concept the discoveries of astrophysicists bring you closer to it I understand your perspective let me be the opposite opinion they feel good I'm not trying I don't know this is information I'm putting this is information and I leave the room and then you all vote well.

No, you know that here we believe in democracy and majority rules, that's all, it's a good thing, it worked well, but they are not majority rules. I don't know how they are going to make a decision, but let's say invent a future in which the natives vote if they vote. I wanted to make sure that you heard what I just said and now take control of your own destiny. I just don't do it. I don't think they care. I think they've decided that this is a sacred space and they don't want anyone to do anything to it, so that's their decision.

They think it's okay. I know. I don't judge Peeples, but I did want to appeal to themenvironment dispersing in all the water sources of the world and there are enough molecules to occupy every half liter of water it covers. the surface of this earth so that, given enough time, you can get a glass of water from there. I don't even care if you filter it, the water is still there, I mean, water that passed through Abraham Lincoln's kidneys Genghis Khan mm- hmm Joan of Arc hi Socrates Plato no, Jesus, can I get a damn bottle? I'm trying to include my Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure list on here, okay you blew it, but yes, Jesus would be included in that, so would Socrates, yes. that's the smell by the way, the same goes for breathing air, there are more air molecules in each breath you take than there are breaths of air in the entire earth's atmosphere, so when you breathe out there are enough molecules to disperse . and the air currents will do this to disperse in each breath of air that is inhaled, so when you breathe air you have air molecules that passed through the lungs of Jesus, we are all connected and there is no way around it. and the water we have is the water we have, we drink it, we urinate, yes, because the atmosphere descends in the form of rain, yes, and rain is an important difference: most of the water on Earth is salt water.

I can't drink there is a limited amount of fresh water how much? By the way, all glaciers are made of fresh water because it is freezing rain, of course, freezing rain. Here's something no one talks about when glaciers melt. Where does the water go? Where is he going? just tell me you know the answer, back to the ocean, okay, but now this is non-salt water entering the ocean, so you are mixing fresh water with brackish water and they occupy different places in the vertical profile of the ocean and because the salt water is heavier than fresh water, so fresh water occupies the top right, it's not as salty as stroke water and there are circulations in the ocean, not just up and down, you know, northern latitude, southern latitude, like the Gulf Stream, there is also top-to-bottom circulation.

The bottom and the combinations of all these circulations create the stability of the ocean if you disrupt that, oh my goodness, there are animals, fish that can no longer live where they should be because the salt level is different and therefore some animals could become extinct in some climate. The patterns will change because the ocean affects the climate. These are the reasons why climate modeling is so critical but so complicated because many variables appear. Why can't we get salt out of water? It only takes energy. You can do it, but why hasn't it been that way?

Being Donna, you can't, you have to ask yourself who pays for the energy, where do you get the energy from, it's an energy question, but I think that would be very valuable. I mean, think about how many people it's not valuable enough, but that's the point. well it's just money mate it's just money you can ask how much does it cost to ship a half pint of water from Fiji ok what the heck is that square bottle you buy of Fiji water is it Fiji right yes Fiji water? How much does it cost to bottle that in Fiji and ship it here compared to desalinizing the ocean?

It is cheaper to ship to Fiji there will be a day when that will not be the case and in the future wars will be fought over who has access to fresh water and the value of water will increase and by the way the value of water in space is ten thousand dollars a pound, so if you last sue a comet and say that's a lot of fresh water, yeah, I guess you can bring it back down to Earth, but that's expensive. You better sell it to NASA for nine thousand dollars a pound because it costs them ten thousand dollars a pound to put water into orbit, so you better keep it up there and some way or another, yeah.

So if you harness water in space, it's best to trade it in space and then bring it back to the planetary surface. Right now, the economy favors that desalination process, so you just evaporate. water is basically an alembic, it's a distillery, so here's a bag of water with this high salt and you just heat it up, the water evaporates leaving sodium chloride and in the end you get this deposit of salt at the bottom. from your plate at the bottom of your container, oh wait a minute, what about the lakes that used to be there? The salt lakes that used to be there and are no longer there.

There is a salt deposit that is the source of our modern salt. That's why. tweeted the other day that all table salt is all table salt is sea salt, it just comes from long buried prehistoric evaporated seas so they are salt mines and some geologists told me it had had limited use and limited of the word mine. I think if it's a mine, I think of a hole in the ground, but mining operations also include surface operations, so there are lakes on the surface that have evaporated and that's where you get salt, as well as the mines that They dig deep for that hole. that's all a mining operation my tweet was only referring to the buried ones but that's it but it's all evaporated water it's all evaporation it's all sea salt is the point now nuclear power plants depend on steam isn't that part just for finish the point so that the water and salt that is left evaporate, you may want to use that to make some sea salt with table salt and the evaporated water condenses here and that is distilled water, now you may want to mineralize it so it tastes good because distilled water doesn't taste good and also it's not really healthy to drink it as you probably know that you drink distilled water it comes into balance with your minerals by sucking you in so it has the same minerality as your body and then you urinate it and you will systematically drain yourself of important electrolytes, yes, usually the water that you would say tastes good and that you enjoy has some bits of minerals in it, some kind of mineral minerals, now there are nuclear power plants, aren't there?

The process is to use that nuclear energy to create steam to run turbines and yeah, basically all of our electricity that comes from essentially most of the electricity comes from turbines that convert steam into electricity, so I'm sorry, so you heat the water, water produces steam and the steam is converted. The turbine and the generating turbine generate the electricity, so it is a question of where you get the energy to boil the water, that is what goes down, it is called oil, it is nuclear energy, it is wind, it is a hydroelectric plant. From this, if you get a hydroelectric plant, by the way, then a hydroelectric plant does not have to produce steam because they have water, the pressure of the water at the base of the dam moves through the turbines which spin the turbines and produce electricity . so you don't have to heat anything because they have water pressure to do it anyway, that's also solar energy by the way, because the Sun evaporated the water from the ocean, the water rises and becomes a cloud, the cloud moves on the ground, on the earth, the cloud.

It rains on the lake above the dam, so the energy that got the water there in the first place is all solar, so you should think of hydroelectric energy as solar and wind energy, because wind is the unequal and equal heating of air on Earth. surface and that creates air currents which is also solar energy there is also this work is it not conceivable that a combination of desalination and power plant could be devised where the heat is used to combine it and make the turbines move and then you vaporize it and that's where you get your water from.

That would be nice, it's an interesting idea and I don't know how much thought has gone into it, what you're saying is that I'm making steam anyway, yeah, so why not? I don't do it, suck with salt water, yeah, yeah, and make it a nice two for one, three for one, you get salt and salt on the other side, yeah, salt gets all the fresh water, you get fresh water and you generate electricity, yes. so patent it, no, it's free for anyone who wants it, don't do it. I have high hopes for tidal energy because there are certain places on Earth where the tides are very powerful and they are very strong, and you just put some paddles there and sort of and it works both ways when the water comes in and goes out.

No, this is battery technology, that's why it's not completely reliant on solar because it seems like this is the place to make it like it never rains, I mean. If it rains here for 50 days, yeah, it's crazy or any desert, and we would be next to the Mojave Desert, so one of the problems is that, by the way, deserts are generally located at certain latitudes on Earth, It is due to the general situation. circulation on the earth, so air pockets on the earth there is a lot going on on the earth, the air moves in many ways, but there is a predominant circulation of air that causes the air to rise at the equator.

Imagine a cylindrical movement of air than that. Gerdes the Earth, okay, just above the equator you have a cylinder that rotates where the air rises and just below the equator you have a cylinder that rotates the opposite wave so that the air is still rising at the equator, okay, so it rises at the equator, it is unstable. makes clouds the equators one is the cloudiest place on earth practically one of the cloudiest places well, how about the other side of those cylinders where the air descends? Okay, okay, when you have descending air you don't make clouds well, how big is the cylinder?

It is about thirty degrees of latitude wide, so the rainiest places on Earth are at the equator, which is where the Amazon rainforest is located in the lake and the driest places on Earth, or at 30 degrees north and 30 degrees south because these cylindrical air movements have a downward direction. air there, the Mojave Desert, the Sahara Desert, the Gobi Desert, they are all around 30 degrees north latitude, so we live on the surface of the earth where there are forces operating that are much larger than us than We wouldn't even think about it, why would India be a desert?

Because it's right in that area. We are not for seasonal monsoons. It doesn't rain much in India except when it's monsoon season, so the monsoon is kind of an exception to what would happen otherwise. there and that's why everyone loves monsoon and hates it but they love it, it cools if they get water sources, there it is, so they ask you the question again, ok, they didn't answer, sorry, oh, like that, like that, battery technology, like why not. Los Angeles is all solar, it should be, not that any of that costs much, and besides, you know there's a Lamborghini passing me at 20 miles an hour on the 405, this is the land of wasted horsepower, so Any place that has a lot of sunlight should thrive with solar panels and you, right?

I looked around very few houses have solar panels and I don't fully understand that they could do that, if they did that then they would run your own running on your own power you can do this yeah you can do the hard equation by the way and then yeah I mean that the price might have to go down a little bit more, you don't really see the total price of oil, it's like that. subsidized in ways that aren't obvious to us, you know, we built the roads with our taxes so the car companies could sell you a car that you drove on the road they built for them, if they have to build all their own roads, the price of gas to go in the car would have been much higher, the price of your car would have been that, all of that would have been much higher if the car companies did it.

What I'm saying is that I make a product and I want you to make it. use it, but there are no roads. Oh, I convinced you to build the road so you can buy my car and drive down that road. It's a strange way to look at it, but in some ways it is total cost accounting. What is the cost? of carbon is how many people died of lung disease from the new ultramicroscopic mono silica volcano OSIS County okay, that's the longest word in the Random House dictionary yes, it's basically black yes, basically a black line, you can break it down the new microscopic ultra- silikov monkey Oh, with the silicates in the Akane OSIS can, so there are all the medical parts except stapled together to form that word, so what is the cost to your health, your death, the air quality, the Asthma, the total cost of oil is not what you pay in gas? tank, are other things that we pay for and that are not reflected in the real cost of that energy source.

If the total cost took into account what all of this actually costs, then the solar option would look a lot better than it is compared to that, that's all I'm revealing, but when talking about cars and car manufacturers that They have to pay for the roads, didn't they say that once? Isn't it like restaurants have to pay for toilet paper? You would park your car to go to the restaurant, not in New York City, but in places where everyone has cars, you don't have valet parking. My restaurant will not take up all the land I just bought, something is going to be 1/4 of that land and all the rest will be parking spaces.

I have absorbedthere, black holes that form as a consequence of the death of stars, okay, okay, and we think we understand star formation well enough to say that stars are born with that much mass. and will lose a certain amount of mass throughout its life. All stars lose mass because so much pressure and energy comes out that it carries particles with it, so they lose mass. The Sun is losing mass as we speak, it's called solar wind. so they all lose mass the question is at what rate you are losing mass it is a lot compared to your total mass it is small so very high mass stars are not particularly stable objects they remain stars for a hundred thousand at most a million years and they will explode and They will become a supernova if they are more massive than that, they will not explode because the gravity is so strong that it cannot explode against the force of gravity and collapses into a black hole, so we expect that black holes have a little less mass slightly less mass than the most massive stars that we know how to make, so if you have a hundred times the mass of the Sun star, it will lose half its mass over its lifetime and you will have a black hole that 30 times the mass of the Sun or 50 times the mass is not good, put a pin in that in the centers of galaxies there are supermassive black holes hundreds of billions of times the mass of the Sun and we call them supermassive and we call their black holes Call them supermassive black holes because that's how we behave as astrophysicists.

Well, could you have black holes somewhere in the middle of these two extremes? We don't know of a phenomenon that will give you a black hole that is in rhythm and that will give rise to a black hole. that's between these two categories, you can make a sitting black hole, but we don't know how to make one and we believe that those of us colleagues who have done this believe that they have discovered a sitting black hole. in this kind of underworld where there's no evidence that it ate to become so massive and we don't know how to explain it by star formation and death and it's nowhere near the supermassive black hole at the center of the galaxy, so it's the frontier of research right now so it's just a newly discovered type of black hole it's in a MASH regime this is physically impossible you know headlines we're eating the headline now black hole shock show me the place where it disappears express is this a British I Think They're British Anyway is a news roundup for science, so theories about the impact of black holes revolve around the discovery of a physically impossible black hole, which is why scientists don't use the word impossible unless it's violating a known law of physics so I bet it was a title and I don't have a product I don't mind a little sensationalism there you can say it's a black hole coming and if it's coming from an object It is an object that we know nothing about and we have yet to discover it well, we are not going to say that it is impossible, according to Jeff mm-hmm, every time we point a telescope at the universe we find something that we never predicted or understood and it adds to the knowledge base that we already have every time we discover. things and then that becomes what we know and understand, like the supermassive black holes at the center of every galaxy, which was a fairly recent discovery in terms of size because we saw the centers of galaxies behaving really strangely.

The stars moved faster than they did. It should have given how much gravity was pulling on them and we said friend, there has to be something there and it has to be very small because we are following the star that is very close to the middle, well, if it were made of ordinary matter, how big would it be? been? It has to be really, really big, so it has to be really, really small for this to happen. The only thing we know that could fill that small volume and have that much gravity is a black hole, so it has long been suspected that it was. confirmed that, as a common thing, the Hubble telescope and photographed for the first time with this recent result in the galaxy m87 Messier 87 is the name of the galaxy and you can determine how big the black hole is based on the size of the galaxy that have.

We can determine the mass of the black hole by how fast the stars move at the distance they are from it, in other words, where the Earth orbits the Sun and we have a certain speed at which we are going, it is We forgot how, but 18 miles. per second I think that's the number 30 kilometers per second that's our speed around the Sun it's pretty fast okay if the Sun had more mass instantly that speed wouldn't be enough to maintain our orbit and we would start spinning spiraling towards her. if the Sun had less mass, that speed is too high to be in this orbit, it will take it up, sorry it's too fast to keep this horbet, it will raise us to a higher orbit, it will slow us down and we will be in a higher orbit high with a slower speed, in other words, for any object at any distance, there is only one speed that you can maintain and have a stable orbit around it, so when we see stars orbiting something in the center of the galaxy, it is a straight orbit.Forward Astro's equation 1:02 to calculate how much mass the thing is orbiting and you get the mass and you can't see it, it's a black hole and that, ladies and gentlemen, is the end of the podcast, ha ha, ha, this block will be available when Sir comes out in October, the first week of October.

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