[FULL] Dennis Rodman & Scottie Pippen on MJ, the Bulls' dynasty, the Pistons rivalry & KD

I'm Rachel Nichols alongside six-time champion Hall of Famer Scottie Pippen and star of our latest ESPN movies 34:30 Rodman, for better or worse, Mr. Dennis Robin, well, you have to show why you are wearing this shirt. Can you stand up for a minute representing the USA? I am part of this. I saw you just do an interview and press for this thirty-four thirty. You said you think The best one-two punch in basketball from the beginning to now was this guy and Michael, oh man, you watch the videos of these guys, man, the last 20 years, I mean, Scott, he was absolutely praised no matter what. know.

They didn't want to talk about the first year we pretty much got together, I think it was '88 and I guess he's the champion, yeah, and the only thing he came out and said, well, Scott has nothing to do with it, yeah, migraines, pains headlong, cold as. I don't even think about that, you know, you plan too many défis in their ass, just our turn to think we're the dominant force in the NBA, but once these guys got going, yeah, they kicked our ass, look if No I can beat him, you don't know and that's very special to me.

I love that you two were here together. It's very nice for me too. He was a college intern at the Chicago Sun Times. I was 19 when I met these guys for the first time during that second hat trick and Dennis and I were talking in the green room before the show, these guys talked to me like I was a real person, not just a 19 year old girl and all. that and the respect that you have. They showed me and helped me feel like this was a job I could do, so it meant a lot to me to have them here together.

It always meant a lot to me to have Scotty here with us so we could relive and talk about some of those. old times that we will do throughout this program, it will be a lot of fun, buckle up, stay with us next, we will also talk a little bit about the MBA in general because I will ask Gotti and Dennis about their reaction to telling wsj. magazine that some days hates the NBA circus I can tell you about the circus when these guys are around in '98 but we'll talk about that first even if we go back to the movie Rodman for better or for worse that premieres tonight on ESPN 9:00 sharp ET, set all the alarms you have because this is so good, Dennis, what motivated you to tell this story through the vision of director Todd Kappa Stasi and the voice of Jamie Foxx.

I thought people knew a lot about me, of course. the years and things like that there's more than just medical business plus showbiz people that I just don't entertain myself I'm just not like when they call me the circus clown or just a caricature more than that I'm more than like an individual who was practically going to have some motivation to be in certain situations. I think sport gave me the avenue to show people that I'm a little different from being a homeless person, having been living in the projects where I had a purpose. in life and I think people will see at the beginning that there was no purpose and they will dance, then you will start to progress.

Things are starting to happen for me. Many things they thought would happen next or certain things that happened, but this document is very different from any other. documentary about sports will touch a lot of people, especially with your generation, it's generally said today mm-hmm, this won't touch many people, yeah, I mean, there are so many valuable things that you learn in this documentary that you touch on about homelessness. I didn't know you were homeless for two years after college, right before, so this was 19, that kind of thing your mom kicked you out of the house, you lived on the street with a trash bag, oh yeah, and they didn't.

I know your father. I knew you hadn't noticed. I've seen those days in Arkansas. If you know. I followed his career and I think he was one of the guys that helped motivate me by coming from a small school and knowing. that I can make it to the NBA, he came from southeastern Oklahoma as a great rebounder and I followed him and then I realized that he had a chance to play at the next level just because of his hard work, his hunger and his journey that had been Yes , absolutely, and it's fun to see that journey through the bad boys once we see you in this documentary because the bad boys to us were like, oh, he fit in really well with the bad boys, but I want to know what the boy who saw. at the beginning of this documentary who was shy right who had nothing how did you fit in with the bad boy

pistons

?

I think this guy really fit in with the bad boys is because he was a winner, he was a leader and he was a basketball player. The IQ is off the charts and I got the chance to experience that playing alongside him, everyone knows he was part of a great team, but they didn't realize how great or rebounding Dennis was when he was with the bad guys. His individual skills never stood out, but when he was able to come and join us with the Chicago Bulls, not only did we get the best rebounding in a long time, but we also got a basketball player who had a very high basketball IQ and knew how to do it.

To win it wasn't just about the leaders in Detroit, but they had a great piece here, a guy who was hungry and wanted to be known at the end of the day, as we know now, he just dropped the greatest rebounder of all time. I know the good guy calls you. I want to show a clip from the movie that talks about the bad boy mentality and how they treated opposing players like, oh, I don't know, Scottie Pippen was as unique as Dennis Rodman's playing style was. the NBA in the late eighties in Detroit a single mentality that would eventually give them the label the bad boys define what the Pistons were in the air we were emotional disorders psychologically physically but the main thing we want What I really did was crush you and destroy you mentally.

I think it should put fear in a lot of people's eyes. It may have been a reflection of when he was younger and he was bullied and now he could go on the court and be that tough guy. All of that insulated us against the world mentality that the Pistons had, as we say. today's kids Scottie, can you tell today's kids how cruel the field was between the bad guys and the Chicago Bulls team in the early years? Because you see little clips here. I don't think there were people who weren't watching basketball fans. I really understand what it was like, no, it was a different game.

I mean, we see the game today in the relationships of how these players grew up together and came up in the grassroots of basketball where I was the players that played in the, you know, in the. In the late '90s and onwards there were really no relationships and we didn't have any love on the basketball court. We hadn't crossed paths anywhere in our careers, maybe in college, but it was never that line of communication to build a relationship unless a guy was your teammate, so the rivalries back then were real and there was no love. on the basketball court, you had to know what basketball was, you were being challenged in every way in the game of basketball, physically, mentally, all of that.

It was a big part of the game, it wasn't just about being able to throw the ball, it was about being able to take a lot and give a lot of atmosphere on the court between you, especially between you, you understood what it was like when you faced each other on and off the court. basketball court; That was an endless conversation. I can tell you it was a love-hate relationship, but it was one of those things that we were coming up with and I'm an Oriental. Conference and I'm mango was trying to be Boston wouldn't pay attention to Chicago, yes, but little did we know that the more I got, the more each day was done, so they were right behind us, but once we passed Boston.

You realize that here comes a gear. Oh Bulls, they got Scotty, who was also a missing link with Michael Jordan, but it was just our time at a particular time, forward 1998 1990, but I think they figured out what better to join. The pesos got the down payment on the mental aspect of the game and realized that we weren't really trying to attack them, but they had something else up their sleeve besides them. You know, we could play mind games and I'm going to play the. Quick game, let's play with Addy, dad. Your game played without problems. They play everything and we know what hand that had.

What was the mental back and forth between you on the court? What was the mental war? you got Bill Laimbeer, yeah, Rick Mahorn and you had those two guys that were pretty much the same enforcers, well I was pretty much the guy that was out there, I just antagonized the hell out of you, just went out and Nick picked on you all the time. you weren't doing. this, he's not doing it, but I took the mentality that for us it was fine, great and we came to beat him, we're going to beat him, no, I mean, they didn't talk too much, I want to look back at that moment, it was really about The Detroit Pistons really dominated us mentally physically, we were able to catch up to them, but it was a mental aspect that we had to overcome to be able to go down on the floor and take it like a man, get up and you know, hit your free throws down, but understand that we can play the same game on the other side, don't give up on the layup to protect our paint because that's what it was like to win basketball in the late '80s and go to the field, he didn't. give up, quit, so those eighty point games were real and those points were earned, not given, yeah, and when you finally beat them and the Pistons walked away not to mention, no congratulations, it wasn't fun, it wasn't . funny, they beat ours, you know, and we put our tails between our legs and we had no choice but to look down and say, you know what you got us, and in front of home, people from all the places we You never lose at home, a disdainful rival like Chicago.

Did you realize at that moment that that was what they felt, no, no, that the team pride was so high and they didn't think they could be defeated, they felt that their style of play was going to last much longer than it did. , but to be honest, they knocked down all the dominoes for us, yes, they were our biggest challenge, they knocked us out a lot, but the Boston Celtics were really a team that, you know, didn't really get in the way that way because I know they was about the Pistons and if you could beat the Pistons you pretty much got a championship, you certainly got it, you got three, but then you got something else with this guy by coming up or taking a break very quickly, but Scotty In the next segment we'll tell you how It was inside the Bulls locker room when they found out.

Oh, one of those bad boys, they'll join your team. What do you remember about what you felt at that moment? Like I said, I came from Oklahoma and it was kind of a family type of environment coming from the projects. I went to Oklahoma for three years. It was more like a family and I became close to my wife and lived without anyone. In Detroit, Joe Dumars and Chuck Davis were integrated. Not to me, I said: do you know what this is about a family that we want to win? We have to stay together. I would do this together, well we'll do that and I made a comment that the fact that we were so close we should have sex. "The doctor complains, but it's okay, you know what I mean and it's like when you heard that Chuck Daly really hurt me a lot because he really lacks, he was more like a father figure three, any MBA, well this was a rumor , so we." I had heard it seen before in the documentary, we talked about it just a few minutes ago, you didn't, the first time you met your father, it was in the late '90s, Chuck Daly was a father figure to you, you went to his house Christmas, I mean, that's it.

So it's funny, John Salley says: Oh, he didn't know it was a business. I'm going to say it's a business, but it's also not a business, right, they asked you guys to shed blood for each other at that point every night. so I don't know about that, when that ends, it feels like you're abandoned again. I can see how all that happened and then you find out that you went to Chicago and I was able to play this clip too. because this one talks about joining Scotty's balls and how that news was received inside the Chicago rockers room to see the scores today they changed the controversial Rodman to the uni championship of the Chicago Bulls 20 pieces and I was that piece that they won , it was just a match made in heaven, right, Dennis Rodman prepared for Chicago training camp by unveiling another new look as the 1995-96 season began, the stakes were high for Dennis Rodman, even after playing nine seasons in the NBA, he was almost broke between taxes and life and an ex. -wife and a daughter, he rented a nice house but had nothing saved and also his reputation in the league had reached the point that he was radioactive.

Dennis realized that, in his own way, he now had a right and had a place seriously or else his career was over, Phil, if you get into a situation where he starts to rebel, how will you deal? with that? No idea. I just love Phil from day one. I have always told philosophy that it hurts you to realize something. Who lives together in the 70s? Woodstock being just smoking enough balls, he had this unique leadership ability, but Jordan, Pippen and Phil Jackson, of all peopleteams, we can probably absorb this lunatic more than anyone else. Dennis idolized Michael Jordan almost like a fan.

He wanted Michael to be funny. Wow, he respected Michael a lot. Why is that part of Dennis lying to you about Dennis Rodman loving Michael Jordan's dirt when it turned out well and you see a lot of things even in that minute of a movie that we saw well and especially everything that preceded it, his reputation? social media before social media all that, how comfortable were you with Dennis? He says having Dennis as a teammate didn't take one bit, it was a tough sell. I can definitely tell that he wasn't too excited to get it, but that wasn't the case.

It took me a long time to say yes, I knew what Dennis brought to the table, we just felt that way and I personally felt like that field could help in any situation. Camp was always a father figure to his players, he helped guide him on and off the field and I felt like he fit perfectly with Dennis and was a perfect match as Dennis said we needed something he could bring to the table and he brought a lot more. than we expected, so it wasn't like that. a blessing in disguise for us, you put it with many things, even if they are good or bad, right, better, because uh, it was, uh, there was something that you put them through and you say: I can't believe I did it right, Yes they did it.

I did, but it was 2002, how money and coming together as a team can solve a lot of things, but we never really discussed, like in those three years we were together, we were never going to discuss everything that was going on outside of basketball. On the court they discussed what was happening outside of basketball about our daily lives, but once we got on the court it was a completely different game. They never talk about what was happening in Las Vegas. Some of those stories that we let you tell us. things and you say you can't print, that felt good, so I would like to write all these things in my little notebook and then say that's what's good, although Scott never heard me say this, but I'm going to tell him I said while on national television around the world Scottie Pippen is probably the innovator of power point.

Hey, I love magic, I love birds, I love Drexler, I love all these guys, but I want the world to know that I just got here safely, I mean. this guy I mean six nine Kevin Durant kiss his ass six nine six ten y'all watch Cobra Scotty and please bow down to him because he revolutionized that statement in the NBA and I mean you guys tomorrow one on two two on one stuff so one to die Michael he's Michael the fastest he got one here two you've never heard me say this because I've seen a lot of videos of Scottie I mean save them a break I want to bowl I mean quick well I want a break I'll tell them this to start working with Scottie now that there are so many NBA players today that when I say oh, let's come do a special show at training camp or do whatever they ask us to do first.

Could Scottie come? Can you bring Scottie? Because, honestly, there was him and Tracy McGrady. They are the two players I listen to the most. Either I'm elated about my game after Tracy, which is a different style, or I emulated my game after Scotty and us. We have two different types of guys who say that, but that's what I hear the most and you're absolutely right and I want to play your championship a little bit more together, your integration into the Bulls, Michael Jordan a little bit. a little bit because we saw a clip earlier in the show with that and we watched again since he was just a young puppy that covered them.

He used to tell people about his teammates and his brothers on the court, but it took a lot of work to get there and I always say that people think that today's leaders are like, oh, LeBron James is hard on his teammates or whatever, and I always say yes, but mom Michael Jordan punched Steve Kirk in the face during practice. How demanding was MJ of you as a teammate? Okay, I do it because I go a lot, you know, Mike, it really has to be not spending a lot of time during this season. Yeah, I think he was more of the loner of the group, but these guys had a special bond that they were together.

Six seven years since before I got there and it was fun to see those two guys really interact with each other. I mean, they really play against each other in home practices, play cars or do anything that has anything to do with a physical test and Now, when I saw them in practice and in games, sometimes I sit and watch and I look, you know, there are people there, they are very nice on the court and sometimes I have to make the kid some time look at these. guys and I'm like the one that used to kick their ass, you know, throw it on the ground, a lot of my stuff like that, now I play with these guys, so I praised him even more when he was with these guys, but I said those days, in They actually saved my life, Scotty.

I've done a lot for myself in Chicago, sometimes when I was doing my crazy thing at home and I had to come back and they threw me back in and they got me back. in a game in question, but they did a lot for me, that's Chicago, they asked him to open doors for me and their hearts, so in the city too you know what I think was great for us, it worked two ways and we gave I realized that Dennis was eager to rejuvenate his career and it was important for us to be the championship team again, so we all needed and wanted the same thing in the end, but what Dennis really brought to us as a team was his leadership in the work of your heart. oh you had to work things out between you and you know I asked you how hard MJ was on you but you were all hard on each other in different ways and it tested you on how much you would accept right?

I didn't try it, but I don't think they realized I was doing that stuff off the court as much as we were doing it. We lived two different lives. Someone would tell us like they just got back from Las Vegas, but about having sex with him. social media right in our face quick it was definitely good I think I think the stars of the line of him I think God brought us together for a reason and it's funny for Scott. I could say something like this before is that we never really talk off the court. the only time we really talked outside the core was like we were going to a restaurant and we didn't realize this, but we formed a triangle in a restaurant, we interacted with each other, we had an extra angle going right 7:8, a restaurant , you know, but but I guess I would never remember those days, well, this gets to how they ended well and look, you saw a little bit in the clip if management hadn't decided that this is Phil's last year, which sounds crazy every time I say. loudly and therefore you decided well, we don't want to do it without Phil, how much longer could the

dynasty

have lasted?

I had nothing to say, so I'm the next Helen guy on the NBA landscape if it had been you. and Phil, MJ and Dennis, how many more championships could they have won? I'd probably say at least two. Well, I'd say at least two. I would love to have challenged ourselves to the point where someone could beat the teams that were there. Giving us the biggest problem, Utah Jazz means more in the Finals, they were just as old as us, which gives me the feeling that they probably could have run a couple more three years in terms of teams we could beat on the coast west. and there was also a lock that allows you to rest your tired old bones, that's it, it makes me angry because that's my can, we rewind time because we had lists for 50 games, we had legs for 50 games, my God, my life, who, Jimmy Krause. or I don't know whatever you know, I think we all knew from last season that that was the end so no one really screwed it up, oh he's going to be screwed in the end and we just have to accept that, I just know. what was your record at 98 that season so I'm thinking what would have been your record in a season shortened by lockdown father 15 oh and it's funny that this kind of links to something that's very much in the news nowadays because Kevin Durant I did an interview with wsj magazine and there was a lot to break down there, but what stood out to me in terms of you two being on set today were your comments about playing for the Warriors, which is the team that people have said, oh, are they?

The best team since his Bulls team, some people, as Scotty knows, tried to say, oh, they were the best team, more than his Bulls, a team and he was talking about his tenure in Golden State, two titles, two MVPs of the finals, but the quote from wsj magazine was no. I don't feel as good as I could have been, he said I came in wanting to be part of a group, I wanted to be part of a family and I definitely felt accepted, he said, but I'll never be one of those guys as time went on. .

I started to realize that I'm different, it's not a bad thing, just my circumstances and how I came up in the league and also the media always made it KD and the Warriors so no one could

full

y accept me there, Dennis. It was such a parallel between me and you, you came in and joined a

dynasty

in progress. Do you understand how KD felt and why he wanted to leave and break that up or does it not register with you when you compare your experience? The mentality of players today is totally different than what we had in the 90s and early 2000s.

I think it's very selfish of KD, seriously, you know, I don't care if he's listening, no, really I don't mind. Think about the fact that when you had the opportunity to play this game, especially at a high level, especially when you have it so easy, it's so easy to go out and perform to make 40 to 45 million dollars a year and literally know how to play a season. I'm going to rate this game. I just don't understand. I don't understand why he even comes and says something like that. I mean, face it because in Detroit I didn't want to leave the task that I work on in San Antonio.

I busted my butt I won't rebound talent Tara didn't care who was there I just want to win I let her she didn't turn out very well I went to Chicago Wow hug I busted my butt for the titles there on three different teams and I enjoyed it I didn't care who it was the leader I didn't care who was who was the leading force who was doing this I just wanted to be a part of this I want to win I want to impact the cities so that people are happy I didn't care about playing for a dollar fifty cents I don't care I just want to win for the city and for the players and that's all I wanted but I think the players do, they don't have the ability to understand what this game is about and loyalty to their families and to the community and I wish they can always Remember it's not always about the money, it's about whether you're happy, but that's what I mean, look at the other side. what Kevin has been saying Katie has been saying look, this game is about more than just titles and money.

I need to be happy in my life and you of all people I think would understand wanting to take on a new challenge, right, be creative, I absolutely don't. I don't know what I thought was interesting is that there are some quotes in there about how he says he hates the NBA circus and everything around it and again it made me think and we saw it in that clip of the circus around you guys, what? How would they compare the circus around them to say what the Warriors and Scotty were? Same thing, I think it was a little different in the era of Michael Jordan, Dennis Robbins, Scottie Pippen.

I think it was a different type of fan base. I think we had created a different era in the game at that point, but I understand what Kevin is saying. but I also want to let you know that this is part of our business and that's why you're making all that money because we've been able to globalize the game through our players, not just what they do on the basketball court, but also using digital things of them speaking and traveling abroad to help promote our game so it's part of our package to help sell our game because that helps our salaries grow so I don't understand what you're saying especially with a player who has Been in the league for so long. like he did, if he said that two three years into the league then I get it, but you set the player up as your MVP so you weren't fighting with the media when you got those MVP votes because if he had said some of those things in response.

So believe me, he wouldn't be in the MVP today. Well, look what's happening with the game currently. I know it's part of what you do, but you haven't taken the path that Scottie has, you haven't taken the path that Steve Kerr says. Did he dedicate himself to training? Scotty went into broadcasting. You've been doing other things. I'm going to have Scottie ask this question because you'll ask it better than I ever could. You know, I know you came back to Los Angeles. now and you've been to South Florida, so what are you doing with your time these days?

Well, right now I'm meeting my good friend Scottie Pippen. You did some things in North Korea right now. Oh, rich, come on, do you ever expect it? You were sitting there with him, so that's really what I want to know. I want to know what your relationship is with the dictator of KoreaNorth and I would love to, but Donald Trump, allow me. I have always said what Kim Jong did. who respects the game of basketball, loves the Chicago Bulls and loved the fact that, like Scottie and I, he loved the fact that the way we played I was different from the group, but he just won, just I wanted to be one. from the guys on the team and Michael even decided he wanted to go and they asked me and for some reason I thought we were just going to a country, well I thought I was going to a country that signed autographs and played games.

Basketball, I didn't know it was that important, but not helping North Korea, you might like it, oh, go with Beijing, Monica, but it turned out pretty good for me just because I found and met someone, two people. in the world I was admired and I would do it again, but for me it was more of a learning experience and seventy years later I am here, you know, my good friend. Here I mean, look, it is an experience that very few people in the world have had or have had the opportunity to have and what is so incredible, now you also have business interests that you are working on, doing something that you know, that you know.

I'm not behind, you know, behind closed doors, you know, most of the time, but John and the actors, a new CBD product called Nourish, nourish, team, chill, so I don't want to guess anyway, look really for me and things like that. I am very healthy. for your skin or for its pain, everything, yes, but especially it helps you sleep, you have to sleep and things like that. I recommend it at number II. I'm no help. It didn't, but it's not a good product, so there's eternal stuff everywhere. - right, you're promoting this documentary, it comes on a lease, such interesting opportunities, absolutely, that's how it is anyway, so the breath has ruled out his son, yeah, the cool thing is that you're going through what you're going through now.

Vanderbilt Washington State there's a lot of fun to sit and talk to all the time and it's I just know it's special for everyone and for us at the jump so thank you both for going there. I really appreciate it. Thank you for watching ESPN on YouTube to stream live sports and premium content. Subscribe to ESPN Plus.