YTread Logo
YTread Logo

China’s Silent Takeover While America's Elite Slept

May 29, 2021
The biggest threat to America is not Al Qaeda, it's not ISIS, it's not Putin, it's not any of these guys, it's China, do you really think I believe that? I think it is the most important existential threat. In 2011 and 2013 they poured more concrete than us. what they did the entire 20th century is a factual stance of factual statements they had a hundred years of bad luck and now they are back on top they are still in their minds perfecting their ability to control people at any moment this can fall apart for you You are more concerned about the totalitarian regime or the big technology company today they have the same business model you are really talking about having to change many things so that we can move forward what you can criticize are the government policies that allowed the behavior that occurred in the first place. place, a strong statement server from your superior during the high Garrincha and Russia on our network, I guarantee it particularly because you posted that video about China, not only can you not knock it out, but you don't know who owns the data. everything you do can be seen is political to me it is not political it is not about quid pro quo it is about adopting a world view of things chicheme there are terabytes and terabytes of data that are created about you and you have no control over it, I have a special guest with me here today obviously we did a China video a couple of weeks ago, they got a few million views on a lot of content so I wanted to dig a little deeper.
china s silent takeover while america s elite slept
We reached out to General Robert Spaulding who wrote a book called Stealth Warfare How China Took Power While America's Elite Slept I literally couldn't put this book down and once you read it we will also put the link below you will know exactly why it was former senior director of strategy at the National Security Council and was kind enough to fly to Dallas for us to have this conversation together about 5G between the United States and China and many other technical issues that have to do with that. Having said thank you for coming, I appreciate your thanks. thanks for having me yeah so let's get right into it so before you go to China what's your journey becoming a general in the air force and then being part of the National Security Council?
china s silent takeover while america s elite slept

More Interesting Facts About,

china s silent takeover while america s elite slept...

How was that? I reached the air. Strength before you know it, I really knew a lot about the military and you know, my image of the military was about peeling potatoes and someone yelling at you, you know, essentially Gomer Pyle and I saw a movie Top Gun and I was fascinated by it and it really moved me. so I joined and I went in with no expectations I just had fun and I really worked hard but I also played hard but you know I wanted to fly airplanes and that's what got me started and you know one thing led to another.
china s silent takeover while america s elite slept
I had an opportunity years before I was supposed to leave the service to go live in China, so I took advantage of it and the rest is kind of the story because when I made that fateful decision and it was really about, you know, thinking about what The opportunity I had to go live abroad, but also how strategic China was in our future, really opened doors for me that, frankly, I would never have considered. I had no idea about so little, so there were no plans. There were really no plans, in fact, I didn't want a career in the Air Force, so you know, in fact, I wasn't looking to become a general and when my wife found out that she had made it, she laughed, why is it? that?
china s silent takeover while america s elite slept
I've turned it into a general like how could you do that? Because you know, I mean, I was an e4 in the army in the army. You know, when we saw generals, we trembled. It's like this is a general. Know? and this is a big problem. but for me it was, you know, having fun serving my grandfather. How do you think about it that way? Yeah, it's pretty strange how you think about it. What is the percentage of people who become generals? They are minotaurs. It's very, very small. You see that star on the Humvee. or whatever you're driving, I mean, it's pretty unique to have that, but what year did you go to China?
I'm curious, so the first time was in 2002, so I actually went to a language course at the Monterey Defense Language Institute, the allotted time. I was in China for 52 weeks, it's a 62 week course. I left it at 52 weeks in June 2002, the staff and I and our two children went to the countryside and lived in Shanghai and Pudong on the east side of the city and that is the side that the Communist Party built itself in the 90s, so that's where the Jinmao building is and a lot of the financial district in Shanghai and we traveled around the country and lived with people and it was probably one of the two most phenomenal years of my life.
It was a phenomenal experience, it was incredible, you know, the people were great, they are hardworking and resilient people, and you know, having learned the language before I got there, I was able to communicate and really travel everywhere and I really got to know how they think and you. I know in many ways you don't fully understand what was going on. I don't think you can live in China and fully understand what it's like to be Chinese, but for me, as a foreigner looking at that country, it was like that. It was exciting and it was the place I wanted to be, so when I left in 2004 I told Stephanie that, hey, when I retire from the Air Force I'm going to come back here and I'm going to start a new business and guess what the plan was to one that was a plan.
What was your rank at that time? When you were fine. So when I got there, I had just gotten older. They just made me. So you were already there. I've been there for ten years, you have been your specialty for ten years and what was your job, what were you doing in China for us? So the Olmstead program, which is a program that I was selected for, essentially takes three officers from each branch of the service and sends them to a language school, it's not your place to go to a country that has English as the national language. , but a foreign language, and then send you to the country for two years and I went to university in Shanghai.
Tone G University and I studied MBA courses and it was really about getting to know people, it's really diving into what it was like to understand China, Chinese culture and history in the language, so does China know you're going in as a specialist? ? something that's a basic open conversation, hey, we'll send one of our Air Force seniors who spent years with you. One of the best things about the Homestead academic program is that you do everything on your own, so once you are accepted to the program and go to the language training, it is your responsibility to go and be accepted at the University to apply for a visa because They want you to understand what it takes to travel to a foreign country, so it's almost like being on a gap year.
No, you don't, you don't have a retailer that you're talking to. Basically, you're free on your own, on your own recognizance, to go and find out what you get paid so that the mill you get paid, okay, that's what I mean, it's really an amazing opportunity because you're really learning because you don't you have a lot of support, you're there just trying to figure it out and you know it. Do you know how, how can I get there, become a student, get a student visa, but also how can I get my family there and how do I make sure that's the case?
We had to take them out of the country every 60 or 90 days. to six months to renew the visa and return, so China didn't know that you were there and that you were older, they didn't know. I was not there in an official capacity. I was not there. I was not there in an official capacity. official visa our diplomatic passport I was there with a basically tourist passport with a student visa going to a university now when I met the Chinese I would say hey I'm in the Air Force I'm a b2 pilot Of course they thought that was pretty weird that I was there, but you know that's exactly what I would be thinking because from what you read about culture you feel a certain level of paranoia or suspicion, but why are you here?
Are you a spy? You'd look like a CIA guy. I mean, if you go there, I would look at you saying maybe you're working and trying to gather information to bring you back, but that wasn't actually the case. It was just between 2002 and 2004 and what was happening there, if you remember, it had just joined the WTO, so it was breakneck speed to grow the company in our country and grow the economy, and all my neighbors were there building factories for Fortune 100 companies. So there was a lot less scrutiny on me as a military man. I think it was the country at the time that was focused on making money and, you know, certainly people found out who I was, but I didn't get a lot of scrutiny.
It's good to know that they didn't do anything now, the second time you came back was what year the second time I came back was December 2016 and that was going to be the defense attaché in Beijing and this time this is a little bit more public so they know a little bit more that you're going or you still know that this is definitely I'm the senior defense official who represents the Secretary of Defense and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to the Chinese military, the People's Liberation Army. in Beijing and I, for example, arrived there a week before they took the uuv.
I don't know if you remember, but they took one of our underwater gliders in the South China Sea essentially

while

one of our ships was trying to recover it and then there was a big controversy there was a big diplomatic controversy and that was starting to become a crisis and I was who negotiated the return with the People's Liberation Army of that glider to the United States what was the biggest difference you felt culturally and spirits from o2 o4 until December 2016 I never saw a guy with a gun when I was there from 2000 2004 when I returned In 2016 there were people with guns at subway stops, not all of them, but they were there and you could definitely feel a palpable change in the tone of the country now, some of that may be because it is not Shanghai, but Beijing, the capital of a nation, but clearly things were a lot more tense when I was there in 2002. um my mind is a different vibe depending on your experience and what obviously, to write a book like this specifically for China, you've had to do a lot of research to be able to write what you've written here, do you think that's part of that? happened where now they're growing to the point where they're not growing, that's maybe a bad word, they're getting bigger, I mean, GDP-wise, they grew, you know, to a higher number than what They were before they were.
Being a little more competitive in the 2008 Olympics was a statement that they are opening, so we are here to compete. Do you think part of that is also their level of confidence knowing that we can compete with everyone? Let's be a little more. cautious and the wards protect what we're trying to build, so look outside or that was just a different city for you, well no, I think there are a couple of things, one of which is that the Communist Party was really Worried about corruption, if you go. Going back to the Tiananmen massacre in 1989, the three things that the Chinese Communist Party learned during that time was that the Communist Party was under attack by elements within China allied with the United States: that openness was great for globalization in terms of science and technology. and economics, economics and finance, but in terms of ideology they needed to put a lot more into what they were doing to prevent their population from becoming democratized and three, if the party ever separated from the people, the party would fail and you can see that there is a clear paranoia on the part of the party in terms of not wanting to make sure that

while

there are people who are very advanced in terms of technology in the models with respect to the electronic economy, they are very cautious about that type of thing. of losing control, so I think you know they're still in their minds perfecting their ability to control people, but at the same time they're worried that at any moment this could fall apart and create this kind of you.
I know I really believe that they really believe that at any moment the party could essentially lose control because the population essentially wakes up and then I think it plays on their paranoia, yeah, so I'm more worried internally about it collapsing. or someone from the outside coming in and penetrating them and confusing them and dividing them, you know, I think it's an internal combination in terms of whether they have legitimacy in people's eyes and then what some things are. that might in their minds confuse people in terms of, you know, democracy or human rights or civil liberties, so now that you are who you are and you know that you were with the strategy of the senior director of the National Security Council that you have written In this book, it is very obvious. about who you are, what your position is, i.e. someone like you can return without problems, for example, would you feel comfortable saying I'm taking my family to China at all, not at all now, why is that okay?
Because clearly what I say in that book is that the Communist Party is not good for the Chinese people and that is not something that is appreciated by people like me who say that certainly the way you become an expert on China in the United States It's that you go to China to go to China that you say things that the Communist Party doesn't really get angry about and it'sThey might not even give me a visa, but even if they did give me a visa, I would be worried about going there and they would find some reason not to let me come back, not let you come back here right, although I mean today would be a good time to keep you if you went there, so if you have any plans to stay, right, no, I don't want to go on vacation, so let me get back to something. you said because the other thing is that really and you mentioned 2008 and it's important because it's not just the paranoia that they have but also if you buy manure again and what he said about the ability to hide and bide your time, this is not a change in what the Communist Party is, who they really are in 2008, when our financial system basically said we don't really know how to manage global finance, that they really believed that they had arrived and therefore there is also an element that they have been, you already know. having to play second fiddle based on the century of humiliation and the fact that you know they were the dominant society for 5000 years, they had a hundred years of bad luck and now they're back on top, now they're ready to essentially take a role of leadership in the international system, so you know that part of that goes with not only knowing that the vibe is not only knowing how they treat their population but also how they treat the West, how they treat foreigners, because there is an element that says that We are not going to go back any further, we are going to defend what we believe in and we are going to make a name for ourselves in the international arena or don't worry and we are going to fight so that our interests are respected, you mean them, yes, then you say in the book.
I mean, obviously, I have a lot of notes here. I have seven eight pages of notes to review with you, but you said. in the book you didn't say this I think Steve Bana said this but you quoted him the biggest threat to the United States is not Al Qaeda the biggest threat to the United States actually isn't this is what you say in the book I think Christie Bennett said something else , the biggest threat to the United States is not Al Qaeda, it is not Isis, it is not Putin, it is not any of these guys, it is China, do you really believe it, I believe it, I think it is the most important existential threat, not just to the United States United, only for the democracy of the world. never seen before and it's because it's wrapped up in this image of adopting the international norms that were established and the rules and norms and the systems and the institutions that were established after the Second World War were perpetuated through the cold or and essentially and our thoughts were dominant after the end of the Cold War, they were the ones who got involved in that and that is why there is a belief that they accept those principles and what they say is that they want the international system to essentially correspond to their interests, but what is not So they say what their interests are and the interests are essentially contrary to all democratic principles, that we defend human rights, civil liberties, the rule of law, it's interesting when you say that because it's a pretty bold statement to make you listen to a lot of people. talk about the weather. change, a lot of people talk about the cyber sea, you know, cyber warfare, all these other things that you talk about in the book too, but to say that China is at the highest level more than Isis al-qaeda Putin, those are some good things. strong statements to make, but let's go back a little bit to you're working as the senior director of strategy for the National Security Council and you came in and said you had two reasons why you wanted to be a part of them and one was to educate. members about who they are and the other was to ensure the security of 5-G for us and also for other countries, not just for us, for everyone else involved, and then you're giving this talk and you bring in other people. to give also inside there was a lot of dialogue and then it got a little heated and then you held a meeting trying to bring everyone together hey, this is a good question, we are having this speech, it is a very good thing where did it go from there to now?
You know, it was leaked to the press and you know, it was leaked to the press and then from there they fired you from the National Security Council? How was that process carried out? Then the debate arose about what was happening and how we were going to deal with it. China really took place during the summer of 2017 and it was really about how we're going to structure the national security strategy, what our priorities would be and that was a process of figuring out what and, frankly, that's it. I've been working since 2014, so from 2014 to 2017 17, when I got to the White House, my two years on the joint staff, my time in Beijing and then I got to the White House in May 2017, everything was centered around this . competition between China and what were the implications for us at the social and economic level at the national security level when I joined the National Security Council in 2017 we began discussions on how to formulate and draft the new national security strategy and so In that dialogue, You know that the first thing you do when you have a strategy is what is your problem statement, what is it?
Do you know what threats the United States faces? And of course, you know the same thing you just mentioned. of people talk about climate change, talk about terrorism, what we had to face is that there are a lot of things happening that people outside of national security policy may be aware of, don't talk about it, it affects everything we do and So, I started because I had had those discussions outside the national security policy establishment. I started bringing that information in and really, for the first time, you know, in the spring of 2017, I had formed a good picture in my mind of how to describe it. the elements were and then you know essentially how to have a logical conversation that said these are the challenges we face and this is what we need to do.
That conversation in August 2017 was complete and then I said, I'm going to be here for a short period of time, if I could do one thing to make national security policy change the course of the United States in the future to preserve our republic, it would be protect the Internet, so I started working to talk to engineers about what is 5g, what is the current situation? Because we had said in the national security strategy that data is a strategic resource like oil in the 20th century, data in the 21st century that will drive artificial intelligence, all of that, all the algorithms that got that essential guidance. our lives to better places if we didn't secure that strategic resource, then we were at risk as a democracy and so how do we take that you know that essentially beamforming antennas with radios and software defined networks, something that we had used in the military for a lot of time and a plot and give it to people, but then do it in a way that actually provides security for their data, which is essentially what you know.
I came to the conclusion that the only way to democratize in a digital sense. is protecting is giving control at the citizen level of their data of their data is and the analogy that I make when I talk to people is if you go back to Alexander Hamilton and the framework of the Constitution, you know Basically, what I was looking for after having researched, you know, a comprehensive survey of all the governments that existed before, was how do we create a government in which no person, party or group can achieve supreme power because the supreme power is ultimately corrupting and that is the Constitution, But what happens if it fails and you know that we don't really provide for the people and someone can gain power?
So we give the American people the second amendment right to keep and bear arms so they can fight an oppressive government if that dream never fails and of course in a digital world what you saw what you began to see is a world where perhaps not You know that you are being oppressed or you may not know who your oppressor is and in that world you may not know yourself. you are the oppressor, you may not know that you are being oppressed or in the second war, that your oppressor is who is right your oppressor because we had seen it for example after the elections using big data analysis AI BOTS and social media that the Russians had. they created protests right, it was ostensibly in the name of Black Lives Matter.
I'm talking about the one that took place in New York City a few days after the election, but it was actually the Russians, so what you're seeing is coming back. To date, as a strategic resource in the digitalized world, the ability to aggregate data is equivalent to adding power and if power can be added, then one must ask who has the ability to aggregate data in that world and today the two entities that can do so . The really aggregated data are big tech companies and totalitarian regimes. Democracies have difficulty aggregating data. The United States cannot aggregate data because the law prevents it.
So we started this unit within the State Department called the global engagement center. They were supposed to fight radicalization, for example by Isis, and prevent the influence of our population, but they can't do their job because they can't aggregate data, not even public Twitter data, because there are concerns that Let's use government resources to spy on our own population, but one of the ways that foreign states go after us is to actually take our own social media data and use it in ways to influence us, to find out that you really have to be in the data and therefore the only ones that can be in the data today are the big tech companies, so essentially one of the main purposes of the formation of the Constitution is being offloaded to the big tech companies , which is in the preamble for the common defense. and so if you think about national security and you really get the gist of things right, if you think about national security, we have an Air Force, we have an army, we have a Navy, we have a Marine Corps, right?
I don't think you're worried. You know, the Marines jump into your building here or they get bombed, right, you don't care about that, but I guarantee you the Chinese are in your networks and the Russians and the North Koreans and everyone, it's Jerry, I guarantee it. your networks are in everyone's networks, this is what they do and therefore if they are in your networks, they are strong statements, you are saying, Jerry, I guarantee you and Russia is in our network, I guarantee you, you I guarantee it particularly because you posted that video about China, I guarantee you that they are there, they have come to this place, but who is responsible for protecting it from that government?
I don't know who it is at all, the government protects their own networks, they don't I don't like your networks, which you are responsible for protecting your own network and then of course if you have one, you have a Twitter account, yeah , I do it well. Twitter is responsible for protecting Twitter is responsible for protecting my Twitter account, right? I'm responsible for protecting my data, your data, what are you, what do we have, we have ice, it's not the US government, sure, but now let me ask you this, so I had a former undercover FBI agent right here, he said , and that's for sure, three weeks. ago, so I asked him, I said, so what is real?
You know, the line you don't cross between the government protecting me, right? Because the government gets too involved and, hey, you know, the whole app will go to the DMV to get IDs and not Apple, the government goes to the DMV and says we want to get the licenses and then the government goes to Apple and says we want to be able to have access to phone conversations in case the terrorist does this well in China because some people will say Well, China is set up in a way where they feel like they are a company and they control what everyone does because they work for the company.
What America sees that way is actually how I see America. The United States sees its citizens like 1099 China sees its citizens. Citizens are like W-2, so because they have more control, it's harder to infiltrate their system than America's because America leaves everyone alone. Would you agree that they leave us a little more alone without those above having access to privacy? companies to get data to see if someone is accessing our systems or not, you mean our government, yes, you are totally alone, do you think it's okay? No, I don't think it's right. So you're saying they should be. more involved, they should be involved in protecting your data, they should be involved in making sure that a foreign nation does not exert undue influence on you, so that you are making decisions based on influence that comes from outside our borders.
Okay, now someone is seeing this. and saying well, Pat, that's exactly what a big government guy would say because let them control us and they can do what they know is best for us. I'm not saying, I'm not saying that the government has access to your data. They're saying they shouldn't have access to your data, they should make sure no one else has access to your data. Why do you remember you and San Bernardino having an argument between Apple and the FBI? You're absolutely right, you know, Apple said that we. I'm not giving you my back a little bit clearly, so think about that in thecontext of what we are talking about here.
I don't think anyone should have that backdoor access to your data. A foreign country. You are not a foreign country. No. No one should, what I'm saying, you're the only one, the only one who should have a say in who has access to your data, it's you, that's what it means to live in a democracy, in a digital world, but this raises questions for me. the question. If you're saying the only one who should have access to my data, fine, we agree, but if China is hacking my data and getting access to what I'm doing, you're saying the government should stop that from happening, how can they do that? ? that if they don't have access to what I'm doing right, they can have access to the network, they don't have to ask you for access to your data properly because if your data is encrypted, they can't actually see what your data is, but they can certainly see what China is doing.
I mean that part, I'm sure we understand what they're doing within our networks, just protecting that or preventing it from happening doesn't happen, that's why by the way, China built the Great Firewall because it wanted to protect its population, because it They realized that if they did not protect their population, globalization and the open Internet would allow democratic values ​​to leak, so they wanted to protect their people from the influence. That came from outside, it's a good move. I think it's a great move because if you are connected to a totalitarian regime and you are open and the totalitarian regime intends to influence your population the way we have designed our current Internet, we are absolutely lost. but doesn't that mean we become totalitarian if we do that and like to confront them?
We have to do it if we did what they did right and they did what they did not protect your individual data from them. As a government, they simply protected it from the outside, so they built a wall around it. What I'm telling you, you use it, you have control over your data, not the government, not our government, not your government, not Twitter, not Facebook, you own it, etc. If Facebook wants to sell your data, then they have to get your permission and may even have to pay you to do it. If they want to sell your data, who cares most?
The totally totalitarian regime or big technology. companies I would say that today they have the same business model really, of course, tell me why look at them today both China and Facebook have sensors China sends its sensors to school what sensors learn sensors really learn about Tiananmen Square the truth, OK? because they have to censor that discussion on the network Facebook has sensors the sensors go to school to learn what they need the sensor on the Facebook network certain same business model it's about free data it's about using that data except this one it's about profits for this one is about control and even the sensors are the same model, you are putting them on the same level Wow, I am not saying no, I am not on the same level because one is about profits, the other is about control what I What I tell you is the system that we build, the technological foundations of the system that we build, then the application services and the business models that we build on top of that allow power to be equated with data aggregation when you do it , you create business models.
The business model of a large technology company is equivalent to China's business model. So do you think you know how to do it? They do not allow Twitter or Facebook YouTube to work and have their own YouTube. They have their own YouTube. own Facebook all that stuff they have do you think you're suggesting that we should just create it for ourselves and not have it available for other countries to have access to social media, but that or that's not what you're saying, that's not what I'm saying which okay so you're not saying by the firewall where social media is right now, no you're saying firewall to protect us from someone else coming through the system and really what I was saying and what happens if you go to the page? 19 of the national security strategy says it right there: we are going to create a secure 5g network nationwide;
In other words, we're going to be able to build a network unlike any network that's been built before and it's really about protecting individual data. that you have control of your data and no one else does and then you can figure out how to use it and that then we would take that and you know the network that we build and then we share it with our Democratic allies and partners if you build a network like this, a regime Totalitarian cannot control the population because they cannot prevent it, they do not know what they have with the information they have access to, they cannot see what they are saying, right? is what you can have in China, they can't stop you from having other information that maybe they don't want you to have because I can't see what you're doing and it really becomes a competitive advantage both from an economic point of view and also from a business point of view. social view, let me ask you this when you came out and you had the meeting and you talked about China the way you did well and you said this is what we have to worry about with this side and this is what what we are going to do there can be our biggest threat, they are our biggest threat and then here's 5g, what's really happening.
Did you immediately have a sense of who was for you and who was against your talking points? It's kind of like in this room if everyone suddenly says Tom Brady is the greatest of all time in five seconds. I know who's waiting for the Patriots and who likes him, right? Did you sit there and say oh wow, that guy crossed his arms? He is definitely not happy, he is curious, did you have that feeling? Yes, was it a political crossover on one side or was it that both sides were happy and said so? So let's get back to 5G, you know what I'm asking you?
I know exactly what you are asking once the decision was made to confront China. that was a process that was simply going to be executed. I didn't really need to focus on that. I focused on 5g. I focused on secure Internet when I started sharing because what I had done is I talked to network engineers and people who know. build networks when I started sharing the ideas we had come up with, if I had been more politically savvy at the time, I would have known exactly how to answer that question and would have said that anyone who had telecommunications in their portfolio was immediately against it.
It was because the industry economic was immediately against it, right, that was a clear sign that if I was paying attention at the time and really understood DC in a political way, I would do it again. He was a national security professional. He was a military man. I don't really get into politics, but in the same way that you see the influence of the industry on almost anything in DC, the industry, the telecommunications industry in particular, was once like that and somehow made its way out from government channels because those people who are in a telecommunications job in DC I have some relationship with the industry, that information came to light once it came out, the industry said aha and that's when I started my journey to get my document leaked and they asked me to leave national security. cam you came you know how sometimes you know if you say something you either don't know the consequences of saying something or you know and you say it anyway which one was it?
I'd say they're both fine, right? so some of them I didn't know and some of them I didn't know I didn't know the political situation on the ground but at the end of the day it was about preserving our republic it was about our Constitution it was about national security it's not about me it's never about For me it was the first time the first day when I took the oath and when I put on the uniform it's no longer about me it's about the Constitution it's about preserving the Republic if it's ever about me Then it's my time to go.
Do you think most people start out as statesmen like you and then when you get too close, you become a little contaminated depending on the environment you're in? Do you know what I am? Know? what I'm saying right, you understand me, most people I see original like you, I really want to make an impact, I really want to do this, these are mental statements, correct, whatever or like, we have a chance to make 10 million a year or 15 million. here 22 million and we can have control here we can have more influence here do you think the changes are beginning where if you want to rise you need to go out a little and accept the reality of politics?
I could do it well, so I see myself as an entrepreneur and when you take someone who is an entrepreneur and who really believes in the oath that he has taken and then you put him in a bureaucracy where he is not you, I had when I went to China, I took a year at the language institute, two years I lived in China, that's three years. I told the air force I would give them back three for one, so that added 10 years to my commitment and as time went on, and as I moved up the ranks and would move, I would say every year I would get a commitment of two years, so if you move every year and get a two-year commitment, you will never have the opportunity to leave, so I am an entrepreneur.
I'm living in a bureaucracy but I can't leave. I do not have any other option. I have to stay, so I can say, "You know, be mad about that." I'm banging my head against the wall because you know things have to change. do or I can just learn to live within it and try to push the change as deep as I can while I'm there. I asked this question for a reason, like you know you listen to Joe Biden, he's been in the world in the pilot political world for a long time, right, okay, did he start it?
You know you have to play all these political games you have to play or it was a good cause and you look at Mitch McConnell, two names you talk about. Behind your back, the Republican was a Democrat and they both have some ties to China, right, Mitch McConnell, 1993. I think he married his wife, whose father is a very powerful businessman. I don't know if you want to tell the entrepreneur who owns a business. and they're connected to the communist regime and then on the other side, Joe Biden, his son Hunter, is all over the news, everyone hears about all the problems with what happened there.
I ask again, this is not something that is favorable to Democrats and they don't like. China or wanting to support China or this is not just Republicans not liking or not liking China, this is purely both sides in what you're seeing okay and when you dug deeper you said, "Oh my gosh, no I did it". I don't know that the Biden family was like that or the McConnells, was it one of those things where the more and more research you did, the more things like this are bigger than you thought? Did you have one of those moments?
The only moment I had was when I received the report in the fall of 2014 that was from a major audit firm and when I looked when I opened that report and I realized you know a lot of the elements of that we used to attack a country using an air attack. I saw what was unfolding in front of my eyes using economics, finance and information, and you know, that was a moment that broke my head because until that moment I thought that the United States is the greatest nation in the world and we are impregnable we are the most powerful, you know, nothing could happen to us and that was a point where I realized that no, I mean, we could have aircraft carrier battle groups, F-35 nuclear submarines and all this. capacity and spend eight hundred billion dollars a year on defense, but if our society was basically being attacked at the work level at the societal level, then we had lost the ability to protect our nation in a globalized world driven by the Internet and from that moment on we simply I started I studied and read everything I could and talked to everyone I could, so because I had been at the Council on Foreign Relations, I had access to a lot of executives at financial companies and investment companies, so I started hanging around and talking. with you.
I know there are some of their research offices and they talk to people and try to understand what was happening in our country and how global business works how global finance worked how investing worked and what do you know if I ever stopped finding garbage, no, it's what I find every day, as you continue to peel back its layers, you realize that it runs through a society because it is based on this fundamental belief that openness will lead to democracy and that is the key to the power of China, the Chinese Communist Party, because when I believe that open duty would lead to democracy.
They said my opportunity exists because they are going to allow me to have access to their finances. Your trade. Your investment. Your immigration. Your means. His politics. The Internet Academy. I have access to everything you know. Think of Commodore Perry sailing. with the big flying fleet to Japan had to use weapons to get into Japan we just let the Chinese in and sometimes we made them pay sometimes we just gave it to them, it's kind of part of their philosophy, although if you think about the whole Confucius and the art of war is to fight without having a battle, the whole philosophythere you talk, which was brilliant when you talked in the book, but what did you learn from the McConnell family and what did you learn from Biden's connection to China?
I learned in the White House and this is really in the White House because when, before you go to the White House, you always hear these stories about you know it's the White House calling you, you meet people who like the stand -up or that you know how to do it. I help them, so I'm in the White House and I'm working with think tanks and law firms trying to expose first of all what the Chinese were doing, but second of all come up with credible policy options that we could implement that would get You know that would stop them from taking advantage of our population and over and over again they say I'm sorry, I can't help you.
I don't want to upset my Chinese financiers or my Chinese clients. My partners, don't you know, are not comfortable with us because we have a lot of shipping business in China and I say, Calling from the White House and our principals: Would this be the answer? The main think tanks and the main law firms in the country. They tell me I can't help you, so you know, I already knew that. So when you really understand, okay, if they don't even help the White House, then we have a big, serious problem, what did you learn about McConnell and the Biden family?
Well, then I say they are the only ones I know. It's named in the book and the reason I did it is because everything is in plain sight. You can read the sources. A report from the New York Times. The Wall Street Journal reports that Biden's son went with him on Air Force Two to China ten days later. a member of the board of directors of the hedge fund Bo High Harvest, which is a billion and a half dollar hedge fund McConnell, already talked about his family, his father-in-law knows John Ziemann, the former president of the Chinese Communist Party and his sister-in-law.
He is on the board of directors of the Bank of China, okay, what influence would you say? It's there, they would say there is no influence, that just happened. Part of McConnell. Turns out it's my family relationships on Biden's side. He would say it was. My son, you really had nothing to do with me, although you were with him on Air Force Two, but that being said, it's not about quid pro quo, it's about adopting chicheme pings' worldview and his worldview, in the one that Davos says many times. Is globalization good? You know, we should continue to have open markets, we should continue to have open systems so that we can all do well together as a global community, that's essentially what it is.
I'm paraphrasing what Xi Jinping says, but that's not what he says. He believes it because if you read the documents of the Chinese Communist Party, such as document number nine, which have left the country and have been translated, you realize that they repudiate every element, for example, of the Atlantic Charger, which is good . page template for international order signed by FDR in Winston Churchill eight paragraphs one page democratic principles free trade rule of law and self-determination that's all that in a nutshell that tells you about what the UN is WTO Bretton Woods all that is about the Chinese communists The party doesn't believe in any of them, so when he goes to Davos, Xi Jinping goes to Davos and says we need to stay open for business, not that we need to stay open for business because democracy, rights humans, civil liberty and government. of the law are great because if they remain open for business I can ensure that we have access to science, technology, innovation in capital and talent, so let me ask this question.
For me, I used to be in business with a guy who, behind closed doors, did this. a boy always looked at him and talked to him he was always afraid of a boy and he couldn't stand that the other boy was working but he was afraid of him why are you afraid of that boy you know and me? He always asked her trying to figure out why you're afraid of this guy. Why are you afraid of this guy? Finally, a year and a half later I found out what it was, so he was doing some business stuff behind closed doors and it was Not cool, it was a little more than cool, you know, breaking the law and he finally got caught, but under the Mesa paid him twenty-five thousand dollars a month in cash, not 1099, not w2, which 25 in cash is 50 thousand between the right before taxes. the same as $600,000 of your income, so one day he gets angry and you know he tells one of my competitors and that comes to me and I find out about it, now it makes sense why he's afraid of him, but then when he stopped paying $25,000 Cash, the other guy told everyone about his business and lost it anyway, so to me, that's how I see it and I want to get your perspective to see how you see the MBA situation right now and what's going on. going.
LeBron, true or not, just LeBron, there was Maury Maury, right, the general manager of Houston, yeah, he makes a comment on YouTube, you know what's going on there and then they're upset about canceling preseason golf games and, of course Suddenly, Houston's owner makes his comments and then, from there, Adam Silver says: I support freedom of speech. Steve Kerr didn't want to say anything because he had no information about the situation at that time. Popovich said a few words and then LeBron. He says maybe he was wrong, right, he would have said what he shouldn't have said, so to me I see it's okay, why did this happen?
I want to know your opinion, but why are they doing this? Well, why would they be doing this? It's political to me, it's not political to me, there are one and a half billion moviegoers there, the same reason America is trying to make movies there and you're making rock movies that make six hundred million dollars here giving love to China instead of just doing Actually, to me it's another market, that's quite honest because it's a money game, right, it's not a political game or anything like that. We can sell more shoes to one and a half billion people.
We can sell them more media. We can go out and you know. make the games go there instead of making 40 million a year, we make fifty million right 60 million a year in a situation like this before I asked you for LeBron's opinion, but in a situation like this, do you process it from the point of view of Well, maybe Mitch has some business and he's doing it out of respect for his wife, he's just given China respect and maybe Biden's son has some respect and he's a son you know, you don't have fifty children, you had a partner. sons, it's blood, he is just trying to protect his son to do what he is doing, do you think that is acceptable reasoning to allow them to do what they are doing or should it be America first because of the responsibilities you have and then your children? wife, your family, how do you process that?
Well, let me put it this way and this was actually something I had said to my wife before the 2016 election. You were in the military now, right? If I had any of the relationships I just talked about there. There was no way I could have a security clearance. It wouldn't happen. I couldn't get it through the system. He wouldn't grant me top secret security. If you could, let me clarify if you are Mitch McConnell or Joe Biden. Is that a relationship? I couldn't get the security clearance, you're right, yes, absolutely, these are just facts, so if I had, if I would've taken my personal email or my professor's email, my work email, and basically removed it everything and put it, you know a server and it had a classified message, what do you think would happen to me?
You're fired, you know, you're Marshall, yeah, or Marshall was absolutely fired. I don't love you well, no, there isn't. I doubt it, for sure, and when you see this kind of thing, I know that you know that whoever is chosen as chief has a responsibility there, which is the chief diplomat, the chief law enforcement officer, the commander in chief. So how can that person have the kind of relationships that I, as a military member, can have a security clearance or do the kind of things that would get me fired or court-martialed for? So, you know, he's pretty black and white. from me when you're the commander in chief and you demand that the people who work for you take an oath and work for you as the CEO, particularly commander in chief, because commander of a military force is very different from being the top executive in a company is a completely different kind of authority over someone you know, the authority to not only fire him but also imprison him, because that is court-martial authority and you nevertheless do the things you say or have to make them happen. we can't do, then you've created a problem and this is pervasive in our system, that our politicians can have the kind of relationships that we can't even allow our military members to have security clearances, let's leave that aside, okay?
We'll put that aside now that the president of the United States says that there is a non-market economy that we basically let into the WTO in 2001 and they broke every rule in the book and they continued to do so and they're not going to stop, so we know what we're going to do, we're going to treat them like we did before we went to w2 before we went to the WTO, they had to vote on most favored nation status every year, once that stopped corporate money started flowing Foreign investment direct started coming to China and it grew like crazy, taking seventy thousand factories and 3.4 million manufacturing jobs, so the President of the United States says, "Okay, they clearly have no intention of following the rules that we ". we're going to put tariffs because that's what we had before they started, we started and we let them in, we're going to do the exact same thing and then you have Joe Biden and you have Mitch McConnell saying it's a bad idea, now he has that relationship with Do those relationships contribute to that or is it just because they think I don't know the answer, but I guarantee that any counterintelligence officer who questioned me asked me why I made that decision, they would have reason to say that you know.
You're not trustworthy, you didn't report that you know you are, your relative was letting you know millions of dollars from the Chinese or you didn't report that you have millions of dollars from the Chinese, so I'm not saying there's quid pro quo there, but there is enough. I don't like tariffs. I have adopted Xi Jinping's worldview. This is actually detrimental to the United States. I'll let other people figure it out. That's not for me to find out, but it's for me to say that if I had done it on active duty in the military, or I wouldn't have a security clearance, that I have been court-martialed, so let me ask you. this is the same argument, here you have two different communities, okay, you have those who have power and political influence, let's say McConnell Biden and many other names who support China and say, "take it easy, there is an ally right there. "I think you went to the Department." of Commerce and they said that China is not the adversary, they are our friends, we cooperate with them, these were the words that you wrote in your book, okay, on the one hand you have the political people who should not be doing this because they do have an interest with your kids, wife, whatever, okay, then the other side is the investors, the business owners, the hedge fund people, the entrepreneurs, the people who made their money in America, but they want to make sure that China still has the ability to do business because they lose money, right?
In short, do you think their motives are okay because it's purely money and they want to protect their investments for themselves, their clients, their businesses and these two are completely different ways of being accountable? That's the system we built correctly. Yes, I know exactly. what you're asking, that's the system we built and therefore you can't criticize business owners because they are our system, it says you owe fiduciary responsibility to the shareholder, that's your job and by the way, they can sue you or sue you. charges for not doing your job, not fulfilling your fiduciary responsibilities, so you could argue that if you're not cooperating with the Chinese Communist Party, you're actually hurting your company, okay, there you go, so you can't criticize.
So what you can criticize are the government policies that allowed the behavior to happen in the first place and I'll give you an example of level 1 versus level 3 assets that I talked about in the book China Has Currency Without Compromise. strict capital controls since 2015, you can't take money out of the country only in special circumstances and only depending on the business you are doing, so we have many corporations that have billions of dollars there that they carry. in their financial statements, those are level one assets, meaning like cash in the bank here, but you can't get it, but if you're showing profits and it's going to be cashed in the bank in China, then how do you get compensated?
As an executive or on a board of directors of that company, you're probably compensated based on the money you make in China, but shareholders can never see that money because you have strict capital controls in a non-convertible currency, okay? We have createdan incentive system based solely on our face B accounting standards and the Securities Exchange Commission can change this. The Treasury Department could change this and say no, if it's in China, it's a non-convertible currency, strict capital controls, they can't get the money. Find out that it's a level three asset and therefore every corporation needs to do a restatement, what would that say now?
CEOs wouldn't want to invest in China because it wouldn't count. Your conversation now, the board of directors would not advise the CEO. that they should invest in China because it would not be necessary for compensation we built a system that incentivizes behavior for the destruction of the country that is not the fault of the business community that is the fault of the government great point so it is essentially a company Who runs an organization sales has a compensation structure that produces bad behavior. It's not the seller's fault, it's the end. It's the organization's fault for producing a compensation structure the way he did.
What you are saying is a complete restructuring of our agreements and arrangements with China. You're talking about having to change a lot of things so we can move forward. You're not just saying a few. Get out here, but I'm not saying we're doing something that's inappropriate. I'm just saying let's follow the rules, for example, in correct investments, let's break the rules for everyone. China, everyone, everyone, is exactly right. So they're not going to follow the rules at that time, for example, so we're going to invest, so right now we have the MSCI All World Index that went from zero to five percent to 20 percent weighting and the Chinese stocks, Well, Chinese companies.
They come here, register their shares and are listed on some of our exchanges, but we go with those that are not listed, the registered ones, which are a trillion dollars. They have won with our capital markets. There are no auditing or transparency requirements unlike anything an American company has to do. go right so a Chinese company can come in here and register and list on our Stock Exchange and get access to our retirement funds. That's what MSCI MSCI all World Index is followed by all the institutional investors and university endowments so our retirement funds are sent to China to pay for investments so we have no idea what they have because they don't have the same auditing and transparency requirements as a unit of a US company.
That's a policy we have now so that China can register. and list your stocks on our exchanges and our retirement investment officers can send money to China and they don't have to correspond to the same rules that American companies have, so make Chinese companies correspond to exactly the same rules that they have American companies. - and I'll tell you why they won't, because sending audit data is a violation of national security in China; In other words, it is treason for you to send the audit information of a Chinese company to the US, let me ask you if you do that.
Do you see any possibility of reaching an agreement with all these technicalities? This is not a small thing, so, or you know, the Chinese have already decided to decouple, it is not about us decoupling, it is about the Chinese Communist Party maintaining control over their society and To maintain control over their society, they need to maintain control over the state-owned enterprise system they built, which says we're not going to buy under US laws about sending it over audit and transparency requirements if they force us to. That's how hard we go to how China took power while America's

elite

slept

well, it's too big a monster, right?
I know you talked about that at the end of the book, but if you're saying that monsters aren't too big to control, those are the four points you talked about at the end of the book, let's get to the end of the interview with that. I want to get into that right now because we'll get to that as we look at it. Okay, so we just talk about business, what responsibilities do you have, etc., and we talk about politics, what are your views on how MBA is being handled? the bullying from China saying, hey, we're not going to show any of the preseason games in China, do you know what an ECMO machine is?
No, an ECMO machine is a machine used to keep the body alive when the heart and lungs fail, okay? It takes blood out of the system, oxygenates it, and returns blood. I actually met someone who had been hooked up to one of those things, it's not fun when you're dying and hooked up to an ECMO machine, Chyna, yeah Say you're a dissident, your Office, your Falun Gong, you're a Christian, you're a Muslim and they sentence you to say seven years in prison for being a religious follower that you know and do not stop, they will write your blood does not sequence your DNA and they will do an ultrasound of your organs and you will enter a list of matches if that match arises they will connect you to a ECMO machine connect your body to an ECMO machine they will give you an injection to paralyze you and they will have a surgeon come and remove your organs, put them in someone who has come for hundreds of thousands of dollars to buy your organs and put them in you because they need a heart, a liver or two kidneys. or whatever and when they have removed all the organs that they can use, they will throw the body in the incinerator, so when we do things like equate that type of behavior with, let's say, the social challenges that we have in the United States, then it then shows a fundamentally misunderstanding the difference between a democracy and a totalitarian regime and that is what I find so irritating about what the NBA is doing because that type of behavior that is the type of behavior that Hitler was doing that is the type of Behavior that existed in Stalin's Soviet Union, that is the kind of behavior the Chinese Communist Party is doing today.
You can look it up in the UK court on forced organ harvesting from prisoners of conscience. Summary reports, your final reports are coming. They have interviewed hundreds. To people this is happening and yet we equate our social challenges here in the United States with that type of behavior in China. I think the challenge of the NBA is not understanding and understanding who they validate themselves with, so let's take away the fiduciary responsibility that you know, the NBA commissioner has to not anger the Chinese Communist Party because the NBA makes a lot of money there, let's take it away, Let's say you're an American and a lot of Americans died fighting to stop the kind of things that are happening. right now in communist-controlled China, so businessmen understand it.
American, I can't for the life of me understand it. You know, the only reason is because they do a good job of obfuscating and hiding what they do, and that's why. They have titled the book of stealth warfare and we have done a very poor job of opening our eyes and the reason we have done a poor job of opening our eyes is because we are being compensated, welcome to look the other way. all right, let's say I look at this and you said this in I'm going to be a person. I'm like, okay, what are you talking about?
I really don't know, I get it, but everyone has dirt on their hands, America does. look at what America did to Japan, look at what America did to Japan, so you know, that's the right argument, so everyone's done some things, how many of us do this? How many times have we killed people so that we have blood on our hands and someone to be Seeing this, we're just trying to do business, you know, we're just trying to make sure we maintain a relationship with them because we want those 1.5 billion eyes , that's what we're trying to do.
We saw what happened to Berkeley when I went to the Olympics and from there Kobe is the identity of the Olympics after meeting Houston center Yao Ming and now LeBron is growing up, all these guys are getting great exposure. What happens to us wanted to keep our relationship with China solid. so as not to create any kind of problem between us, let's let the politicians take care of that, they are the basketball players who are just trying to play there and entertain that audience as well, yeah, and I would say it's not surprising because the people were doing it for Hitler and When those army soldiers walked into Dachau and saw what the hell was going on there, you know, I would have hated it if it was one of those guys who saw that to see that you know what can be done to people and you know I don't know.
I know what else to say about yeah, the horror of this, that, that, we can sit here and basically say, you know that's not my D, that's not my deal. I'm going to get my compensation agreement. I look, I get that I get the other thing where people were like, well, you know America is just as bad as everyone else, that's fine, but you know it's not. I can't see it for myself, it just doesn't make sense to me, it did. I don't believe it. or whatever makes sense to me I just don't like being harassed.
I have never been a fan of stalkers in my entire life. I've never liked stalkers and I've never liked games and if you let a stalker do it constantly. intimidates you and you walk on eggshells with the next moves you make, you will always walk on eggshells because officially they know they scared you and therefore the next time you do something it gets deeper and deeper, almost comes to history. the Roy Jones guy who worked at Marriott, right, I think his name is Roy Jones because like the boxer, he's working at Marriott and if you can explain what happened to the story when they liked the tweets, yeah, worked on social media.
Marriott corporation department you like to tweet about Tibet, you were from a Tibetan dissident group, you didn't know anything about Tibet, you didn't know anything about China, you just saw that someone knew. He gave Marriott a shoutout and said he liked the tweet. The Shanghai Tourism Bureau found out. The Chinese called Marriott corporations, they deal with this person and apologize, they fired him and apologized. The NBA situation is no different, where Maury was almost fired. this is and by the way, this is happening, he happened to Mercedes-Benz, is having Tiffany's, you know, it's a Cathay Pacific.
I don't know if you remember that the CEO resigned rather than reveal the names of the people who were working. For Cathay, we go with the people of Hong Kong in protesting, and by the way, where are the people of Hong Kong protesting against being extradited to a country that could basically put them on a donor list? There really is a fundamental difference, there is a big difference in the type of country that you live in, where you know we live today, where the NBA players live and the country that is China, and the problem is and there is a good article by opinion. by Li Yuan who's who of China in the New York Times recently talking about what it's like to live in China and not understand the world you live in because of the indoctrination and control over your way of thinking when you go there.
You would think that everyone is happy, well, they are happy because they have too little access to anything to know anything else. Now this guy Roy Jones from Marriott got caught because the government is watching every move we make on social media or is it the culture because I was in the UK a few months ago and I sat down with a couple of people saying in the UK we used to be people who protected our nation, now the government has taught people to become spies and everyone betrays each other or is it China's culture of telling each other and saying look what he's doing, look what he's doing. doing, what's more, they know a whole massive community around the world that is still monitoring China or is actually the government's partner, but I am aware that they have a large number of monitoring, so it is powerful, but also they have their citizens who are taught, you know this is an affront to China, you know the people of Hong Kong don't really want peace there, they are like the protesters or No, they are like the 9/11 terrorists.
What is the biggest difference between the way business is done in China and the way business is done in the US? And this is what I mean by this. I don't mean start a business. in China and since 2015-2016 I can't make profit. I'm not talking about that. I am talking about I am a Chinese citizen. I live in China. I want to start a business and compete in a market there. What is the difference? between me competing in China and the kind of ways I'm controlled versus me competing in America oh that's easy there you can do whatever you want in China in China it literally means whatever you have to do to get ahead is fair game as long as you don't challenge the Communist Party, whatever, they rob you, there's no trick, nothing, I mean, seriously, seriously, not against each other, yes, against each other, it's the most ruthless, You know, you know, in many ways, it's the most capitalist. system exists, I think there is little regulation, there is no regulation, that is why you have the challenges that you have regarding fentanyl and other things because you know that ifyou are making profits and the laws are not causing problems for the Chinese Communist Party.
Whatever you want, you want to have a business, your competitor has a patented formula for something, find the guy who has a patented formula, hire him and bring him in and hire Minh and you can do it, now he's the guy who can. sue you, but you know this is a type of behavior that happens all the time there, if there are things like patents, they're like I can just steal your idea. No, you can't sue me. You know there is a two-year patent. that no one can use and you have the right to go and publish it first or I will come and steal it, you can't do anything about it, you can't take me to court, so they have patents, okay, and you can sue. and sometimes you can even win, but in the end you know what the government is looking for and watching, and particularly it's in industries that they care about, like 5g, right?
They are not really focused on some industries. but they focus on, for example, made in 2020, made in China, made in China, 2025 really eliminates ten industries, if it's one that they focus on, then they'll look at that competition and then they'll incentivize those that are starting to come in to the top, but if you are part of the Chinese Communist Party, you know the family of leaders, then you will have incentives for even more incentives, in another you will have more moments for yourself. We'll have more there, is that typical old school politics? If you want to be rich, first get into politics, you have enough influence and then start, we can't just get into politics, you can't know how you have it.
You know, even Xi Jinping applied to go to the Chinese Communist Party five or six times before they finally accepted him, it's like a club, right? And once you're in, you give them to the club, you know you have to do it. prove your loyalty to the party, I got it, I will continue to apply it, no, I mean, it's very similar, you can just go, it's very similar to someone with the money to be a made man, you have to do everything you have oil for them and then they present to you the reason why they have given so much power to Xi Jinping, by the way, because he is probably the most connected to what the Chinese Communist Party believes among all of them, as if you were saying who is the most communist in the world.
The Chinese Communist Party, Xi Jinping, is that guy and that's the only reason they lose all power. How powerful is your economy right now? How much control do they have? What areas are taking it? I know eighty percent of AC, you know? When you look at these numbers here, what are some of the statistics that you know about how powerful China has become? book from 2011 2013 they poured more concrete in those two years and we did an entire 20th century, that is very important for you to say this once again they did more in two years of pouring concrete I remember the statistic that we did in 114 years yes it is a statement factual factual statement I'm going to find it and let's say it because if that's true two years versus one hundred and fourteen, what is that all about when you talk about they are building 9,220 cities with the average population is five to ten million and one of the cities is has become Silicon Valley, it's like being by a lake, but they don't give the name of what the city will be called and it has 550 square feet of office space where 95% is not an occupant and they are willing to sell it for cheap and rent it for little money.
That's really part of the strategy. If you want to keep people employed and you have a model and you face a financial challenge, then you come back. For the model it's like it's working, don't leave it, the problem you run into is whether you can get the raw materials in energy and food to sustain that and what you've needed to do it. is to get US dollars and we have allowed them through our trading relationship with them to do that, you know, recently with the tariffs that they would have, they have had to turn to the capital markets and go through MSC.
I get money from mm- Mmm, from our retirement funds, but for the most part it keeps people employed and that, by the way, is also why the belt and the writing on it should have existed. It's not just an opportunity to actually gain control of the Eurasian landmass, it's also a capability. offload some of their spare capacity to employ the Chinese, you know, they catch most of the world's frozen fish, they export 50% of their catch, and there are a million people employed in the frozen fish industries, so It's all about keeping people. They have jobs and although they dominate these industries it is not simply because they want to dominate the industry, but because they want to maintain legitimate assets.
The way you maintain legitimacy is to keep people employed. 9,220 cities with a population of five to ten million, that's crazy. For me, well, to be able to build something like that, think about if you're going to build a city, although the best way to build a city is to build it in a totally green, green field, if you're building one. city ​​or if you're increasing the size of a city, let's say like Shanghai, it's a lot more expensive than this, going out in the middle of a field and building a city, you don't have to do everything you don't have. tear down and rebuild and go through all the things used to build a city and I think if you think about how they financed it with our recovery money, a lot of the loans came from us, the banks with recovery money and not that the price of If those things collapse as mentioned in the book, you now have the ability to move the additional three or four hundred million people who are in the countryside to those cities.
I mean, that's very, that's a Very, that's a brilliant formula, absolutely, but what is the reasoning behind not allowing you to foreclose on your house? If you have a hundred thousand dollar loan on your house, you are late. Four thousand dollars, they don't foreclose on the house, they just add to it. two four thousand dollars that you're behind on the loans $104,000 is that actually the banking so it's brilliant it's really what they yeah, it's brilliant you mean it that's a real real methodology for that right, you understand? that part so you got a hundred thousand dollar loan I'm going through a crisis Missing payments on a couple I'm still staying in the house they just add it to the loan in the oh you're not even on them you probably have four or five of these things, do you think it's a good formula?
Although it is a good formula for a wife or anyone else to use well, any other banking system, but wouldn't you have strict capital controls? National currency. You essentially have a closed financial system. These banks. they can't get their money out so you can keep doing it, you're doing it, that's just brilliant, yeah, so if we did that, if we were doing that, yeah those would get out of this country, well let me ask you, do you know how it works all? The saying goes that if you've got someone coming up and they're competing with you, you know, hit them while they're small, don't let them get too big, right?
It's too late. Well, what I mean is beat him, because okay, let's go. transition to five G's, let's talk about five G's because you know all this when I think Trump tweeted something in 2014 and said remember China is not our friend or our ally and it got like 300 retweets, it wasn't a big thing. tweeted this in 2014 or 2015 and all of a sudden you know everyone in the news is Tom l5g and before that day we were talking about it all of a sudden hey we became the leader on June 5th like 5g someone started looking 5g ok 1g 2g 3G 1g is the normal phone in the past to G is whatever 3G is the iPhone you know and then 4G is the latest and now 5g will change a game and most people move to 5G it's just a faster phone, because that's what initially, if we've always seen the G tied to a phone, my God, now I can download a movie in 3.6 seconds on Netflix, a 2-hour movie where before it was three minutes or six minutes, whatever.
Just when you think about 5g, what do you think about 5g and the capabilities and what it can really do to whoever has access to it? That's a good question, so if we go back to 2007 and when the iPhone came out, the 7, 2007, the top 5 in market cap were 80 General Electric Microsoft ExxonMobil and shell mm-hmm right, the phone came out in 2007. We had a 3G network, it's not a very good one, it's not a very good experience for the G network, by the way. You are the second country in the world to build a 4G network. Now you've got something right, so when Steve Ballmer was still laughing at Steve Jobs, he said we don't need one of those when you took the platform that was the iPhone and married it to the 4G network, which was the pipeline for data and it was a pipeline.
Fast enough, you can now create the business model application services that in ten years led to the top five in market capitalization: Facebook, Amazon, Netflix, Google and Microsoft. So the Chinese see this and they like, uh, the platform and the pipeline, so the smartphone, this iPhone, you know which one was first, then Android, so Apple and the ant Apple and Google dominate the mobile platform, application services and business models. That economics is based on now look at that iPhone, it's a tightly integrated hardware, software, closed wall system, like in Steve Jobs, he liked it and the data was encrypted, why was the data encrypted?
Why did San Bernardino happen? Because apples in the American company, you know what you want? privacy, they encrypt the phone so now you have the platform and android also tuned to encrypt their platform so both are encrypted correctly so private devices take away the cloud just look at the devices so it's meant to be a private device, why? It's an American product, fast forward, you know, to 2009, China starts looking and saying okay, we want to dominate the next level, it's not just a technology, we want the application services and the business models to be Chinese companies and , therefore the weight becomes hundreds. of billions of dollars to develop 5g and ZTE, but then you have Baidu Alibaba and 0.10 dollars, so they are behind the Chinese firewall, they are protected, you can have the fangs there, it's just the bats that control the economy electronics within China and then you start at the same time you're developing 5g directly on the platform and I'll get to that in a second, but you're also developing Baidu Alibaba at $0.10 so now when you come in and you're starting to see the emergence of the 5g world in China, so you walk into a restaurant after you've ordered your food and a camera catches you and you say, David, welcome, here's your food, so you're starting to get an idea of ​​what a world is 5g. what is it and what is a 5g world the platform is the network so this is mobile computing paired with the 5g pipeline is computing and networks combined on the same platform so this disappears, you walk out your door and say super, you don't get your phone on and you say I want to know where you say the uber camera captures your face or a microphone captures, you enter, that's what 5g is, that's what 5g is and then the uber appears, the uber there is a camera in the car that sees you It knows who you are, it doesn't have to ask you your name, you come in and go wherever you want, you go out and do what you want, so in this world, in the 4G world, this is a platform, it's yours, you don't want to be built , you don't want to be part of all that data, member that we just talked about, how do you influence society?
All that data is available about what you're doing, just don't carry one. Of these rights, you simply opt out of a 5G world, you cannot opt ​​out of who owns the data. It's possible to say that you rent the data here that you own if you get Google services, you don't own that data, but in the five-year rule not only can you not opt ​​out because it's built around the city it's no longer on your phone not only can you not opt ​​out you don't know who owns the data everything you do can be seen and for all people by 2022 there will be two cameras for each person there will be two people for each camera in China by 2022 they have a billion at the moment.
I have a billion cameras in China with artificial intelligence for facial recognition, so this is all being built right now in China and who is helping them do it Microsoft Google, right? All these companies that want to implement this world in our country, so Baidu Alibaba and ten cents, that's where the world is going, going since 2007 18 tge and at Microsoft to the fangs of bats, who owns the pipes ? As a b2 type, the first thing I look at in the country is who is where the telecommunications are, you have to eliminate that number one, but if instead of eliminating it you own or control it, the soap.
Huawei builds the pipelines, then, because you're behind the Great Firewall, you built the application services and the business models of the 5g world, and like I said, you're already starting to see that you know where your facial recognition is built in. to your interaction when you go to a restaurant when you go to a store when you go to a bank you know that it's all about you know that thedevice is connected and then as you build the network those proliferate so the 4G network 10,000 devices per square mile the 5g network three million devices per square mile you're not going to carry 12 smartphones you may not even carry a smartphone and you are cousin to three million 10,000 three, that's what 5g does, the connectivity explodes properly, so that it allows you to place devices literally everywhere that can make your life more convenient or can I track you there is a bicycle in DC called mo bike have you seen these things?
They are silver and orange take care of it next time you are in DC there is a silver one on yours called a mo bike they had it when I went in 2016 when I arrived in Beijing you take your phone and by the way I took my I took a phone I wrote a phone that I threw away when I arrived I came home and said who threw it, what do I do? to load all the apps a Chinese person has so he can understand what they do. You never have to carry a wallet, you never have to carry a key, everything is done on your phone, you can pay anyone anywhere for anything and they do it. 900 people are on WeChat and they spend 90% of their time on the app doing ordinary things.
Line tickets, buying food, whatever you want, you can have anything, not 100 people or nine hundred million nine hundred million people. Well, let me explain. How effective is what they built? I have one of the guys working for me on one of these mobiles, now the mobike is just parked there on the street with a lock, you go where you press a QR code on your phone, it unlocks the bike you get on, the you ride and lock the bike, okay, where does that data go? They know it's you. in that back part you went to locations okay or you went to a location to make the data available so I have one of my guys who gets on a mobile BI trip somewhere he has his iPad in the basket , gets off the bike, comes back to the embassy and realizes that I forgot my iPad goes to the regional Security office and says I forgot my iPad on my bike calls a local Public Security Office and those guys They call the guy who has his iPad on his cell phone and say, can you? bringing the iPad back to the embassy that's how Beijing is wired right now, so if I'm by the way, I heard about self-regulating brake pads, that's actually the case, like your brake pads are fixing themselves. everything is there, so it's there, there's very high speed, low latency stuff, like if you need a surgeon in Dallas to perform surgery on someone who's 60 miles away, he can do it from his office in Dallas and you can have a robot that you know in 60 miles away doing the surgery, it's called Tactile Internet that comes, which is part of this fabric, in addition to this kind of low-power thing that you're talking about, that just sends a sign, hey, someone passed by. in this location or I need to change a brake pad, all of that is built into the 5g network, so it really becomes a network of machines, not a network of people, but the most important thing is that there are terabytes and terabytes of data that is created about you and you have no control over it and the people that do have control are the big technology companies and you know this more and more because 5g not only builds a network, but the 3gpp standards, which is the body of So not only have the standards been dominated by China, the underlying patents for 5g technology have been dominated by China, so even if you're not building Huawei, you're still incorporating Chinese technology into your network, so you have Baidu Alibaba $0.10 Huawei. you have the technology and you have the application services and business models you have everything you need so you used to have Facebook Amazon Netflix Google dominant as those other companies become dominant because they have created the 5g world now you will see the ability to China has control literally everywhere, so why would we want that technology? why would we want that technology wisely?
Precisely what is what was the fight over Huawei, but I went a step further, I mean, even if you're building Ericsson Nokia. or Samsung because China dominates the standards in the technology, you are still incorporating a lot of their technology into your network, so instead of doing that, build a military grade network and implement that so that people give them access to it type of protections that we give access to our military because we don't want them to spy on their day, so for me I see it from this point of view because now I will give the other side of the argument.
I'm curious. I know that. You will say it because you know all about Made in China 2025 and you know that you read the article and you look at the statistics and you see the joy of where the South Korean operating system is. I think it's true, it's Samsung. is from South Korea, the Apple iPhone is ours and then you have Wow and ZT, all these guys are from TZ. I think it is correct to say that what is ZT, ZT and ZT is what is kind, ZT is unlimited, Bradley Cooper, my brain. it would be a completely different place, so you have Wow, from China they are making this phone well, it's okay on the 5g site, if I'm looking at this, they are saying that China will be ready to roll out 5g 2020 and everywhere else. we won't be ready until 2025 China is ready by 2020 we won't be ready until 2025 how much market penetration can China achieve by having access to 5g five years before us to get it going versus us not having Acts because Qualcomm, you all talk? for them now we won't be ready until 2025 we won't be ready until the 25th how much negative impact will the fact that they are starting in 2020 and most of us until 2025 have on countries outside of China?
I think they've signed up in something like 90 countries to deploy 57, but maybe it's not a country that, by the way, is moving towards more acceptance, except for the United States and Austria. Everyone else knows there are some doubts. Of course, there are some who say no, but you know that essentially they have the initiative. This is what an industrial strategy on China's part is. It's really about seeing the future and this is what I give them credit for, you know? In my book I call it a beautiful strategy because I think it's the most incredible, incredibly well thought out strategy I've ever seen and it will probably go down in history as one of the greats and it's smart that they discovered it. this, but even if we had it, we would use it, we probably wouldn't use it if even if we didn't have it, that's why I mean, I think I would be terrified if you knew how to use it and I think you know the The good thing we have is that our telecommunications here are loaded with debt and they say that anyway they are slow to implement 5G, but if we have it, let's say we have access to it, it's okay for voters to vote for it to be implemented because if you need two cameras for example, let's say that you also need that technology, it's not like the first day, we have it, hey, we have it, you know, let's have the server, we will use 5g, turn it on, it's a switch, there is a lot of development. so we are camera ready with all that technology to be created and they are saying there are some health threats as well, it may not even be health before you say it, but I mean our guys are there working with the Chinese . right now, building it right, they're designed, they're helping them design the algorithms, they're helping them design a lot of the technology because they've moved a lot of their design facilities there because there's a lot of data and you can go. to Baidu and tell them I just need tons of data to be able to run, you know, work on my algorithm, so you know it's not like they're not already working with the Chinese, you know our companies are working with them to build things. , TRUE?
I think one way to succeed, a negotiation with tariffs is a way to hope that they give you access to 5G, where I will not negotiate with you until you bring it up to us and help us speed up the process as well, or you already know that. Let's go back to what 5g is, it is beamforming antennas with software defined radios and software defined networks. We've been working with those things in the US military for years. We have the technology. We don't have to go to China. China. It doesn't necessarily have the best technology, it's just that we have all this technology that we haven't commercialized so we just have to turn around and bring it out ourselves, so why do you say we can't do it until 2025 because the companies that do it with the manufacturing equipment that we don't have anymore, we don't make any commercial equipment, we have companies that work with the Department of Defense, we don't have any to build for commercial telecommunications, you know, Ericsson and Nokia Samsung, they still build equipment, but again, like I said, they are partly nerdy about China, except Samsung, which retired the manufacturing of four devices three or four years ago, but not the manufacturing of equipment, you know, that's where everyone is so corrupt or not corrupt. but you know, they essentially have Chinese technology built into their systems.
I have a couple more questions here and we should wrap up. Next up is with Nixon. You know, a lot of times I really like the fact that you mentioned Nixon in the book with Kissinger. I know a lot of times people give Nixon credit for what he did with China, even Democrats, Republicans, independents, yeah, Nixon opened well and then there's a part that you talk about at the time. I think it was Mao, who is the leader of China at that time. moment and he's sitting with Kissinger and there's the interpreter who says hey, you know they're having a conversation and he says a certain phrase Emma the Baba and the interpreter, what was that all about?
Well, I think again, it goes to the The premise of the book is that there is obfuscation built into everything they do and even when you do negotiations with them, by the way, you say you come, you're looking at a document in English and then there's a translation translated into Chinese right next door. door right next to you are looking at both documents often what they will do is they will negotiate a document in English and then they will change the word in Chinese, so in many ways China uses that language that language barrier is almost like the first layer of encryption and , as you know, a lot of Americans really have no idea about the Chinese language, it's very difficult for them to get access to it, so it may actually be good for the Chinese because it allows them to obfuscate things and then what they'll do is transit , they will do translations in negotiations where they only use one word and sometimes our translators get it, sometimes they don't understand it. our translators don't understand, they don't understand, so in those statements what America is the leader, what he really meant is that America is the tyrant at his wedding because he looked at America like Hitler, it's similar to the regime of Hitler.
I think Look at it like that and then they'll say, well, we didn't mean to offend, maybe or you know maybe something else was intended. There is the interpreter trying to save the person making a statement. Is that so? Because that just means that the interpreters make the decision, you know how I feel, I've seen this before where the interpreter is trying to make a decision on how to interpret. I mean, I'm not one, well, that's not a clear interpretation, yeah, Mike Wallace goes to Iran and sits down with Khomeini and says, hey, you know a certain question that the Purdue interpreter says: I can't ask you that question. .
I think it's a fair question. Ask him the question and then when he asked the question, he got up and walked, so I've seen it. before too, so what are we going to see in the future? Because with China, you know, you talk about the fact that China came in and said, hey, we're going to help you get out of Africa, we're going to invest 60 to 80 billion dollars in Africa and you know they're deep into us. education system now out of our I think 1 million 20,000 students 32 and a half percent of the students something like 32 and a half percent of our students in the US.
The international students that are here are from China, so they are coming in, they go to NYU, they go to all these schools, they're essentially bringing a ton of business to these universities, are they going that deep? These different organizations where people are forced to support them because of the money and power they're bringing to the table and then all of a sudden they'll be the same Empire they were for five thousand years. Are you seeing that yes, that's it? Exactly, that's exactly what's happening and it really is, it's a smart strategy because we spend 800 billion dollars on defense, yeah, and you know, Greece basically makes a deal with the port of Piraeus, so we say, Well, you know, things aren't working out.
We're going to build a couple more carrier battle groups in Greece says: "I don't really care what I want is jobs for my people, what I want is money and that's what China comes in and says: "Okay, let them We will give money, very good. I mean, it's not very good, it's good to know that part because I just don't think these guys are going to slow down. I think that onceYou've met people who say, "oh, you know, I'm not really that competitive." you just know I just fear what they want to do good the most and I'm very you know I go to church on Sundays and you just know I love my family and we're just trying to be good citizens and then deep down they want to kick your ass , you know, that's great, did you study for the test?
No, not really, no, I mean, I don't know what it's going to be like, I'm a little bit worried, but we'll see and then again 90 years, wait a minute, you were studying for two weeks for this exam, right, I'm the one. I was at the party and you were the one studying for the exam anyway, the last one in your speedrun. I'll give you a name, give me the first thing that comes to mind and then we'll go from there Mitch McConnell I think it's an establishment, okay Dalai Lama, dissident leader Trump, not the establishment got it Ren Xing Phi PLA PLA okay again , excuse my pronunciation G Jim pink Communist Party okay Joe Biden's establishment John Bolton's establishment really okay Hunter Biden and the son of the establishment okay Jack Ma Pa Boris Johnson hmm I think the iiiiii I don't know if it's the establishment or I don't believe the jury verdicts, yeah, okay, Joe, the jury singled out Roger Robinson Jr., he's for even a freedom fighter, a freedom fighter, okay, and then the American Constitution is absolutely necessary. , absolutely necessary, absolutely necessary, you know, it's funny, you say the American Constitution is absolutely necessary, one of the things I was debating, another very, very established, billionaire, we were talking about China and one of the things that came up I said Believe it or not, I think one of the strengths that China has is that they do not have freedom of speech and what does that mean that they do not have freedom of the press.
I went online and looked at unemployment in China 3.4% 2.8 percent 3 percent 3.1 percent for the last 20 years, how do I know that? And then you look at real numbers like 15 20 percent, how do I know these numbers right? And we, you know, some may hate CNN, some may go to Fox, some turned it into MSNBC, some, hey, Drudge, some may hate these guys, but at least they come and go, which allows us to sort of . Watch them go back and forth and say, let me do my own research, so as much as the Free Press is annoying here, it's incredibly annoying for the opposite group.
I'm sure the people at MSNBC can't stand the people at Fox Vice. On the contrary, it's amazing how much that allows us to decipher all the propaganda that is being sold and I go out and say, "Okay, this is what I see, so I agree with you about the American Constitution, which is extremely necessary." that's why I'm here from Iran and we escaped there to come here final thoughts before I leave your thoughts I'm an investor I'm a businessman I'm an executive I'm watching what's happening with China I'm watching This I'm a little more educated. I'm about to order your book.
I have an order. I'm going to click a link to order and read the whole thing because obviously you can't get all 230 pages in two. -time to sit down, what should I think about and adapt or do certain audible things right now for my messenger to prepare me for the next 12 to 24? 60 months in the future. I would take the Constitution. I would take the Atlantic Charter. Read. those two things and I would think about it because my campaign is about making sure those things last and if they last and you continue to do business the way you're doing it, you're going to go bankrupt if you continue to do it.
In business the way you're going, you're going to go broke because you can ignore me, you can take my side or you can fight me, but my goal is to preserve the Constitution, the way we do it is to preserve the way the rules. of the path that we created and I'm about to read how to set those rules and if you're doing business and you're in, you're making money with the Chinese Communist Party and you think that's the way you're going to keep making money in the future if you think that this government is going to support that and I think you are one hundred percent wrong and I will do everything in my power to make sure that doesn't happen fairly enough if you ever thought about being a motivational speaker maybe it's not a good career. for your mother because it was a very direct statement and I love my communication style.
I wanted to tell you that I had Mario's ink. I receive you a gift. We will send you to China for a week's vacation so you can have a great time with us, it's on the house. It may turn into seven years, but we'll start with one week and it will stay as long as it lasts. like a four star hotel, please don't send me one of those two star hotels, those are really bad anyway, that being said, overall, thank you very much for coming. I also know that you came with your family or thank you for taking the time.
Coming out it was a pleasure to sit down and talk to you. Rate Tanner's books. There are books that I read when I have guests and I read them to get as much information as possible. If you could see the amount of Marx in this book. I couldn't put this book down, it's a must read for anyone planning to compete in a market. We'll put the link below to go to the book and any of the topics he talked about, little links, anything you might have. I mentioned that if we find your links, we'll put them below as well, but be sure to go to this book after I've said that.
Overall, thank you for coming. I appreciate it, thank you. Yes, this was great. You know, I really want to hear your thoughts. see where your opinion was on us and China or 5g before seeing this interview and after seeing Robert Spaulding with his latest book that came out on Stealth War, so tweet me Patrick with them and let me know how you process today , sit down because this was also very different for me to see from a guy who is inside national security presenting 5G and who has lived in China, a very different interview, so that's it and by the way, if you watch this interview, you might like the interview I do. with Ray Dalio also because it's about this topic as well as a video I made about 5g and Huawei which is obviously also about this topic and if you haven't subscribed to the channel click the button here to subscribe thanks for watching everyone take care goodbye

If you have any copyright issue, please Contact